Roscommon GAA Discussion Thread

TCDStudent1 · 14-08-2015 9:39am

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

That's an awful long time to be going back to find achievements, John O'Mahony won the senior all ireland the same year but I doubt you'd want him as Roscommon manager today. McStay might prove to be the right man if you get him in but, on the face of it, there's little to suggest that he can achieve any more than John Evans, both managers have had similar success at underage and club level. Also, as a Mayo man, the knives will be out even more quickly for McStay if things don't go well at any point.

To be honest, ditching a coach of a young developing team just after getting promotion to Division one doesn't suggest that the supporters in Roscommon will have realistic expectations of a new man coming in.

Why would Roscommon fans not want O'Mahony?

Fr Tod Umptious · 14-08-2015 1:13pm

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

Why would Roscommon fans not want O'Mahony?

Look at him most recent managerial experience with Mayo.
Nothing better than a QF loss to a average Meath side, a qualifier loss on Longford in June !

And look at Mayo since, 5 Connacht titles and 5 SF appearance at least.

O Manahoy is from what now could be called a different era of management.
A era where the game was far less technical ad it is now.

Roscommon need some one young. If FOD is available again he should be appointed in the morning

padd b1975 · 14-08-2015 3:05pm

I would be fairly certain they will stay inside the county for their next appointment as they have a lot of expense coming up redeveloping Hyde Park.....

megadodge · 14-08-2015 3:11pm

I always thought O'Mahoney was an excellent manager, but his last stint over Mayo was a disaster. Anyway, I don't think O'Mahoney would ever manage Roscommon to be honest. Whether anyone wants to hear it or not, he has quite a history of anti-Roscommon bias, so I really don't think he'd be interested.

I'm not sure Fergie will be taking it either. He has other things on his mind at the moment.

By some considerable distance, Kevin McStay was the best manager I worked under (that's not necessarily saying much though). Very organised, very thorough, very knowledgable, positive and in general is very well-liked by players. If you ever listen to his analysis on TV, it's accurate, well-thought out and never ultra-negative. Having said that, I wonder how badly he'd want it, as he only recently went for the Mayo job, which shows where his loyalties still lie. He doesn't strike me as the bitter type who'd like to get one back on the Mayo CB by leading a Ros team to beat them, so I'm far from confident he'd take it.

Who that leaves us I'm not sure, but I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

rossie1977 · 14-08-2015 10:15pm

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

To be honest, ditching a coach of a young developing team just after getting promotion to Division one doesn't suggest that the supporters in Roscommon will have realistic expectations of a new man coming in.

supporters had nothing to do with evans quitting. the clubs and sponsors were the ones that forced his hand if you believe the rumours that are swirling around.

anyway what are the roscommons supporters realistic ambitions exactly? we haven't even got to a connacht final since 2011 (despite minor/under 21, club and league success during that period) while sligo have gotten to 2 during the same period. speaking of sligo we beat them 6-18 to 12 points in the under 21s this year and that was massively easing off in the second half as we lead 5-9 to 4 points at half time. a number of that sligo under 21 side including the fullback kevin mcdonnell (who was destroyed in the under 21 game) started the senior game then 2 months later and beat us so something is clearly wrong in the senior setup somewhere. btw mcdonnell ended up keeping kilbride scoreless in the senior game..

westmeath in 2003 were in a similar position to us. they had just been promoted to division 1 with a strong underage system in place but had a poor championship outing that year and just like now luke dempsey resigned so its not like this is the first time something like this has happened..

nice_guy80 · 14-08-2015 11:35pm

rossie1977 wrote: »

supporters had nothing to do with evans quitting. the clubs and sponsors were the ones that forced his hand if you believe the rumours that are swirling around.

anyway what are the roscommons supporters realistic ambitions exactly? we haven't even got to a connacht final since 2011 (despite minor/under 21, club and league success during that period) while sligo have gotten to 2 during the same period. speaking of sligo we beat them 6-18 to 12 points in the under 21s this year and that was massively easing off in the second half as we lead 5-9 to 4 points at half time. a number of that sligo under 21 side including the fullback kevin mcdonnell (who was destroyed in the under 21 game) started the senior game then 2 months later and beat us so something is clearly wrong in the senior setup somewhere. btw mcdonnell ended up keeping kilbride scoreless in the senior game..

westmeath in 2003 were in a similar position to us. they had just been promoted to division 1 with a strong underage system in place but had a poor championship outing that year and just like now luke dempsey resigned so its not like this is the first time something like this has happened..

Well, it doesn't help that Kilbride and Murtagh failed fitness tests during the week before the Sligo game, yet Evans started them. A few players on the panel were very disgruntled with starting injured players in a big championship game - and their concerns were borne out. Evans failed to get Roscommon's best 15 on the park v Sligo, Cavan or Fermanagh. In fact, he put on Murtagh v Cavan and he aggravated his injury, thus ruling him out for the Fermanagh game. Where Evans then decided to pull off probably three of the best performing Ros players on the day coming into the last 15 minutes, and then wondered why we collapsed in the final 10 minutes.

GAA managers are judged on championship results and performances. Anyone remember the performance v Armagh in 2014? The one victory on home soil in 2015 (I discount London) was against a 14 man Cavan.

Yes, Mr Evans did very well in the league. in 2015 we still managed to throw away the game v Galway, collapsed v Laois and were gifted a game by the Meath keeper. In the league final Down had a man very harshly sent off to give us a huge advantage.

Cosmo Kramer · 15-08-2015 10:15am

rossie1977 wrote: »

supporters had nothing to do with evans quitting. the clubs and sponsors were the ones that forced his hand if you believe the rumours that are swirling around.

anyway what are the roscommons supporters realistic ambitions exactly? we haven't even got to a connacht final since 2011 (despite minor/under 21, club and league success during that period) while sligo have gotten to 2 during the same period. speaking of sligo we beat them 6-18 to 12 points in the under 21s this year and that was massively easing off in the second half as we lead 5-9 to 4 points at half time. a number of that sligo under 21 side including the fullback kevin mcdonnell (who was destroyed in the under 21 game) started the senior game then 2 months later and beat us so something is clearly wrong in the senior setup somewhere. btw mcdonnell ended up keeping kilbride scoreless in the senior game..

westmeath in 2003 were in a similar position to us. they had just been promoted to division 1 with a strong underage system in place but had a poor championship outing that year and just like now luke dempsey resigned so its not like this is the first time something like this has happened..

A lot of Roscommon supporters I spoke to wanted him gone. Not all by any means but the Evans out crowd definitely seemed to be in the majority especially after they saw what happened to Sligo against Mayo and Tyrone. Roscommon supporters ambitions - well I was talking to one lad after the league who thought this year was maybe just a year too soon for the All Ireland. I don't think that's the general attitude but I get the impression that many expect a Connacht title next year. That doesn't seem realistic to me at all.

I think that a lot of Roscommon followers overestimate the quality of players they have available at the moment based on the under 21 teams, this attitude has maybe spread to the clubs resulting in Evans' achievements being perceived as more down to the players than him. There is potential there but, on average, Roscommon's displays in the last year are a reflection of where they stand in the game - promotion to division 1 was probably a slight overachievement, losing to Sligo away a slight underachievement. Overall Roscommon sit somewhere in the middle of the pack.

gucci · 22-09-2015 10:16am

McStay to be interviewed next week:

Link from Irish Times

wow sierra · 27-09-2015 5:35pm

Roscommon Senior Football Championship Semi Finals today in Kiltoom

Padraig Pearses 2.12 Roscommon Gaels 0.10
St.Brigids 0.12 Clan na nGael 0.14

Sets up a brilliant prospect for the final!

seligehgit · 27-09-2015 6:18pm

wow sierra wrote: »

Roscommon Senior Football Championship Semi Finals today in Kiltoom

Padraig Pearses 2.12 Roscommon Gaels 0.10
St.Brigids 0.12 Clan na nGael 0.14

Sets up a brilliant prospect for the final!

Was it a shock that St. Brigids were beaten?They seemed to be in decline based on last year's Connaught club championship...

Syferus · 27-09-2015 7:09pm

seligehgit wrote: »

Was it a shock that St. Brigids were beaten?They seemed to be in decline based on last year's Connaught club championship...

Of course it's a shock. Frankie (black) and Garvan Dolan sent off meant Brigids spent nearly all the second half with 14 men, and key players like Darragh Donnelly and Georoid Cuniffe were out too. But fair play to Clann - clearly the better side, even when it was 15v15.

Really exciting county final in prospect now.

Colash · 27-09-2015 7:11pm

These results today will do the world of good for roscommon club football

yabadabado · 27-09-2015 7:13pm

No harm to see a change .Brigid's have had a superb run but all good things come to an end.

Colash · 27-09-2015 7:19pm

I'd love to see the next few years county finals being contested between the likes of pearses , boyle , castlerea , clann , bridgets , and Ros gaels . There's a lot of young footballers coming through on all these sides an the future looks bright for ros football

Addle · 29-09-2015 1:09am

https://mobile.twitter.com/cooney_ian/status/648590338483978240

Addle · 29-09-2015 1:16am

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/kevin-mcstay-ready-for-new-role-as-roscommon-manager-1.2370334
Two Mayo men and one Roscommon man.
Too many chiefs?

blowitupref · 29-09-2015 3:07am

Addle wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/kevin-mcstay-ready-for-new-role-as-roscommon-manager-1.2370334
Two Mayo men and one Roscommon man.
Too many chiefs?

Modern day management has loads of chiefs. On paper that is a good management team that Roscommon have in place and they could finally have a good chance to fulfilling the potential of their panel in the championship.

Fr Tod Umptious · 29-09-2015 8:31am

Joint managers eh ?

Unlike the now unraveling Mayo situation, where the jointed managers have worked successfully together before, this setup seems to be a way of trying to please everyone.

Not sure if it will work.

Always_Running · 29-09-2015 9:40am

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Joint managers eh ?

Unlike the now unraveling Mayo situation, where the jointed managers have worked successfully together before, this setup seems to be a way of trying to please everyone.

Not sure if it will work.

in fairness this joint Ros managers won't be under the pressure to deliver like Mayos were e.g All Ireland or bust.

nice_guy80 · 29-09-2015 12:00pm

That is a fairly strong management setup, with good coaches.
I like David Casey being involved.

The logistics of training a county like Roscommon are hard, with so many players working out of the county.
If we could tempt one or two more lads home from abroad I think we'd have the makings of a right good panel

Shurimgreat · 29-09-2015 1:54pm

Fair play to Roscommon. Its unfortunate that Mayo couldn't reach some sort of compromise with McStay last year rather than give up so easily. There's little pressure on the Roscommon management at this stage so probably an ideal situation to be in. Division 1 football will bring the county on no end. Roscommon's gain is Mayo's loss.

yabadabado · 29-09-2015 2:06pm

nice_guy80 wrote: »

That is a fairly strong management setup, with good coaches.
I like David Casey being involved.

The logistics of training a county like Roscommon are hard, with so many players working out of the county.
If we could tempt one or two more lads home from abroad I think we'd have the makings of a right good panel

What player's are abroad who would be options for the squad ?

megadodge · 29-09-2015 10:35pm

megadodge wrote: »

I always thought O'Mahoney was an excellent manager, but his last stint over Mayo was a disaster. Anyway, I don't think O'Mahoney would ever manage Roscommon to be honest. Whether anyone wants to hear it or not, he has quite a history of anti-Roscommon bias, so I really don't think he'd be interested.

I'm not sure Fergie will be taking it either. He has other things on his mind at the moment.

By some considerable distance, Kevin McStay was the best manager I worked under (that's not necessarily saying much though). Very organised, very thorough, very knowledgable, positive and in general is very well-liked by players. If you ever listen to his analysis on TV, it's accurate, well-thought out and never ultra-negative. Having said that, I wonder how badly he'd want it, as he only recently went for the Mayo job, which shows where his loyalties still lie. He doesn't strike me as the bitter type who'd like to get one back on the Mayo CB by leading a Ros team to beat them, so I'm far from confident he'd take it.

Who that leaves us I'm not sure, but I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

Well, it looks like I was about as wrong as it gets. But I don't mind, I really rate Kevin. However, along with others I'm wondering about the 'joint' bit of the equation. Although they are nice guys and very passionate about their football, both Fergie and Kevin are used to being THE man, so it will be interesting to see if that causes any friction behind the scenes. Hopefully it won't.

Comic Book Guy · 29-09-2015 10:51pm

megadodge wrote: »

Well, it looks like I was about as wrong as it gets. But I don't mind, I really rate Kevin. However, along with others I'm wondering about the 'joint' bit of the equation. Although they are nice guys and very passionate about their football, both Fergie and Kevin are used to being THE man, so it will be interesting to see if that causes any friction behind the scenes. Hopefully it won't.

Yeah the "joint" thing is a bit of a worry. Ultimately who makes the call when a substitution is to be made with 10 mins left of a tight championship game if MCStay wants to introduce one player and fergie reckons another man would do a better job.
I'm sure these things and their relationship will be worked on and developed.

Genuinely exciting appointment, massive knowledge and experience in that management and coaching team. While I would expect an immediate rise in championship performance next year, I think 2-3 years time things could really click given the teams age profile.

Syferus · 29-09-2015 11:30pm

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Joint managers eh ?

Unlike the now unraveling Mayo situation, where the jointed managers have worked successfully together before, this setup seems to be a way of trying to please everyone.

Not sure if it will work.

1. We like our joint-managers. Mayo's panel and half their populace didn't even like theirs' at the beginning.

2. McStay and FOD are both Ros Gaels men who have known each other for decades.

3. Mayo people are bargaining because if he had been available (and the Mayo CB hadn't publicly sh!t on him last Autumn) McStay was the obvious choice to replace the duo that are now dead in the water. Indeed rumours suggest the Mayo panel requested the CB get McStay very recently.

4. McStay had more than enough steam to get the job as a solo venture and given how FOD shied away from continuing in the job in 2011 it seems clear Kevin actively headhunted FOD to be joint-manager. McStay is the man to organise a management team and FOD is a manager who makes players want to burst through walls for him. I think it's a very good pairing.

TCDStudent1 · 29-09-2015 11:48pm

Syferus wrote: »

1. We like our joint-managers. Mayo's panel and half their populace didn't even like theirs' at the beginning.

2. McStay and FOD are both Ros Gaels men who have known each other for decades.

3. Mayo people are bargaining because if he had been available (and the Mayo CB hadn't publicly sh!t on him last Autumn) McStay was the obvious choice to replace the duo that are now dead in the water. Indeed rumours suggest the Mayo panel requested the CB get McStay very recently.

4. McStay had more than enough steam to get the job as a solo venture and given how FOD shied away from continuing in the job in 2011 it seems clearly Kevin actively headhunted FOD to be a joint-manager. McStay is the man to organised a management team and FOD is a manager who makes players wants to burst through ways for him. I think it's a very good pairing.

Didn't they also tell the Mayo CB that they didn't want McStay because he'd bring in McHale back when the Mayo job was open?

McStay / O'Donnell looks the perfect combination to me for Roscommon. Will be interesting to see how they get on.

What would Roscommon fans consider a successful 2016? What is the minimum McStay / O'Donnell would have to achieve to be considered a success?

Shurimgreat · 30-09-2015 12:14am

I think everyone, including in Mayo wish Kevin McStay the best in his role. It's been a long time coming for him. Roscommon probably one of the underperformers of Gaelic football, and there's tradition there in the county. I'm sure he has objectives, but getting Roscommon to Croke Park in July or August in the first year must be one of them. There's no reason why a Division 1 side can't make it to an AI quarter final.

Syferus · 30-09-2015 12:58pm

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

Didn't they also tell the Mayo CB that they didn't want McStay because he'd bring in McHale back when the Mayo job was open?

McStay / O'Donnell looks the perfect combination to me for Roscommon. Will be interesting to see how they get on.

What would Roscommon fans consider a successful 2016? What is the minimum McStay / O'Donnell would have to achieve to be considered a success?

It was the Mayo CB board who told the media that the panel didn't want McHale. Given how untrustworthy the process the Mayo CB set up was the conclusion to be drawn is pretty obvious, and backed up by what I've heard from Mayo supporters.

rossie1977 · 01-10-2015 4:48pm

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

What would Roscommon fans consider a successful 2016? What is the minimum McStay / O'Donnell would have to achieve to be considered a success?

i can't speak for every roscommon person but for me, i would consider retaining division 1 status and a connacht championship a successful season

i think the minimum requirement should we go down would at least be putting up good performances and not have something like 2008 happen again where we got beaten out the gate in matches when we got promoted to a higher level. a connacht final or 4th round of the qualifiers at the very least (should we lose early in connacht to mayo or galway) has to be the aim for the championship..otherwise people will start to question whether getting rid of evans was a smart idea

Colash · 01-10-2015 5:18pm

A good showing in division 1 , and also a Connaught title is a must .

Roscommon GAA Discussion Thread

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