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Mayo GAA Discussion Thread

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  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional West Moderators Posts: 16,722 Mod ✭✭✭✭yop


    Hoping that was our poor performance of the year, the pressure of the distraction told on the forwards I think who on another day should have been 3 in front at the break.
    O'Shea was immense today, made a real difference. Feel Dillion is having a poor season in compared to his usual self.
    Wind didn't help but we were wasteful and indecisive and while we got a very wide point, the ref was shocking, to both sides, but certainly any touch of a Sligo man received a free.
    No harm in seeing some "growl" at the end with Moran, the lad is impressing me no end this season.
    Positives and negatives but we still won it by playing poor.

    On a final note, "We have won something without you".


  • Registered Users Posts: 52 ✭✭Emmet Ryan


    Well it doesn't hurt to have one bad day if you can come out with a win and learn from it. I was impressed with Keane's performance at the back and Aidan O'Shea did a great job off the bench.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,590 ✭✭✭Blackjack


    Emmet Ryan wrote: »
    Well it doesn't hurt to have one bad day if you can come out with a win and learn from it. I was impressed with Keane's performance at the back and Aidan O'Shea did a great job off the bench.

    Good analysis (as usual) in your blog post by the way.


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,930 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    The Positives
    Great game by Moran at midfield, good to see him step up a gear when the opposition got some bit tougher
    Great to see Aidan O' Shea back and make a big impact at midfield
    Again the backs did well
    The ball was moved quickly out of defence and midfield
    And after all the furore all week about Mortimer we are now back under the radar thanks to a poor performance.

    The Negatives
    The constant indecision and lack of incentive in the forwards is just painful to watch.
    You can see games being thrown away in front of your eyes as forwards decide to try and gain another few feet with a pass to a colleague, rather that just take the shot on.
    Michael Conroy is still not up to championship standard

    It really reminded me of last year final, Mayo show composure and experience and pull ahead in the last 10 minutes.
    But last year we had the weather to blam for the poor quality of play, there is no excuse this time.


  • Registered Users Posts: 48,129 ✭✭✭✭km79


    After semi final defeat last year I felt we were probably a little below Cork Kerry and Dublin due to lack of scoring inside forwards. But with Conor Mortimer coming back this year I thought maybe with a bit of luck we could bridge the gap this year. Pat Harte too was looking good this year so we seemed to have options a plenty in the forward line. Not so much now :(
    I don't know how anyone can justify selecting Doherty ahead of Mortimer or Freeman. He never even looked liked scoring. Varley spent most of his 45 mins in behind his man. Conroy looked livlier but was very erratic.
    Can't for the life of me understand Cillian being played CF. Given out problems in the corners move him back in there !!!
    As I said it's a pity about Pat Harte as he could perhaps have filled the no11 slot then.
    Aidan O Shea was immense !!! Looks a bit heavy but has 3 weeks to get fitter. If not fully fit then maybe he could play CF and Seamie in the middle replacing Geraghty.
    We are still probably in the chasing pack and need injuries to clear up and hope no more crop up. And we need a good draw and then sure ya never know :)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,706 ✭✭✭premierstone


    yop wrote: »
    On a final note, "We have won something without you".

    I think even a blind man could see he would have been a help yesterday, If anyone thinks the 6 forwards that lined out yesterday are better than Mortimer, they should take up a new hobby! Mortimer won plenty of Connaught titles aswell!


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,930 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    I think even a blind man could see he would have been a help yesterday, If anyone thinks the 6 forwards that lined out yesterday are better than Mortimer, they should take up a new hobby! Mortimer won plenty of Connaught titles aswell!

    He certainly would have improved things up front but the reality is that he is not coming back so Mayo have to win with the forwards they have, and there is a lot of work to do there.


  • Registered Users Posts: 413 ✭✭Seans_Username


    I think the ref really affected the game. Stopped Mayo breaking quickly by calling every little decision. I don't like criticising refs - fair enough if he got some decisions wrong, that's expected - but he didn't need to call up all the little things. Slowed the game down hugely and the game would have been a lot better had he let some stuff go.

    It was a poor enough performance (bar the last few minutes) but the Connaught finals are always close. Although there should have been more between them, indecision around the Sligo goal was horrible.

    One thing I'm hoping for is that that game was the poor performance of the year. They needed it after the Leitrim game. Delighted that they're straight through to Croke Park now! :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,706 ✭✭✭premierstone


    He certainly would have improved things up front but the reality is that he is not coming back so Mayo have to win with the forwards they have, and there is a lot of work to do there.

    Completely agree, but I hate this attitude of he's gone now so its ok to slag him off and take pot shots, the man did an awfull lot for Mayo football and that should'nt be forgotten.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,117 ✭✭✭Defiler Of The Coffin


    I think most of what needs to be said has been said but this line from the Irish Times stuck out to me:
    ARE MAYO at last learning to win ugly?

    Down through the years we've seen too many good Mayo teams lose matches they should've won. The All-Irelands in '89 and '96 are probably the best (worst?) examples. We've proven twice this year we can get down and dirty if need be. If Horan can fix the anaemic forward line I think this Mayo team could surprise us all.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,930 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    I think most of what needs to be said has been said but this line from the Irish Times stuck out to me:



    Down through the years we've seen too many good Mayo teams lose matches they should've won. The All-Irelands in '89 and '96 are probably the best (worst?) examples. We've proven twice this year we can get down and dirty if need be. If Horan can fix the anaemic forward line I think this Mayo team could surprise us all.

    But Horan is now in his second year and the forward line is more anaemic than it has every been.

    What exactly is the root of the problem ?

    Are the forwards too unsure to take on shots ?
    Are they trained to just keep hand-passing until the next man is more open than yourself ?
    Are they coming up against massed defences and not getting the chance to shoot ?
    Or are they just not good enough ?

    I though they moved the ball well out the field yesterday, very little hand passing , but my god was it frustrating to watch them not take their chances.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,681 ✭✭✭ColeTrain


    I think most of what needs to be said has been said but this line from the Irish Times stuck out to me:



    Down through the years we've seen too many good Mayo teams lose matches they should've won. The All-Irelands in '89 and '96 are probably the best (worst?) examples. We've proven twice this year we can get down and dirty if need be. If Horan can fix the anaemic forward line I think this Mayo team could surprise us all.

    I think an ugly win is what was needed. a 6-8 point win yesterday would have taught us nothing. At least the players got a high intensity game which they managed to close out. You can already see people writing us off now and that's no harm but I think there is another big game left in us.
    Barry Moran answered some critics yesterday. Big performance from him and he needs to continue it. Aiden O'Sheas performance was badly needed. We need a physical presence in the centre and we need him match fit.
    Keane, Boyle, Andy Moran and Dillion were also good.
    We were frustrating at times. Very guilty of not taking easy scores in the first half. Some of our passing into the half forward line was poor too. Overall I'm happy with any win because there were stages where Sligo seemed to take a score from nothing and their fans were shouting louder than ours. I was relieved when the whistle went.


    Re the Mortimer saga, that's a Connacht medal he doesn't have now. I've no doubt he would have came off the bench yesterday and probably would have gotten a couple of scores but if he doesn't want to fill that role then that's his decision. Nobody can be guaranteed a start, Mortimer certainly isn't that good to make demands like that. Hopefully the likes of Freeman, Varley, Doherty and Conroy can hit some form in the coming weeks to take the pressure of Moran, Dillion and O'Connor in Croker.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,117 ✭✭✭Defiler Of The Coffin


    But Horan is now in his second year and the forward line is more anaemic than it has every been

    It seems that way, but the likes of Doherty and Freeman showed serious promise last year, Doherty was going crazy scoring goals soon after his debut. I certainly didn't forsee them playing the way they did yesterday. Even Michael Conroy had an off-day. Maybe Horan hasn't concentrated enough on the shooting? Whatever it is hard questions were asked yesterday and hopefully we'll have a few answered for the quarter final!


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,750 ✭✭✭Panrich


    But Horan is now in his second year and the forward line is more anaemic than it has every been.

    What exactly is the root of the problem ?

    Are the forwards too unsure to take on shots ?
    Are they trained to just keep hand-passing until the next man is more open than yourself ?
    Are they coming up against massed defences and not getting the chance to shoot ?
    Or are they just not good enough ?

    I though they moved the ball well out the field yesterday, very little hand passing , but my god was it frustrating to watch them not take their chances.

    I think that there is a mixture of things but one of the big problems we have is that our forwards are not very big or strong physically and in these days of massed defences you need to be able to break tackles and compete for balls that are less than 50-50. Think Murphy and McFadden of Donegal, McMenamon of Dublin and O'Connor from Kildare as good examples of what I'm talking about. We have Andy Moran who can fight his corner but after that we are struggling.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,965 ✭✭✭Syferus


    yop wrote: »
    Hoping that was our poor performance of the year, the pressure of the distraction told on the forwards I think who on another day should have been 3 in front at the break.
    O'Shea was immense today, made a real difference. Feel Dillion is having a poor season in compared to his usual self.
    Wind didn't help but we were wasteful and indecisive and while we got a very wide point, the ref was shocking, to both sides, but certainly any touch of a Sligo man received a free.
    No harm in seeing some "growl" at the end with Moran, the lad is impressing me no end this season.
    Positives and negatives but we still won it by playing poor.

    On a final note, "We have won something without you".

    You mean Barry I assume. Insane stuff by him and Mayo in general at the end, wildly dangerous tackling. Cynical fouling is one thing but Mayo looked headless near the end and were literally trying to inflict the same state upon Sligo.

    That stuff isn't growl, it's what'll lose you ten times more games than it'll win. No place in the sport for that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,965 ✭✭✭Syferus


    Oh, and because all you Mayoweens are such lovely lads:

    rossieconnacht5-1.jpg


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 349 ✭✭jibber5000


    Given the state of Connaught football I don't think we should be that carried away with the win..come the quarter final can anyone actually see us scoring more than 11 or 12 points?? Ders no way I can and when arguably the three best forwards in mayo club football at the moment aren't in the panel you can see that realistically Wer heading for a 7 or 8 point beating if we get to the semi final..we are further away from an all Ireland final than last year as cork are roughly a 8 or 9 point better team with all their forwards back this year..and if mort was fourth choice corner forward behind those guys yesterday it's little wonder he left as the manager obviously has zero knowledge bout scoring forwards


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,965 ✭✭✭Syferus


    jibber5000 wrote: »
    Given the state of Connaught football I don't think we should be that carried away with the win..come the quarter final can anyone actually see us scoring more than 11 or 12 points?? Ders no way I can and when arguably the three best forwards in mayo club football at the moment aren't in the panel you can see that realistically Wer heading for a 7 or 8 point beating if we get to the semi final..we are further away from an all Ireland final than last year as cork are roughly a 8 or 9 point better team with all their forwards back this year..and if mort was fourth choice corner forward behind those guys yesterday it's little wonder he left as the manager obviously has zero knowledge bout scoring forwards

    Andy Moran is your best forward, club or county. I'd go as far as to say he's now the best forward in the entire province.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 349 ✭✭jibber5000


    Syferus wrote: »
    jibber5000 wrote: »
    Given the state of Connaught football I don't think we should be that carried away with the win..come the quarter final can anyone actually see us scoring more than 11 or 12 points?? Ders no way I can and when arguably the three best forwards in mayo club football at the moment aren't in the panel you can see that realistically Wer heading for a 7 or 8 point beating if we get to the semi final..we are further away from an all Ireland final than last year as cork are roughly a 8 or 9 point better team with all their forwards back this year..and if mort was fourth choice corner forward behind those guys yesterday it's little wonder he left as the manager obviously has zero knowledge bout scoring forwards

    Andy Moran is your best forward, club or county. I'd go as far as to say he's now the best forward in the entire province.

    Good forward but is he going to score four or five points in a game?? No and I am saying he's miles ahead of the rest of the inside forward line..he's more of a link man and I wouldn't expect him to be a big scorer as he's spent most of his football career in the half back or half forward


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,930 ✭✭✭✭Fr Tod Umptious


    I watched the first half of the game on TV last night and to be fair the forwards were not a poor in the first half as I thought while watching it in the flesh on Sunday.

    From where I was down the other end of the field I though they were very slow to shoot and almost afraid to shoot.

    But from what I saw on TV Vaughan in the 29th minute was the only one really guilty of not taking a point when he had a clear cut chance to do so, instead he passed it inside and Sligo cleared.

    Sligo to give them credit defended very well, Ross O' Donavan made two huge plays in the first half, the shoulder on Doherthy and the block down.
    Higgins and Andy Moran also had two attempts at fisted points that 9 times out of 10 would have gone over.
    And Barry Moran's shot on goal, although a little weak, was still will saved/cleared.
    Killian O' Conor could have done better however and I hope it was just an off day, too often in the past Mayo have found good free takers one year only for them to loose form the next year.

    All that being said it is easier to watch the game knowing that the misses in the end did not loose them the game but overall I though the forwards did open up Sligo a few times and on another day would have had three goals to count for their efforts.

    The commentator also mentioned something about a Mayo policy for trying to manufacture goal chances, I would have to listen to it again to get the full jist of what he was saying but I hope this is not a philosophy that Horan has taken from the dying minutes of the 1996 Final and reply, where Mayo tried to walk the ball into the net instead of taking the points that would have won them the All Ireland.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,378 ✭✭✭Duffy the Vampire Slayer


    yop wrote: »

    On a final note, "We have won something without you".

    Winning a Connacht title is nothing for Mayo to be singing about.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,656 ✭✭✭cgpg5


    Galway man, big Mayo connections.

    Anyway, I dunno about ye but I never thought Mayo were in any real danger on Sunday. On paper a 2 point win looks very hard earned but in truth it could and probably should have been a lot more. Mayo also looked like they had a lot more in them all game. Saying that a 2 point win over a game (yet limited) side like Sligo is far better for Mayo going forward than a massacre. However, had Moran's goal been given (was criminal to disallow it imo), I think Mayo would have coasted from there.

    Anyway,
    The postives- 2 Connacht titles in a row. mayo have now firmly established themselves as the best team in Connacht. After two great years in 04 and 06, Mayo subsequently went on to relinquish the Connacht title. Not this time.

    - Midfield. Mayo now have 5 very good options in the middle and a first choice pairing (Barry Moran and AOS) who will trouble any side. Mid is the most crucial department in any side

    - Mayo always have a huge performance in them. Tyrone 04, Dublin 06, Cork 11, Kerry league 12, Mayo have shown that on their day they can beat anyone.

    - Good backs. Each of the backs was solid on SUnday and Keane was immense (he would have been previously regarded as the lesser of the 6). The half backs and KH charge up the pitch at will and this caused problems for SLigo and will for other teams.

    - A hammering of Leitrim (with a good degree of ruthlessness) and an ugly victory of sorts. Not a bad combination tbh

    Negatives

    - Corner forwards. Put O'Connor in the corner please. Or maybe even McLoughlin to act as a sweeper or Geraghty as a 3rd man midfield. But not those 2 again!

    - Wides. Some were frankly awful. Also a fear of shooting at times appeared a worry.

    - Alan Dillon runs into trouble far too much.

    - Freetaking. Hoping it was a once-off. A good freetaker is often the difference between winning and losing.

    - How will Mayo play against a team at their perceived level? I fear this is the type of team they may need to avoid. (e.g Kildare) Meath 09 was a case in point.

    - Mayo can lose daft games. Saying that bar Meath in 09 it rarely happens in Croker in the latter stages.

    A lot to look forward to


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,003 ✭✭✭blowitupref


    Syferus wrote: »
    Andy Moran is your best forward, club or county. I'd go as far as to say he's now the best forward in the entire province.

    Andy Moran is a fine footballer and leader however he's far from the best forward in Connacht even Leitrim's Emlyn Mulligan is a better scoring forward.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,965 ✭✭✭Syferus


    jibber5000 wrote: »
    Good forward but is he going to score four or five points in a game?? No and I am saying he's miles ahead of the rest of the inside forward line..he's more of a link man and I wouldn't expect him to be a big scorer as he's spent most of his football career in the half back or half forward

    You see, you're confusing yourself. You said 'forward', not 'scoring forward'. There's a big difference. You can be an All-Star forward without scoring five points a match and you can be an average forward and score six points if you're a free-taker. It's also about being big enough for the moment and not having your highlight plays or points coming when there's little pressure on.

    Andy Moran hasn't been a scoring forward but he disrupts defences and opens space for lesser players to get scores. I'd also argue his scoring threat has increased significantly these past two seasons. He's one of the most complete forwards in the country, as an athlete, a passer, a scorer and as a leader. You're very lucky to have him.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,289 ✭✭✭Padkir


    Syferus wrote: »
    You see, you're confusing yourself. You said 'forward', not 'scoring forward'. There's a big difference. You can be an All-Star forward without scoring five points a match and you can be an average forward and score six points if you're a free-taker. It's also about being big enough for the moment and not having your highlight plays or points coming when there's little pressure on.

    Andy Moran hasn't been a scoring forward but he disrupts defences and opens space for lesser players to get scores. I'd also argue his scoring threat has increased significantly these past two seasons. He's one of the most complete forwards in the country, as an athlete, a passer, a scorer and as a leader. You're very lucky to have him.

    I agree with this! However (although he did well inside on Sunday), he should be playing further out the field, he's a link man, not a full forward. If he comes out to gather the ball and is then looking for a pass we now have no full forward, whereas if he was centre forward with O'Connor on the square it would make more sense. O'Connor needs to be close to goal to do damage from play!

    Think people are a bit unfair about his free-taking Sunday too, the wind was horrible, blowing across the field and gusting unexpectedly every now and again! He's a good lad and he won't let that bother him, I expect normal service to resume from the frees next day out! Also, he's a big lad well able to win his own ball, so put him in at the edge of the square and see what he can do!
    Hopefully this is Mayos poor game over them and they can step it up from now on! Defence is good (Keane and Cafferky were very solid both in the air and on the ground), just need to get some confidence flowing in the forwards!


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional West Moderators Posts: 16,722 Mod ✭✭✭✭yop


    Syferus wrote: »
    You mean Barry I assume. Insane stuff by him and Mayo in general at the end, wildly dangerous tackling. Cynical fouling is one thing but Mayo looked headless near the end and were literally trying to inflict the same state upon Sligo.

    That stuff isn't growl, it's what'll lose you ten times more games than it'll win. No place in the sport for that.

    If it wins us titles we in Mayo will live with it, too many years we have been too nice, so having a bit of aggression will do us no harm.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,681 ✭✭✭ColeTrain


    yop wrote: »
    If it wins us titles we in Mayo will live with it, too many years we have been too nice, so having a bit of aggression will do us no harm.

    The fouling at the end was what we had to do. It would have been criminal to let them walk through on goal.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,965 ✭✭✭Syferus


    ColeTrain wrote: »
    The fouling at the end was what we had to do. It would have been criminal to let them walk through on goal.

    See, that wasn't the problem. The cynical fouling is a sad but very real fact of life of the sport. The horse-collar tackles Mayo pulled on numerous occasions near the end were seriously dangerous and Barry Moran, and indeed others, probably deserved straight reds if we were living in a world where rules were applied equally throughout a match.

    It's one thing to have an edge, another entirely to revert to a team of sledgers. Those sorts of reckless tackles will cost a team games, not close them out.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,681 ✭✭✭ColeTrain


    Syferus wrote: »
    See, that wasn't the problem. The cynical fouling is a sad but very real fact of life of the sport. The horse-collar tackles Mayo pulled on numerous occasions near the end were seriously dangerous and Barry Moran, and indeed others, probably deserved straight reds if we were living in a world where rules were applied equally throughout a match.

    It's one thing to have an edge, another entirely to revert to a team of sledgers. Those sorts of reckless tackles will cost a team games, not close them out.

    I remember two tackles from Moran and Dillion. Both were in injury team of a Connacht final with 2 points in it. You say sledgers, I call it being smart.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,590 ✭✭✭Blackjack


    ColeTrain wrote: »
    I remember two tackles from Moran and Dillion. Both were in injury team of a Connacht final with 2 points in it. You say sledgers, I call it being smart.

    Both got yellow cards for them too, so rules were being applied equally on those tackles.

    If it had to be done to prevent a goal, then it had to be done.


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