General Election 2016

marienbad · 03-03-2015 12:48am

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Exactly so if you are paying for it 4 times over (Corporation tax, motor tax, USC, VAT hike) why would you pay for it the 5th time?

Just because it comes from multiple sources does not mean we are paying for it 4 times over. It costs what is costs. This way hopefully it will become self sufficient and disappear from general taxation .

skooterblue2 · 03-03-2015 12:55am

marienbad wrote: »

Just because it comes from multiple sources does not mean we are paying for it 4 times over. It costs what is costs. This way hopefully it will become self sufficient and disappear from general taxation .

like the charge they put on minerals to fund the Boer War? My great grand father never got insulted by a Boer, or met a Boer for that matter. Then why am I still paying a tax to pay for a war that had nothing to do with the Irish state. Taxes go on but dont come off. We are getting fleeced and that time is being called by the voters. First thing .... the Irish taxpayers will not pay the Water Rates, then Irish Water will not meet the EU stress tests. It will be shut down within the life time of the Government.

sheesh · 03-03-2015 12:59am

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Good Question. Anything can happen. I believe there is a Scandal on the way from the past , the last government. Something to do with a previous minister not in Dublin. I believe the story will come to the fore in the next month I am told.

This will discredit an alternative governmet to the current one. It is designed to stop anyone forming a government with Sinn Fein. That would br the right time to call an election. Six weeks from then.

I didnt say I wanted it or liked it ....its just the way it could happen.

Lets remember the old addage, A week is long time in politics

did this happen?

skooterblue2 · 03-03-2015 1:04am

regretfully not, Irish media the best you can buy

marienbad · 03-03-2015 1:11am

skooterblue2 wrote: »

like the charge they put on minerals to fund the Boer War? My great grand father never got insulted by a Boer, or met a Boer for that matter. Then why am I still paying a tax to pay for a war that had nothing to do with the Irish state. Taxes go on but dont come off. We are getting fleeced and that time is being called by the voters. First thing .... the Irish taxpayers will not pay the Water Rates, then Irish Water will not meet the EU stress tests. It will be shut down within the life time of the Government.

The Boer war !! I have heard it all now .

The problem is we are not getting fleeced in an overall tax basis compared to other grown up countries . The real issue is that we have too narrow a tax base that is susceptible to massive fluctuation .

So if we are to continue paying those inflated PS wage bills and inflated SW bills, and borrowing is no longer an option, we need to broaden the tax base and water charges and property taxes are the best and fairest way to do so .

Any self-respecting Socialist should be all for them

expectationlost · 05-03-2015 11:56pm

Godge wrote: »

The voters are always right. This is a democracy.

right about what? whether we should charge for water I don't think voting about it means the right decision has been made.

saying "this is democracy" isn't an arguement.

mrbrianj · 06-03-2015 3:39pm

its going to be one hard year!

I don't see any reason the Government wont last. Labour are trying to use hard work to create a positive notion, expect lots of gay rights and abortion for the next 6 months. If this fails they may pull the plug, I think its unlikely though.

Fine Gael will try to stay blunder free for the remainder and get some distance for the Cronyism/ Med cards/ Water/ Shatter gate etc. etc.. I think this will work for them. Come election time they are the conservative bet for the middle class voters

Shinners are going to be attacked from all sides, its going to be dirty! But they will emerge, and will look much more presentable thanks to the "Looney Lefties" taking over the extremist mantle.

Fianna Fail, are like a ship becalmed in the doldrums, the pirates may have abandoned ship but the crew still stink of rum. The people that did not vote FF last time around still remember. next, next time around maybe

Left and independents, I think people will get feed up of the more militant water protesters with Sinn Fein picking up the pieces. A few more indos next time but not that many more.

So, you will have FG and SF courting Lab. Its the Joan Show

eire4 · 15-03-2015 12:19am

Latest poll puts Fine Gael at 27% followed by Sinn Fein on 19% and Fianna Fail on 18% with Labour on 9%.

eire4 · 15-03-2015 12:35am

marienbad wrote: »

We are already paying for water , this just means that the more you use the more you pay, just like electricity, internet, gas etc .

I paid all those charges also and I have no problem with it, we need more taxes like this , that is the best way to the upper 3% and also broaden the tax base .

By the way the upper 3 % already pay the lions share of tax

The top 3% do indeed pay more income tax. However overall they pay less of a share of their income in tax when both direct and indirect tax is taken into account compared with those on the lower end of the income scale.

marienbad · 15-03-2015 12:44am

eire4 wrote: »

The top 3% do indeed pay more income tax. However overall they pay less of a share of their income in tax when both direct and indirect tax is taken into account compared with those on the lower end of the income scale.

Could you expand on that a bit please , the lower income sector will pay no water charges,property tax ,no income tax and have medical cards etc.Effectively paying just vat.

KingBrian2 · 15-03-2015 12:53am

We pretty much know where all the parties stand. SF is anti water tax, property tax and so on. FG and Labour support Austerity. FF and Independents a whole bunch of them are all for burning the bondholders so it might yet become a hung Dail.

eire4 · 15-03-2015 5:27am

marienbad wrote: »

Could you expand on that a bit please , the lower income sector will pay no water charges,property tax ,no income tax and have medical cards etc.Effectively paying just vat.

The key is the percentage of their income that they pay in taxes. Because those in the bottom 10% have to spend most of their income they end up paying VAT on most of their income and thus end up paying overall a higher percentage of their income in tax then those in the high wealth bracket.

marienbad · 15-03-2015 7:07am

eire4 wrote: »

The key is the percentage of their income that they pay in taxes. Because those in the bottom 10% have to spend most of their income they end up paying VAT on most of their income and thus end up paying overall a higher percentage of their income in tax then those in the high wealth bracket.

Do you have any links for your stats , The zero rate applies to most food and childrens clothes and the lower rate to coal oil gas esb.

eire4 · 17-03-2015 9:12pm

marienbad wrote: »

Do you have any links for your stats , The zero rate applies to most food and childrens clothes and the lower rate to coal oil gas esb.

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/poorer-people-in-ireland-pay-out-more-of-their-income-in-tax-1.1910725

marienbad · 17-03-2015 9:18pm

eire4 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/poorer-people-in-ireland-pay-out-more-of-their-income-in-tax-1.1910725

OK thanks, very interesting reading .

Godge · 18-03-2015 3:11pm

eire4 wrote: »

The key is the percentage of their income that they pay in taxes. Because those in the bottom 10% have to spend most of their income they end up paying VAT on most of their income and thus end up paying overall a higher percentage of their income in tax then those in the high wealth bracket.

There is no VAT on essential goods.

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/vat/guide/vat-rates.html#section4

"The goods and services which are exempt from VAT are listed in pdfExempted Activities (PDF, 130KB). Exempt goods and services consist principally of financial, medical* and educational activities as well as admissions to, and promotion of, certain live theatrical and musical performances."

"Goods and services which attract the zero rate of VAT are listed in pdfZero Rated Activities (PDF, 191KB) and include exports, intra-Community supplies of goods to VAT-registered persons in other EU Member States, certain food and drink, oral medicine, certain books and booklets, certain animal feeding stuffs, certain fertilisers, seeds and plants used to produce food, clothing and footwear appropriate to children under 11 years of age and supplies to VAT-registered persons authorised by Revenue under the zero-rating scheme for qualifying businesse"

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/vat/leaflets/food-and-drink.html

"The Zero rate of VAT applies to the supply of most foodstuffs, such as bread, butter, cheese, cereals, condiments, flour, fruit, herbs, meat, milk, pasta, pastes, sauces, soup, spices, sugar, and vegetables (fresh or frozen). This list is by no means exhaustive."

If you are saying that poorer people buy bigger televisions and have more Sky Sports subscriptions, drink more alcohol and smoke more cigarettes, then it is possible your statement is true. Because if they eat basic foods, clothe their children, buy medicines etc., then they are not paying VAT.

Godge · 18-03-2015 3:14pm

eire4 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/poorer-people-in-ireland-pay-out-more-of-their-income-in-tax-1.1910725

That is research carried out by the Nevin Institute. There isn't a serious economist in the country who credits their research.

eire4 · 18-03-2015 5:12pm

marienbad wrote: »

OK thanks, very interesting reading .

Your welcome. I thought it was an interesting read also.

marienbad · 18-03-2015 5:25pm

eire4 wrote: »

Your welcome. I thought it was an interesting read also.

Now the you mention it ,I think the ESRI did a similar exercise after the last budget and it said the same thing.

Maybe the flat screen tv per room is too much ?:)

Jim2007 · 19-03-2015 12:22am

Godge wrote: »

That is research carried out by the Nevin Institute. There isn't a serious economist in the country who credits their research.

Well you don't need to be an economist to figure this one out! It is painfully obvious that if you earn half as much as your friend and you both buy the same vat able item, you'll have spent a larger portion of you income on paying down the vat on it - where is the wonder in that?

This is exactly how vat is expected to work and why essentials carry little or no vat. You decide to pay the tax by choosing discretionary items. Now you may make a case for some discretionary items being essential, but that is a different argument.

Godge · 19-03-2015 12:31pm

Jim2007 wrote: »

Well you don't need to be an economist to figure this one out! It is painfully obvious that if you earn half as much as your friend and you both buy the same vat able item, you'll have spent a larger portion of you income on paying down the vat on it - where is the wonder in that?

This is exactly how vat is expected to work and why essentials carry little or no vat. You decide to pay the tax by choosing discretionary items. Now you may make a case for some discretionary items being essential, but that is a different argument.

It could also be argued that if social welfare recipients are paying significant amounts of tax in the form of VAT that either

(1) not enough essential goods are zero-rated,
(2) social welfare rates are too high as they allow purchases of luxury goods,
(3) combination of the above.

Jim2007 · 19-03-2015 8:46pm

Godge wrote: »

It could also be argued that if social welfare recipients are paying significant amounts of tax in the form of VAT that either

(1) not enough essential goods are zero-rated,
(2) social welfare rates are too high as they allow purchases of luxury goods,
(3) combination of the above.

Yes it all makes me feel they started with the conclusion and worked backwards

eire4 · 26-03-2015 7:28pm

The latest poll numbers:

Keepan Eye · 04-10-2015 1:51pm

Still it will be interesting to see how the 700,000 NO votes in the last Gay referendum will translate in the next General Election. All TD's were in favout of YES .......no one has emerged to represent the 700,000 NO Orphan Voters. The one sided media refuse to acknowledge the existence of this group. [ no surprise there ]. BUT WHO WANTS THOSE 700,000 VOTES ......FF OR FG or a coalition of both. .....incidently , who's organising the going away party for TD Finian McGrath and that girl Avril .

oscarBravo · 04-10-2015 3:14pm

Keepan Eye wrote: »

...no one has emerged to represent the 700,000 NO Orphan Voters. The one sided media refuse to acknowledge the existence of this group.

Seriously?

Seriously?!

You're claiming that the media pretended that nobody voted against the referendum?

What have you possibly got to gain by posting something that's completely, objectively, incontrovertibly false?

skooterblue2 · 04-10-2015 10:50pm

eire4 wrote: »

The latest poll numbers:

Why are Fianna Fail down so much? Obviously cos they are not leading the opposition but the government seems to tbe the most unpopular one ever

Grudaire · 05-10-2015 10:19am

skooterblue2 wrote:

Why are Fianna Fail down so much? Obviously cos they are not leading the opposition but the government seems to tbe the most unpopular one ever

Fianna Fail are struggling to evolve past the old guard. Names like Haughey, Hannigan etc keep cropping up.

In addition FF seem to be too busy infighting during the selection process to appear competent (Chambers vs McGuinness, Lennihan not being nominated, Male candidates vs the Gender quotas)

PopePalpatine · 05-10-2015 4:07pm

Keepan Eye wrote: »

Still it will be interesting to see how the 700,000 NO votes in the last Gay referendum will translate in the next General Election. All TD's were in favout of YES .......no one has emerged to represent the 700,000 NO Orphan Voters. The one sided media refuse to acknowledge the existence of this group. [ no surprise there ]. BUT WHO WANTS THOSE 700,000 VOTES ......FF OR FG or a coalition of both. .....incidently , who's organising the going away party for TD Finian McGrath and that girl Avril .

Don't worry, there's always Identity Ireland.

road_high · 05-10-2015 4:45pm

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Why are Fianna Fail down so much? Obviously cos they are not leading the opposition but the government seems to tbe the most unpopular one ever

Because they're autricuous both in opposition and govt- people do have short memories, but not THAT short. It's not yet a mere 5 years since that shower had to sell us out to the IMF, so memories still fresh and as the elevtion beckons people are becoming more focused on who they will actually vote for...

lanos · 05-10-2015 5:37pm

eire4 wrote: »

The latest poll numbers:

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Why are Fianna Fail down so much? Obviously cos they are not leading the opposition but the government seems to tbe the most unpopular one ever

you are commenting on an infographic that was posted in March

General Election 2016

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