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Bus Eireann routes 109/109A Changes

12357…45

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  • #122
    tom23
    Registered Users Posts: 1,071 ✭✭✭tom23


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    Without doubt Commuter109,an excellent and proactive response.

    It is abundantly clear that sections of BE management remain so firmly entrenched in the past that they cannot recognize a Pot of Gold when they stumble across it.



    This is seriously marketable journey time,which if allied to a good quality vehicle and generally comfortable journey is more than capable of attracting a Car Driver to at least try the coach a couple of times weekly.

    Currently,Irish Public Transport has few such opportunities and when they arise they need to be fully grasped and sweated for all they are worth....failure to do so,is in my opinion either down to negligence or sabotage...take your pick ?

    I would also suggest Commuter 109,that you cc your communications to the NTA and the relevant politicians such as Damien English....this is one case where incompetent or plain ol disinterested management cannot be allowed to sabotage an opportunity which is important to both Staff and Passengers alike.

    Sabotage if you ask me. I agree 100% on the point of this been a golden opportunity to get bums on seats, but I have little faith in BE management to seize the day. It does merit an email to BE management NTA and Local TDs saying, I told ya so! This is a real winner and on the back of that increase the percentage of peak time buses using the Port Tunnell and M50/M3.

    I would also wish for them to really do real hard research to see exactly the passenger numbers / behaviour from Bus Aras to Blanchardstown Monday to Friday.


  • #123
    tom23
    Registered Users Posts: 1,071 ✭✭✭tom23


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    Ah here now....did you never hear of the motto..."Serving the ENTIRE Community" ?......OOoooops...sorry....wrong bus company !!! :eek:

    The point however stands.....Bus Eireann,for whatever bizzarre reason is persisting with the "Just in Case" strategy,based upon the mysterious passenger who just MIGHT want to get off at Blanchardstown,and ye can't be discombobulating that person... :)

    It's Percy French territory...."Are ye right there Michael ?...are yet Right..??"

    I seen that person once, tall, black hair, got on at the Centre and said Clonsilla please, Bus driver said, sorry boss this is going to Navan, tall black hair dude, said ya what? oh excuse me but I seem to be on the wrong semi state public transport bus, please for give me.

    And so that finally put to bed the legend of Justin Case, the mystical passenger with the golden ticket that bus eireann where hoping to pick up at the centre, therefore fecking up their 3 year strategy (thats if they had one).

    They are now eying up Liffey Valley, only 35 mins away. :P


  • #124
    Commuter109
    Registered Users Posts: 212 ✭✭Commuter109


    back to reality today, 6pm bus 1 hour 20 to Navan, 2 people picked up outside of the bus aras stop, via Clonee for nobody to get off etc.. etc..

    I've wasnt on the buses last week, but from the email I got from BE, which to be honest I cant quite decipher, but it appears to say that the use by the 6.30 express of the port tunnell the previous week was "due to a breakdown in communication" and in effect it would be reverting to its usual route via cabra, but they did add "Your comments have been noted and will be considered as part of any future service reviews.
    On behalf of Bus Éireann, I would like to thank you for taking the time to contact us" which was lovely!!

    Can anybody who has been on it for the last few days confirm the position??

    its a real shame, there are something like 14 buses leaving the bus aras between the peak hours of 4 to 6.30 and all bar one are having to go out through a route which is a traffic blackspot and appears to be getting worse,

    Tks


  • #125
    AlekSmart
    Registered Users Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Commuter109,all I can say is don't give up.

    Keep it calm and clear but keep the written communication going,particularly with the NTA,and I would also suggest,the Quality Bus Network Office,who also have a significant responsibility in this.

    The posts in this thread,when taken as a narrative,illustrate very clearly the Actualité,as opposed to what a significant number of Public Transport Administrators wish to believe it is.

    The single bare statistic of c.14 departures during a 2h.30m evening peak,with 13 of these being deliberately prevented from accessing a major Billion € Traffic Relief project (DPAT) is enough to merit a note to the "Troika" on waste-of-resources grounds alone.

    It is nonsense,it is anti-consumer,it is anti-efficiency and totally against any commercial ethos relating to attracting new business to Public Transport.

    Don't Let It Go-Keep on Plugging !! :o


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • #126
    Commuter109
    Registered Users Posts: 212 ✭✭Commuter109


    Cheers Alex

    Will keep plugging away, but think its time to leave BE out of the loop, I emailed thanking them for there response but pointing out the above statistics and alluding to the fact that the use of the Cabra route was to the annoyance of the great majority of passengers.

    The reponse was along the line of "as we said yesterday the 6.30 bus is licenced to use the cabra route, thank you for your email your comments have been noted" typa thing i.e the wouldn't allude to any of the actual content of emails, despite the fact that they amount to feedback from a paying customer. getting banging my head against the wall syndrome here!!

    I think NTA/ local policiticans is the way to go on this one, cos to be frank, BE don't appear to give a sh*t about the plight of or the concerns of those who use their services


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  • #127
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,532 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    Did you get in touch with the regional manager, Joe Kenny, directly as I suggested above?

    If you're getting generic replies, frankly you need to go directly to the manager responsible.


  • #128
    Commuter109
    Registered Users Posts: 212 ✭✭Commuter109


    cced Joe.kenny@buseireann.ie (and NTA etc) assuming it was correct address, got back an undelivered status message re J Kenny, from what i can make out, if it was the right address, but his mailbox was possibly full i.e " insufficent system storage"

    Asked the geezer oprating [EMAIL="info@buseireann"]info@buseireann[/EMAIL] to confirm joe Kennys email and in essence he politely refused, suggesting i use the [EMAIL="info@buseireann"]info@buseireann[/EMAIL] address and state "for the attention of Joe Kenny in the subject box!

    It has only made me more determined !!!!!


  • #129
    AlekSmart
    Registered Users Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Commuter109 wrote: »
    cced Joe.kenny@buseireann.ie (and NTA etc) assuming it was correct address, got back an undelivered status message re J Kenny, from what i can make out, if it was the right address, but his mailbox was possibly full i.e " insufficent system storage"

    Asked the geezer oprating [EMAIL="info@buseireann"]info@buseireann[/EMAIL] to confirm joe Kennys email and in essence he politely refused, suggesting i use the [EMAIL="info@buseireann"]info@buseireann[/EMAIL] address and state "for the attention of Joe Kenny in the subject box!

    It has only made me more determined !!!!!

    Just on a quick point I'd suggest dropping the capital J from Joe.....as in joe.kenny@buseireann.ie

    Might work ?


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • #130
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,428 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    AlekSmart wrote: »
    Just on a quick point I'd suggest dropping the capital J from Joe.....as in joe.kenny@buseireann.ie

    Might work ?

    Shouldn't make a difference, email addresses aren't case sensitive.


  • #131
    wavehopper1
    Registered Users Posts: 355 ✭✭wavehopper1


    Can anybody tell me if there is a "direct" 17.30 to Navan that skips Blanch and Johnstown?

    According to the website timetable there are three 109s departing at 17.30: (1) skips navan and goes to Kells
    (2) takes the port tunnel goes via the Ardboyne to Navan
    (3) goes via Johnstown to Navan

    Thanks to this thread (and not BE) I know that the Port Tunnel route has been suspended. I asked BE if they were replacing the port tunnel route and they pretended the the port tunnel route never existed. But it's still on the PDF timetable!

    The only 109s at 17.30 I've been on have gone via Johnstown. It seems to me that the second bus to Navan hasn't been replaced at all - is that the experience of others?


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  • #132
    tara83
    Registered Users Posts: 276 ✭✭tara83


    Yes there is still a 17.30 that goes through the port tunnel. It's the double Decker bus usually the middle of the 3buses that go at that time. I think you may be getting the kells bus which goes down the navan road.

    It seems that the 17.30 is now the only bus through the port tunnel


  • #133
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,532 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    The timetable officially changed on Friday February 3rd for the 17:30 express to operate via the Port Tunnel.


  • #134
    Kutebride
    Registered Users Posts: 1,090 ✭✭✭Kutebride


    I am between BE and a private coach at the moment. Private coach hands down even if it has to use Cabra. It does not go via Clonee or Blanch.

    Last night I got the 8pm bus from Bus Aras. What the hell was it doing going into Blanch Shopping Centre.
    Last week, cant remember the day, I got a 17.30 bus. It was a coach so probably hired in. Into Clonee, in to Blanch Shopping Ctr and when we approached Navan drive was going towards Ardboyne while asking over microphone if any passengers for Johnstown. At the last second there was and three got off at supervalu. I thought I would end up in town while my car parked at ardboyne.
    He turned left facing for ardboyne. Went up and asked for ardboyne which I had to point out to him. He muttered something to himself about 'where are they sending me'. I asked him why are buses been sent to Blanch he said god knows!!
    Palava


  • #135
    Geog1234
    Registered Users Posts: 311 ✭✭Geog1234


    The 18.00hrs route 30 Expressway journey Dublin (Busáras) to Swanlinbar (Co. Cavan) also generally uses the Port Tunnel.

    This Expressway service is not scheduled to pick-up or drop-off between Busáras and Dunshaughlin and, as such, the route it follows between these two points is immaterial.

    This journey operates every day, including Sundays. Schedule hereunder:

    Dublin (Busáras) d 18.00
    Dunshaughlin (Gogan's) d. 18,45
    Navan (Mercy Convent) d. 19.05
    Kells (Parochial House) d. 19.25
    Virginia (Main Street) d. 19.40
    Cavan (Bus Station) d. 20.00

    It continues to Swanlinbar (arrive 20.45) via Butlersbridge (Bypass), Belturbet (Diamond), Ballyconnell (Slieve Russell Hotel),
    Ballyconnell (opp. Courthouse) and Bawnboy.


  • #136
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,532 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    Geog1234 wrote: »
    This Expressway service is not scheduled to pick-up or drop-off between Busáras and Dunshaughlin and, as such, the route it follows between these two points is immaterial.

    Actually the route is material - the NTA specifically approve what route each departure on a route must take - deviating from that could (in certain circumstances where there is competition) be deemed unfair practice.

    Hence BE had to apply to the NTA for the 17:30 109 express service to operate via the Port Tunnel.


  • #137
    Geog1234
    Registered Users Posts: 311 ✭✭Geog1234


    One would never think that given the situation on the ground when some drivers don't even seem to know the route they are supposed to follow!


  • #138
    Commuter109
    Registered Users Posts: 212 ✭✭Commuter109


    Thanks Geog

    Do they they let all commuters on, or is one of these services where if there are too many for the end destinations i.e cavan, belturbet, etc.. you are asked to get off the bus if you are going to say Navan or Dunslaughlin etc and take one of the other 6pm buses??

    On that point just wondering, assumedly if there was in theory, enough passengers going to Belturbert say to fill that 30 bus, assumedly if you are going to Dunslaughlin or kells etc.. you can point to the time table and point out that it is scheduled to service your town so you are entitled to take it?? (and who wouldn't want to if it uses port tunnel as opposed to the cabra route)

    Not sure if it happens nowadays as much but I remember a time when it was rampant, i.e you could be getting a cavan bus that as per the offical timetable served Navan, and would be asked to get off it because there were too many for Kells and Cavan etc.. I always did because at the time Cavan buses were only hourly I think so I didnt want some poor sod waiting an hour for another bus!

    On the point of buses being over full, I saw this week (and not by any means for the first time) 6 or 7 people being refused entry to the 7.05am express from Navan at the ardboyne stop (I seen this happen on the 7.20am too) as the bus was full.

    Has this happened to anyone? Assumedly your only choice is to get the other bus which runs via dunsaughlin, or if you cant get on the 7.05 express, take your chances and wait for the 7.20 express?


  • #139
    Geog1234
    Registered Users Posts: 311 ✭✭Geog1234


    Yes, people are travelling to Navan etc...on it.

    In theory if there were a good load of longer distance passengers on it one could be asked to take another bus. For instance, it is the last bus of the day serving Ballyconnell, Bawnboy and Swanlinbar so in the event of say a big event in Dublin understandably passengers to these destinations will be prioritised.

    Agree that this doesn't seem to happen as much now, probably because there are a better spread of services plus auxiliary (help) buses.

    I've seen counts of spare seats done for the (hourly) 109 to Cavan prior to departure from Busáras to ensure passengers waiting at the Mater, Phibsboro, Ashtown and Blanchardstown stops can be accommodated.

    But this can occasionally go wrong with there being at least one instance recently of a Cavan bus taking significant numbers for Dunshaughlin/Navan/Kells from Busáras with the result that a small number of passengers waiting at one or two stops on the way out of the city to travel to points north of Kells (only served by the hourly Cavan service) were left behind.

    In terms of the situation outlined whilst buses run through Johnstown/Bailis during the day what about one starting from there in the morning. For instance, start at Supervalu at 7.10am, out to the Ardboyne stop, 7.12, Kilcarne Bridge 7.14, Dalgan Park 7.16, Garlow Cross 7.18 and thence onto the M3.

    This would save many people having to walk/be dropped into Navan/to the Ardboyne/Kilcarne stops.

    Another bus that could be of use to some depending on their location in Navan and destination in Dublin is the route 107 at 06.50 Navan Square - Athlumney - Kentstown - Ashbourne - Finglas - Dublin - UCD. Not motorway of course but the Ashbourne road tends to provide a good run.
    There's also a return journey on this route at 17.40 ex Beresford Place (Liberty Hall): http://www.buseireann.ie/pdf/1318429076-107.pdf


  • #140
    Commuter109
    Registered Users Posts: 212 ✭✭Commuter109


    To my delight/ surprise, after the emails from BE this week informing me that 6.30 to Navan is "licenced to take the Cabra aroute and must do so" and that the taking of the port tunnel the week before last was due to a "breakdown in communication", I was working late yesterday evening, jumped on the aforementioned 6.30 and off it went straight throught the Port Tunnel, down the M3 and into Navan in an hour (would have been faster I suspect only for a gig in the 02)
    Hopefully this is the new phantom 5.30, i.e while BE will continue to deny it takes the Port Tunnel, it will continue to do so. I hope so anyway!!!!!

    Either that or its the fact that this service appears to be sub contracted out to a third party company (like the 5.30 prior to the official announcement that it was to use the Port Tunnell who are just using the fatest route out of town, which makes sense


  • #141
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,532 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    I would imagine it was (again) driver error.

    Unless the NTA officially licence a change and it is in the public timetable then it's not the authorised route.


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  • #142
    AlekSmart
    Registered Users Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Commuter109: Either that or its the fact that this service appears to be sub contracted out to a third party company (like the 5.30 prior to the official announcement that it was to use the Port Tunnel who are just using the fatest route out of town, which makes sense

    What a shame C109...The most likely outcome of this totally positive piece of work by the Contractor is likely to be a good bollocking from Bus Eireann as opposed to rewarding the lad for facilitating passenger desire.

    There is a strong sense of Victorian attitudes governing this entire sad,sorry saga.

    It is clearly self-evident that at least 50% more of the 109 service departured should be immediately routed through the DPAT...In fact if the NTA was acting within its public remit it should be levying fines on BE for NOT using the damn tunnel.

    At this stage its like self-flaggelation,with the company whipping itself like Matt Talbot until it finally passes out from the pain of pasenger loss.


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • #143
    Geog1234
    Registered Users Posts: 311 ✭✭Geog1234


    Unfortunately the public timetable doesn't always give sufficient information for the user to be certain of the route a bus is to follow.

    A good example of this in Meath is the 06.25 Drogheda-Navan-Trim and 19.30 return on route 188 between Drogheda and Navan where it is unclear from the timetable whether these journeys route via (i) Duleek and Kentstown; (ii) Rossin and Slane or (iii) the usual route or (iv) a route at the driver's discretion.

    It's not an express route and the timetable just shows a line between the places. The route followed by the rest of the services is quite clearly defined but not for these two journeys.

    In practice it generally seems to come via Duleek and Kentstown.

    But one wouldn't know this from the timetable unless one travelled on it, enquired or saw it.


  • #144
    Commuter109
    Registered Users Posts: 212 ✭✭Commuter109


    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/extra-trains-costing-20000-per-day-put-on-ministers-lossmaking-route-3032178.html

    Found this an interesting read from todays Indo


  • #145
    LXFlyer
    Registered Users Posts: 17,532 ✭✭✭✭LXFlyer


    That article is riddled with inaccurate figures - see the thread here.

    The cost of the extra services is more like €800 per day before additional revenue is taken into account.


  • #146
    Geog1234
    Registered Users Posts: 311 ✭✭Geog1234


    Hopefully the new train services referred to in that article will be a success.
    Ultimately if they don't succeed it potentially could harm the case for future rail developments generally including extending the M3 Parkway line to Navan.
    (Am not implying a direct link but just that it could influence policy etc...)


  • #147
    munchkin_utd
    Registered Users Posts: 7,810 ✭✭✭munchkin_utd


    Geog1234 wrote: »
    Hopefully the new train services referred to in that article will be a success.
    Ultimately if they don't succeed it potentially could harm the case for future rail developments generally including extending the M3 Parkway line to Navan.
    (Am not implying a direct link but just that it could influence policy etc...)
    Well... Now that you introduce the idea of rail branch lines...

    There's already a train that runs with 100s of empty seats from docklands to m3 parkway at the beginning of the uncngested motorway to navan.
    If a train to navan is feasible, then surely a pilot for its success would be an express bus between navan and m3 parkway and then train to the city centre, even if only a t peak times.

    If anything, Irish rail as a prime competitor to bus eireann should not be worried about affecting bus eireann profits but rather be maximizing bums on seats for the dunboyne line by providing rail connectivity to navan customers. Especially when the train is one of the few in the Dublin metro area that is running with lots of spare capacity.

    EDIT: I'll just add that Bus Eireann and private bus operators have no problem going head to head with rail and attempt to capture travellers who otherwise would travel by rail, but Irish rail NEVER EVER takes the initiative by using bus shuttles of their own or otherwise to provide a service to areas only served by bus.
    They should be actively looking to fill that heavily subsidised train to Dunboyne if only to reduce the subsidy from the taxpayer needed to run the line and its empty trains.


  • #148
    Irish Steve
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 6,521 Mod ✭✭✭✭Irish Steve


    I seem to recall suggesting a way back that the local buses, and the 105, along with the 109, should all call at the parkway station, which would become the interchange for local stops in either direction. If that happened, the 109 could then run non stop from Parkway to Busaras via DPT, and the local connections could be taken care of by DB services, or the 105. In the same vein, the 109 could then probably run nonstop to at least Dunshaughlin.

    That's only one option among many. The whole Meath bus service needs to be reviewed and updated, the BE monopoly has meant that the Meath area has not seen the improvement in routes that other areas have seen as they have grown. as exampled by the fact that its only in the last 12 months that Ashbourne has started to get a service to the airport, despite being the second largest town in Meath, and a popular area with airport staff.

    Shore, if it was easy, everybody would be doin it.😁



  • #149
    Commuter109
    Registered Users Posts: 212 ✭✭Commuter109


    Managed to get the 5.30 today, a truly excellent service, Navan in an hour at peak traffic time. Not a seat to be had on the bus and it was a double decker, just goes to show real "express" services, can and will work


  • #150
    AlekSmart
    Registered Users Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    Commuter109 wrote: »
    Managed to get the 5.30 today, a truly excellent service, Navan in an hour at peak traffic time. Not a seat to be had on the bus and it was a double decker, just goes to show real "express" services, can and will work

    It is truly mind numbing to see,in a country ascribing to have a "Knowledge Based Economy" the extent to which officialdom will go to actively prevent the march of progress.

    At this stage It would not surprise me if the Senior Managers involved in all of this preferred to flood the bloody Port Tunnel rather than send more Public Transport Services through it. :(


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



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  • #151
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Commuter109 wrote: »
    Managed to get the 5.30 today, a truly excellent service, Navan in an hour at peak traffic time. Not a seat to be had on the bus and it was a double decker, just goes to show real "express" services, can and will work
    The way it is looking the same bus tomorrow could take 2hours after stopping in blanchardstown and roselawn shopping centres to pick up shoppers.


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