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Rats fleeing a sinking ship

24

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    What exactly is it we should do? March day in day out? Rubbish.
    I've already said marching is pointless.

    Why wait for the government? They are the ones with the power to change, not the people. So that idea you have is completely false. It's a load of shít that this idea of the "peoples republic" belongs to the people. It doesn't it belongs to the arseholes sitting in the Dail on there extremely high wage. It's their republic, it's their country and they control everything. We as a people, cannot do shít, we are not even allowed to re-ellect a new governing body, because the current government will not allow it. I'm not getting 100K a year to run this country. Remember that.
    .
    If that's what you believe then you have given up on this country, your letting them walk all over you.

    As individuals we can achieve very little, if the towns around Ireland took it upon themselves to look after themselves they'd have more power like in other country's with local government. If people are hungry we have the land to feed them, we should have our farmers ignore the multinationals and start selling locally. If you need food, help the farmer. If OAPs are suffering it's up to their neighbours to help them, if roads and paths are damaged then just about every town in Ireland has the skilled workforce to do something about it. It's about time the people started helping themselves instead of waiting for the government to do something.

    We're waiting to be spoon feed instead of looking after ourselves.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,221 ✭✭✭✭ Hugo Curved Fibula


    No, absolutely not! You picked me up wrong and I could have made myself clearer. I just meant that it would be nice if they could come back to a better climate someday if they actually wanted to.
    But why should someone feel obliged, they shouldn't imo

    Ah ok sorry. Yea it would be nice, I don't want to stay away for ever. I tell people that I will never come back if I get the chance, but that's not how I truely feel. This is my home and it always will be.

    Graduates have very little options for them now. There's the WPP scheme which can be up to 9 months free work, which is a great scheme, but that lenght of time on 196 a week including travel and other expenses, is a bit of a joke.

    Emmigrate, it's a great thing for most, but it's also very difficult. People don't want to leave their friends, family and other halves behind them, but they also want work. I am planning on leaving every single thing behind me. It's a life change. I gotta get rid of my pets, I have to give up my hobbies (shooting), I have to leave my family, some of which are elderly and I am not sure if they will be alive when I come back, I am also leaving my girlfriend, just so I can have a job. Nothing more, just a god damned job. It's either that or I will sink into a deep depression and end my life.

    What else can a graduate do?

    All we want to do is work...


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,368 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    ScumLord wrote: »
    we should have our farmers ignore the multinationals and start selling locally

    And they should also say this whilst doing so:

    "Oh, look at me! I'm making people happy! I'm the Magical Man from Happy-Land, in a gumdrop house on Lollipop Lane!"


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,689 ✭✭✭✭OutlawPete


    The-Rigger wrote: »
    I'm not losing sleep over anyone leaving. I don't care. Good luck to them.

    I agree.

    Especially when the captain of our ship is below deck blowing holes in the bottom with a fucking shotgun and yet still inviting people from other ships to come aboard cause there is plenty of room.

    Nah, I say good luck to them too.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 711 ✭✭✭Dr_Phil


    If I chose to go to another country to find work, I am considered a traitor? I am abandoning my country, community, family and friends? Fcuk that, I am not sitting on my hole waiting for work to land on my lap, nore am I going to sit around this kip to wait for the government to act on the job crisis and do their fcuking jobs. I'm out of here as soon as I possibly can. I just hope my plans work out.
    Being an emmigrant (an immigrant in Ireland) myself I wish good luck to you.

    I bet in the OPs opinion you shouldn't have left the hospital, as this was the place you were born, neither your street, your town or your county. Remember, people are free and whoever is trying to enslave you - either by force or psychological tricks (like calling you "a traitor", "you've got free education here", etc) should be told to F**K OFF big time.


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  • Graduates have very little options for them now. There's the WPP scheme which can be up to 9 months free work, which is a great scheme, but that lenght of time on 196 a week including travel and other expenses, is a bit of a joke.

    Its 150 a week for under 25s and the WPP scheme is gonna increase unemployment.....
    cleaner.jpg

    http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055852864&page=9

    You couldnt possibly think thats a good idea? Choices are clean toilets for your dole or emigrate? hmmmn....


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,228 ✭✭✭epgc3fyqirnbsx


    Its 150 a week for under 25s and the WPP scheme is gonna increase unemployment.....
    cleaner.jpg

    http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055852864&page=9

    You couldnt possibly think thats a good idea? Choices are clean toilets for your dole or emigrate? hmmmn....

    The scheme in theory is a good idea to help people gain experience. But then you look at the website and see 'internships' offered for being a gardener or a waiter and it's obvious that it's been taking advantage of...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 50 ✭✭SayWhaaat


    Rats that don't flee a sinking ship drown...

    Hope you can swim OP ;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,363 ✭✭✭Misty Chaos


    ScumLord wrote: »
    I've already said marching is pointless.


    If that's what you believe then you have given up on this country, your letting them walk all over you.

    As individuals we can achieve very little, if the towns around Ireland took it upon themselves to look after themselves they'd have more power like in other country's with local government. If people are hungry we have the land to feed them, we should have our farmers ignore the multinationals and start selling locally. If you need food, help the farmer. If OAPs are suffering it's up to their neighbours to help them, if roads and paths are damaged then just about every town in Ireland has the skilled workforce to do something about it. It's about time the people started helping themselves instead of waiting for the government to do something.

    We're waiting to be spoon feed instead of looking after ourselves.

    Now, this is something I agree with, even when times were good, people were always giving out in some shape or form about the government not doing this thing or funding that thing.

    Er... hello? If you want that new school building so bad, then there are other ways to raise funds to pay for it, like doing fundraising events rather than waiting for the government to approve funding that often took forever or never even happened for some places!

    Its worth noting that a lot of the specialised equipment in many hospitals across the country were gotten through people fundraising to get it. Now, say what you want about that but it shows that people can rally together to achieve some good when the need arises. As the above said, maybe we could do with more of that simple acts of charity in everyday life?

    As for myself, I'll more than likely emigrate, partly because I don't see this country as having much of a creative hub ( except Dublin but for reasons I won't go into, I don't like Dublin and wouldn't want to live there. ) that and I wish to travel and expand my horizons as well.

    Basically, I think that the world out there can afford me better opportunities than here in Ireland can ever do, regardless of the economic situation. People were still leaving during the boom times, after all.

    Does that mean I'm a traitor to my country? Perhaps in some people's eyes but like Iamxavier said, it still takes a LOT of work to successfully emigrate, maybe even more work than staying put! Remember, we don't owe our country of birth anything and it in turn doesn't owe us anything, to think so otherwise is blind patriotism in my opinion.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 21,191 ✭✭✭✭Latchy


    ScumLord wrote: »
    I'm beginning to get a bit pissed off with all this talk of immigration. All these people are in effect abandoning they're communities, families and country, they're leaving this state to the corrupt money hungry "fat cats" that they're complaining about so much. Whatever happened to the fighting Irish, no ones prepared to make a stand for this country instead they flee with their tails between their legs.

    Is it really the government that is to blame when we do nothing to stand in their way?

    The fighting Irish who fought in the battlefields and trenches of France , Gallipoli , WW2 wearing the uniform of another country sometimes settled in those countries ie, Britain , Australia , Canada to , the ones who survived that is and immigration as we all know is nothing new .

    It's just perhaps this time round people have a much bigger reason and larger grievience to do so which is not related to a major military global conflict but an economic one .


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,221 ✭✭✭✭ Hugo Curved Fibula


    ScumLord wrote: »
    I've already said marching is pointless.

    My post was long, your reply was not there when I started to make my post ;)

    If that's what you believe then you have given up on this country, your letting them walk all over you.

    This is very harsh and a very ignorant statement. Considering you know very little about me. I have given up on my country? How so? Is it because I refuse to take any more handouts? Is it because I wish to find work and there is very little work in this country for me at the moment? That's not my fault. Nor is it something I can fix.

    As individuals we can achieve very little, if the towns around Ireland took it upon themselves to look after themselves they'd have more power like in other country's with local government.

    How are they to do this? We have heard your arguements but yet you have not come up with any ideas or suggestions on how to fix what is broken.
    If people are hungry we have the land to feed them, we should have our farmers ignore the multinationals and start selling locally.

    Who is going to pay for the fields and for the crops to grow in them? Who is going to pay for the harvesting of these crops and the distributors of these crops. You also need to realise that Ireland is a small island, we rely on exports. If we did not have exports then this country would not exist as we know it. We also cannot simply ignore competitors or the rules and regulations set out by the EU.
    If you need food, help the farmer.

    You are talking about volunteering? The level of starvation in this country is extremely low. People dying from lack of food is rare. If you want food, you will get it.
    If OAPs are suffering it's up to their neighbours to help them

    Suffering in what sense? Lonliness? Disease? It's nobodies obligation to look after anybody else, not including your own dependants. It's a very noble thing to do, but it is not up to anybody to help your neighbour.
    if roads and paths are damaged then just about every town in Ireland has the skilled workforce to do something about it.

    Why exactly would anybody pay to fix broken footpaths and roads out of their own pocket? Especially when the vast amounts of money we once had got blown on fancy hairdoos and helicopter rides for our government? We pissed money up against a wall, we couldn't get rid of it fast enough.
    It's about time the people started helping themselves instead of waiting for the government to do something.

    Your whole arguement contradicts itself. You give out about people emmigrating, then you give out to them for not doing anything? They are doing what they can to survive, the only person that matters in times like these is yourself. Of course there is the elderly relative and the likes, but they are not going to live my life.
    We're waiting to be spoon feed instead of looking after ourselves.

    You keep saying "we". I rather you spoke for yourself to be honest. This person right here is trying his best to look after himself, I am doing what I can do to survive this crisis.
    Its 150 a week for under 25s and the WPP scheme is gonna increase unemployment.....
    cleaner.jpg

    http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055852864&page=9

    You couldnt possibly think thats a good idea? Choices are clean toilets for your dole or emigrate? hmmmn....

    You picked the worste jobs in the whole fcuking scheme. 10/10 for scaremongering. There are excellent job opportunities in that scheme. I for one will be trying my best to secure those opportunities. There will always be cowboys trying to maximise profits and take the government for a ride. Try ignore that aspect and this scheme is actually a decent one.
    Dr_Phil wrote: »
    Being an emmigrant (an immigrant in Ireland) myself I wish good luck to you.

    I bet in the OPs opinion you shouldn't have left the hospital, as this was the place you were born, neither your street, your town or your county. Remember, people are free and whoever is trying to enslave you - either by force or psychological tricks (like calling you "a traitor", "you've got free education here", etc) should be told to F**K OFF big time.

    Thank you very much :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭mojesius


    Its 150 a week for under 25s and the WPP scheme is gonna increase unemployment.....
    cleaner.jpg

    http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055852864&page=9

    You couldnt possibly think thats a good idea? Choices are clean toilets for your dole or emigrate? hmmmn....

    Thank you.

    I can probably continue my 10 hour hospitality job for 100 euro a week when I graduate in June (there are no more hours), continue to live on reduced rent at the expense of my mother and try somehow to make this magical 'stand', go on the dole or jump with the other rats. Nobody's asking to be spoon-fed the perfect job here and those who are suffer from delusion.

    However, I wish people would get off their high horse and stop pushing this national pride crap. It only gets you so far in reality. Most of my fellow students are applying for anything and everything we see advertised so that we don't have to sign on come June. And believe me, opportunities (even unpaid) are few and far between. If you had a look at any company/job websites, you'd realise this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,219 ✭✭✭PK2008


    Yeh cos Irish people wouldnt be known for emigrating or anything:rolleyes:

    Any coffin ship tickets going anywhere?





  • You picked the worste jobs in the whole fcuking scheme. 10/10 for scaremongering. There are excellent job opportunities in that scheme. I for one will be trying my best to secure those opportunities. There will always be cowboys trying to maximise profits and take the government for a ride. Try ignore that aspect and this scheme is actually a decent one.


    no not scaremongering, when companies replace paid positions with unpaid fas jobs its definitely a step backwards. Schemes like that increase unemployment and encourage emigration


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,276 ✭✭✭Alessandra


    I left this country because I was not able to get a decent job after 2 degrees in University and many applications. I did not want to join the statistic of the current 13.4% unemployed, many of whom graduates like myself.

    I'm even more determined not to return here following the latest news that over the next 10 years plus my parents and the rest of the taxpayers in the country will be repaying debt which they hard no part in creating.

    I resent the fact that you call people such as myself "rats". The real "rats" of this country are those in power and those who have riddled the countries coffers with their excessive borrowing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    This is very harsh and a very ignorant statement. Considering you know very little about me. I have given up on my country? How so? Is it because I refuse to take any more handouts? Is it because I wish to find work and there is very little work in this country for me at the moment? That's not my fault. Nor is it something I can fix.
    Ok, perhaps harsh but your statement about this not being the peoples country and there's nothing we can do about it did make my blood boil.

    Who is going to pay for the fields and for the crops to grow in them? Who is going to pay for the harvesting of these crops and the distributors of these crops. You also need to realise that Ireland is a small island, we rely on exports. If we did not have exports then this country would not exist as we know it. We also cannot simply ignore competitors or the rules and regulations set out by the EU.
    The fields are bought and paid for, I'm talking about the farmer, the builder, the teacher all coming together to bypass the governments inadequacies. We're not starving yet but it's an example, all the resources and knowledge we need to fix this country are there they're just not being utilised.



    Suffering in what sense? Lonliness? Disease? It's nobodies obligation to look after anybody else, not including your own dependants. It's a very noble thing to do, but it is not up to anybody to help your neighbour.
    I'd have to disagree, people need each other and should look after each other. You or I cannot survive on our own we need others and it's wrong to take and not give something back.


    Why exactly would anybody pay to fix broken footpaths and roads out of their own pocket? Especially when the vast amounts of money we once had got blown on fancy hairdoos and helicopter rides for our government? We pissed money up against a wall, we couldn't get rid of it fast enough.
    Because it's their path, why not invest they're own money in they're own community besides having the government waste it on the otherside of the country?


    You keep saying "we". I rather you spoke for yourself to be honest. This person right here is trying his best to look after himself, I am doing what I can do to survive this crisis.
    I have a job, I'm working on community projects, our town has been completely ignored so we've taken it upon ourselves to do something about it. When they said we couldn't have broadband we went and did everything we could to bring it in ourselves we failed due to regulations but within 6 months the town had broadband. If community's don't look out for themselves no one else will. There are ongoing projects that have been fought for tooth and nail we won't be dependant on a useless government.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,124 ✭✭✭Amhran Nua


    I wouldn't hold it against anyone that wanted to leave to find work elsewhere. I wouldn't advise it though - this is our country, our home, where our friends and family are, and I think thats worth fighting for. Put the watered-beer-peddling publicans and the politicans with their ghoulish mé féinism and post colonial wisdom on the boat and lets run the place properly, Ireland could be an outstanding country with just a little effort.

    Its not right that people should be forced to emigrate against their will through the incompetent mismanagement of the place, and by the decisions of a minister whose father infamously said "we can't all live on this little island", for which he should have been run out of politics.

    I'm not standing for it and I don't think you should either.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,191 ✭✭✭narwog81


    . Now most of them are back and love to give the likes of my Dad stick for never having the balls to leave and that it was because of men like them, who actually left for work and sent money home that the country stayed afloat at all.

    the only foreign money that significantly impacted the economy was the deluge of cheap cash made available to irish banks when Ireland joined the EMU.
    Irish banks borrowed 2-3 times our GDP between 1999-2007, everyone got nice new cars and holidays and now the place is in a heap and we're all leaving again....


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,191 ✭✭✭narwog81


    ScumLord wrote: »
    I'm beginning to get a bit pissed off with all this talk of immigration. All these people are in effect abandoning they're communities, families and country, they're leaving this state to the corrupt money hungry "fat cats" that they're complaining about so much. Whatever happened to the fighting Irish, no ones prepared to make a stand for this country instead they flee with their tails between their legs.

    Is it really the government that is to blame when we do nothing to stand in their way?

    the fighting Irish havent understood yet the criminial injustice thats been done to them by the governments actions this week and in the last 18 months.

    if the average man on the street actually knew understood the level of deception and injustice that NAMA is inflicting on the country and its future there would already be blood on the streets.

    i think moore mcdowell said on primetime that NAMA would wipe 5-6% of our annual GDP growth for the next 30 years. If thats the case then short of striking oil of the west coast we can forget about ever returning to anything close to the prosperity we enjoyed for the last decade


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,221 ✭✭✭✭ Hugo Curved Fibula


    no not scaremongering, when companies replace paid positions with unpaid fas jobs its definitely a step backwards. Schemes like that increase unemployment and encourage emigration

    It's scaremongering. You have linked two jobs and said that this whole scheme increases unemployment and emigration? Any proof on this or is it just speculation? If anything this scheme is going to help people secure a job as it gives them the skills and experience needed to secure a job these days.
    ScumLord wrote: »
    Ok, perhaps harsh but your statement about this not being the peoples country and there's nothing we can do about it did make my blood boil.

    Your accusations and false claims boil my blood. I am not a rat, nor is it my fault that this country is in the mess it is in, nor is this country mine, nor can I do anything about it.
    The fields are bought and paid for,

    What fields? Where are they? Who paid for them? Are those people who paid for the fields going to let you plant on them for free? I highly doubt it.
    I'm talking about the farmer, the builder, the teacher all coming together to bypass the governments inadequacies. We're not starving yet but it's an example, all the resources and knowledge we need to fix this country are there they're just not being utilised.

    How do you make this work? How do you get these people to work together? Why would anybody want to do this?

    I'd have to disagree, people need each other and should look after each other. You or I cannot survive on our own we need others and it's wrong to take and not give something back.

    Again, please speak for yourself. I have the skill set to survive on my own. Is it wrong to not give something back? Screw morals, morals won't get me a job, nor will they feed me nor will they get me a newer car. It's not so black and white either. What exactly should we give back? If you get a good deal in a shop, do you feel guilty about taking that good deal? Do you go back to that shop and buy more of their goods because of that one good deal you got? I owe this country nothing...


    Because it's their path, why not invest they're own money in they're own community besides having the government waste it on the otherside of the country?

    You know what taxes are?

    Why would any sain person invest their own money into a public path?

    So people should invest their own money, after tax, on fixing their public areas, instead of having the government waste their money on it? And what should the government be spending their money on anyway?

    I have a job, I'm working on community projects, our town has been completely ignored so we've taken it upon ourselves to do something about it. When they said we couldn't have broadband we went and did everything we could to bring it in ourselves we failed due to regulations but within 6 months the town had broadband. If community's don't look out for themselves no one else will. There are ongoing projects that have been fought for tooth and nail we won't be dependant on a useless government.

    Fair play to ye, but not everybody is in that situation, and not everybody really cares, nor should they. Yet, that's not going to fix the country. That's not going to get me a job.
    Amhran Nua wrote: »
    I wouldn't hold it against anyone that wanted to leave to find work elsewhere. I wouldn't advise it though - this is our country, our home, where our friends and family are, and I think thats worth fighting for. Put the watered-beer-peddling publicans and the politicans with their ghoulish mé féinism and post colonial wisdom on the boat and lets run the place properly, Ireland could be an outstanding country with just a little effort.

    Its not right that people should be forced to emigrate against their will through the incompetent mismanagement of the place, and by the decisions of a minister whose father infamously said "we can't all live on this little island", for which he should have been run out of politics.

    I'm not standing for it and I don't think you should either.

    Nobody is being forced against their will, it's a difficult choice, but it's a choice none the less.

    What would you advise the people who are emigrating to do instead? People, including myself, are simply sick and tired looking for work in this country so we are trying elsewhere. We may get work elsewhere or we may not, but at least we are going to try.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,124 ✭✭✭Amhran Nua


    Nobody is being forced against their will, it's a difficult choice, but it's a choice none the less.
    Duress doesn't have to mean clapped in irons and dragged out to Shannon at gunpoint.
    What would you advise the people who are emigrating to do instead? People, including myself, are simply sick and tired looking for work in this country so we are trying elsewhere. We may get work elsewhere or we may not, but at least we are going to try.
    If you aren't political, get political. Don't bother rolling the eyes, its as much a fact as the sky being up, and I couldn't really give a damn about the opinion of anyone that doesn't want to accept that for whatever reason. The heart of all of our problems lies with the politicians and political system, and thats where the change has to happen.

    If you take a look at the sig there you'll find a nice little group of people who are actively working at every level from community to national to enact change before the Publican Party drive us off the cliff entirely in a drunken haze. Start your own group, email a TD, whatever. Get involved and let people know that its not okay to sit and hope it all gets better by itself, it won't. They have no difficulty whatsoever signing away the futures of your children and mine in exchange for an easy life now. Lead, follow, or get out of the way.

    Thats what I advise you do.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,789 ✭✭✭✭ScumLord


    Your accusations and false claims boil my blood. I am not a rat, nor is it my fault that this country is in the mess it is in, nor is this country mine, nor can I do anything about it.
    Well if you can't do it no one can and there's no point in trying, there's no point moving to another country either because that's full of people and they can't do anything about their country.

    What fields? Where are they? Who paid for them? Are those people who paid for the fields going to let you plant on them for free? I highly doubt it.
    The people of the town paid for it, the farmers are working night and day just to break even they're very open to new solutions, the only reason they stay on the farm is because they love it, it's not for profit.


    I have the skill set to survive on my own.
    Really? You can grow or kill your own food? You know medicine? You have the skills to make your own home from scratch? Maybe you are bear grills but most people cannot survive on their own.

    Fair play to ye, but not everybody is in that situation, and not everybody really cares, nor should they. Yet, that's not going to fix the country. That's not going to get me a job.
    If people don't care this country will fail. Most people do care.




  • narwog81 wrote: »

    i think moore mcdowell said on primetime that NAMA would wipe 5-6% of our annual GDP growth for the next 30 years. If thats the case then short of striking oil of the west coast we can forget about ever returning to anything close to the prosperity we enjoyed for the last decade
    The equivalent of 5% being knocked of GNP for the next 20 years

    43minutes 30 seconds into part two of the right hook tuesday (yesterday 30/03/10) podcast:
    http://media.newstalk.ie/podcasts/popup

    To illustrate what a 5% reduction in GNP is:
    6% is a booming economy - Celtic Tiger type stuff (Celtic Tiger ranged from 6-11% growth)

    subtract 5% = 1% growth which is stagnation at best.

    20 years where if conditions are right for a Celtic Tiger again the best we could hope for is stagnation.....
    It's scaremongering. You have linked two jobs and said that this whole scheme increases unemployment and emigration? Any proof on this or is it just speculation? If anything this scheme is going to help people secure a job as it gives them the skills and experience needed to secure a job these days.

    No its not scaremongering if you were followiing the threads specifically about the WPP1/2 scheme you would see that there are dozens of examples of it being a scam. One good example is the IBEC website 90% of the jobs are now unpaid. Microsoft are taking on 10 people under this scheme and the job description is that they all need experience.

    The scheme will increase unemployment its really very basic economic, if you supply employers with free labour they will increase their consumption of this kind of labour thus displacing paid employment. Pretending or hoping it will help graduates wont make it a good scheme.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,221 ✭✭✭✭ Hugo Curved Fibula


    Amhran Nua wrote: »
    Duress doesn't have to mean clapped in irons and dragged out to Shannon at gunpoint.

    You didn't say duress, you said forced. They are different words with different meanings. Decide which one you want to use.

    If you aren't political, get political.

    I vote, that's as far as I go with politics. Why should everyone get involved further?
    Don't bother rolling the eyes

    Where did I roll my eyes?
    its as much a fact as the sky being up, and I couldn't really give a damn about the opinion of anyone that doesn't want to accept that for whatever reason.

    What?
    The heart of all of our problems lies with the politicians and political system, and thats where the change has to happen.

    Everybody that follows politices even a little knows that, but how do you change it?
    If you take a look at the sig there you'll find a nice little group of people who are actively working at every level from community to national to enact change before the Publican Party drive us off the cliff entirely in a drunken haze. Start your own group, email a TD, whatever. Get involved and let people know that its not okay to sit and hope it all gets better by itself, it won't. They have no difficulty whatsoever signing away the futures of your children and mine in exchange for an easy life now. Lead, follow, or get out of the way.

    Thats what I advise you do.

    Not the best advice really, start a group? What has your group done so far? What have ye changed? I'd support any legitimate group that actually does something other than rallies and post blogs. It's not an easy thing to do.
    ScumLord wrote: »
    Well if you can't do it no one can and there's no point in trying, there's no point moving to another country either because that's full of people and they can't do anything about their country.

    Look, scumlord, I will ask you a question I would appretiate an honest answer, are you taking the piss? Every country is the same as Ireland? That's not true. You are making no sense what so ever. There's no point in moving to another country? I just gave you my point, it's to get work, which in some countries is plentiful.


    The people of the town paid for it, the farmers are working night and day just to break even they're very open to new solutions, the only reason they stay on the farm is because they love it, it's not for profit.

    Ok, this is one case you are talking about? Is this in your community? Who does the food go to, and where?

    Really? You can grow or kill your own food? You know medicine? You have the skills to make your own home from scratch? Maybe you are bear grills but most people cannot survive on their own.

    Yes really, I have been interested in survival since I was very young, I have 21 years of knowledge behind me. I don't claim to be bear grylls, but he's an extremist any survivalist knows that. The medicine part of survival is tricky, but the point is to avoid hazardous foods and conditions. If you can do that there is less need for medicines.

    If people don't care this country will fail. Most people do care.

    From what I can see most people don't care. Whining and bítching about it on TV, the internet or in the newspapers does not equate to caring.
    43minutes 30 seconds into part two of the right hook tuesday (yesterday 30/03/10) podcast:
    http://media.newstalk.ie/podcasts/popup

    To illustrate what a 5% reduction in GNP is:
    6% is a booming economy - Celtic Tiger type stuff (Celtic Tiger ranged from 6-11% growth)

    subtract 5% = 1% growth which is stagnation at best.

    Just to let you know, 1% is not stagnant, that is growth. No matter what you say, it's not stagnant. ;)


    No its not scaremongering if you were followiing the threads specifically about the WPP1/2 scheme you would see that there are dozens of examples of it being a scam.

    Dozens... out of how many jobs?
    One good example is the IBEC website 90% of the jobs are now unpaid. Microsoft are taking on 10 people under this scheme and the job description is that they all need experience.

    What kind of jobs are they offering? Where both companies hiring at the same rate before the scheme? I highly doubt it.
    The scheme will increase unemployment its really very basic economic, if you supply employers with free labour they will increase their consumption of this kind of labour thus displacing paid employment. Pretending or hoping it will help graduates wont make it a good scheme.

    It's pretty simple really. You still haven't given any proof of any of your claims. You are just speculating. You say this is going to increase unemployment over all? I say it's going to increas employment, why? Because it gives people the proper skillset and experience to persue a paid job at the end of their 6 months intern...

    I don't think you would like america too much, after paying your 40K dollars for college, you would then have to do an intern for a company if you really wanted to get the job you want. It's common practice in many countries. But of course, when it happens in Ireland the people think they are being scammed. Obviously there are jobs that are scams, it's simple, stay away from them. Do you know how difficult it is to get an internship in any company before this scheme? Of course you don't... ;)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,034 ✭✭✭Resi12


    ScumLord wrote: »
    I'm beginning to get a bit pissed off with all this talk of immigration. All these people are in effect abandoning they're communities, families and country, they're leaving this state to the corrupt money hungry "fat cats" that they're complaining about so much. Whatever happened to the fighting Irish, no ones prepared to make a stand for this country instead they flee with their tails between their legs.

    Is it really the government that is to blame when we do nothing to stand in their way?

    We are not the traitor's here, try the government picking the banks over it's own citizens.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,124 ✭✭✭Amhran Nua


    You didn't say duress, you said forced. They are different words with different meanings. Decide which one you want to use.
    Okay then. Duress:

    1. compulsion by use of force or threat; constraint; coercion (often in the phrase under duress)
    I vote, that's as far as I go with politics. Why should everyone get involved further?
    So you're perfectly satisified with the options being offered to you by today's parties?
    Everybody that follows politices even a little knows that, but how do you change it?
    Step by step instructions here. Usually a good first step is to join the party however.
    Not the best advice really, start a group? What has your group done so far? What have ye changed? I'd support any legitimate group that actually does something other than rallies and post blogs. It's not an easy thing to do.
    You don't say. We're had radio and newspaper interviews on the local, national and international level, held discussions with politicians of various stripes, including some fairly high ranking ones, had numerous of our policies lifted wholesale by both main parties, and hopefully they lift the rest soon because none of us are politicians, and as a result of this effort we've joined various committees and groups in our localities to help make the area better for our respective communities.

    Its a bit more involved than posting a blog, and a lot more involved than sitting moaning on the intertubes.


  • Registered Users Posts: 264 ✭✭sron


    ScumLord wrote: »
    Whatever happened to the fighting Irish

    They lived in America.


  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,168 Mod ✭✭✭✭artanevilla


    If I chose to go to another country to find work, I am considered a traitor? I am abandoning my country, community, family and friends? Fcuk that, I am not sitting on my hole waiting for work to land on my lap, nore am I going to sit around this kip to wait for the government to act on the job crisis and do their fcuking jobs. I'm out of here as soon as I possibly can. I just hope my plans work out.

    This is the attitude I don't like.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,915 ✭✭✭TheIrishGrover


    Raggaroo wrote: »
    Possibly thay are EMIGRATING to avoid being called immigrants !!!!!!

    I'm pretty sure that's going to backfire on them


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,221 ✭✭✭✭ Hugo Curved Fibula


    Amhran Nua wrote: »
    Okay then. Duress:

    1. compulsion by use of force or threat; constraint; coercion (often in the phrase under duress)

    So you're perfectly satisified with the options being offered to you by today's parties?

    Step by step instructions here. Usually a good first step is to join the party however.

    You don't say. We're had radio and newspaper interviews on the local, national and international level, held discussions with politicians of various stripes, including some fairly high ranking ones, had numerous of our policies lifted wholesale by both main parties, and hopefully they lift the rest soon because none of us are politicians, and as a result of this effort we've joined various committees and groups in our localities to help make the area better for our respective communities.

    Its a bit more involved than posting a blog, and a lot more involved than sitting moaning on the intertubes.

    Firstly, I don't have a problem with my community, nor any community that I have ever lived in, apart from the recent job crisis. That not a community issue as such, it's a national issue.

    Do you have a job?
    This is the attitude I don't like.

    It's an opinion, my opinion, it's not an attitude, however you picked that up.


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