RTE Announce FTA Saorsat service

OT
During 1970s I listened to Manx radio regularly on an attic aerial made of cut up TV coax and a German VHF/SW/MW/LW valve radio. Near mouth of Belfast Lough in Co. Antrim.

Years later I've chatted to Manx Amateurs via their Repeater in 145MHz band from near the Beach in Millisle, Co. Down with a 10W mobile radio and 1/4 wave whip. Must have been 2005 +/-

Question in the Dál last week on Saorsat and areas that will not receive terrestrial TV after ASO.

Telecommunications Services
Wednesday, 22 June 2011

124. Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív asked the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources his plans or those of RTÉ to inform the public of their options in areas in which RTÉ intend abandoning its present broadcasting network in late 2012; the location at which satellite is proposed; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [16640/11]

Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources (Deputy Pat Rabbitte): RTÉ is an independent national public service broadcaster whose remit and obligations are set out in the Broadcasting Act 2009. In relation to the broadcasting network, section 130(1)(b)(i)(II) of the Act provides that RTÉ shall provide a digital TV network by 31 December 2011 capable of providing coverage to the same extent as its existing analogue TV network.

While I have no function in relation to the development or operation by RTÉ, or its subsidiary RTÉNL, of its broadcast infrastructure, I understand from the company that the analogue TV network uses 150 sites and provides 98% population coverage. I also understand that the RTÉ digital terrestrial television (DTT) network, which launched on 26th May 2011 and is providing the Saorview service, will also be capable of providing 98% coverage from 51 sites.

In relation to the proposed RTÉ Saorsat service, this is a satellite-based broadcast service being developed independently by RTÉ on a commercial basis and the service is currently undergoing testing by RTÉ. I understand from the company that, once established, the service is expected to provide ‘free to air’ TV reception of the RTÉ TV channels to virtually 100% of the population. The provision of information to the public in relation to the Saorview and Saorsat services is a matter for RTÉ. In that regard, since the national launch of the Saorview service on 26th May 2011, RTÉ and the other broadcasters have been operating a substantial Saorview information and awareness campaign to inform the general public about the availability of the new national digital TV network. In addition RTÉ has established a dedicated website – www.saorview.ie – and a telephone helpline to assist the public to access Saorview.

In addition, as Minister with responsibility for broadcasting, I have promised to deliver a substantial information campaign on the switch-off of the analogue signal and the necessity for the digital switchover. This information campaign, which is currently being developed by my Department, is planned to launch in October 2011. The aim of this campaign will be to ensure that TV households throughout the country are made aware of analogue switch-off and of the range of options available to them for going digital.

In conjunction with this, my Department is also currently developing plans to ensure that a range of practical assistance is made available, in particular, to address the particular needs of vulnerable households as they prepare to go digital. In this context, the expertise and local knowledge of the many voluntary and charity organisations around the country will be of critical importance to ensuring the success of the switchover process. I have asked my Department to ensure that, to the greatest possible extent, these organisations play a major part in our digital switchover information and assistance campaign.

http://debates.oireachtas.ie/dail/2011/06/22/00105.asp#N2

He didn't answer the question in relation to the location of the satellite that will carry the service. I don't think either RTÉ or the Dept have ever officially indicated from which satellite or position the Saorsat service will be available since it was officially announced last July.

Neekall wrote: »

Is Ka-Sat Tooway service being provided right now across Europe? in countries where they need a license are they already registered? e.g. Spain, Italy?

List of European retailers here - http://www.tooway.com/Purchase/(country)/Ireland

You just need to put a splitter in the cable, one port with DC power passing from the Tooway modem, and power blocked on the other port to the satellite receiver.
Similar to page 15 of the installer's manual. Eventhough they show a 2-cable setup, the principle is the same.


http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=72761297&postcount=1287



Maplin have such splitters.
http://www.maplin.co.uk/2-way-satellite-splitter-9273


P.S. If you put a requirement that "only comment if you have used these newer tooway LNBs that have a beeper inside for allignment", then you're going to be waiting a hell of a long time for anyone to reply.

*Make sure* your splitter has power blocking on one leg/port. A standard splitter (all ports power pass) will cause damage to the receiver and/or TRIA.

There's a good chance the RX port is active and you could hook it up directly to the receiver. But to be on the safe side use the splitter to prevent damage e.g.

Tooway TRIA RX -> IN PORT -> OUT PORT (Power Block) -> Receiver

For these setups, power to the TX port powers the entire unit. No power required on the RX port, so use splitter to block it.

To be honest, having read what you've posted about the RM4100 unit, you're probably wasting your time. It looks like the RX LO is either 19.4GHz or 20.5GHz, so the output is on the B-band rather than on the L-band.

You can buy DirecTV upconverters which will shift the B-band output up to L-band for the receiver, but nobody seems to know how to get them to switch on.

http://cgi.ebay.com/B-Band-Converter-BBC-Module-SUP-2400-Directv-/270689590509?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f065b5ced

The RM4200 model is the one you want, with RX output in 1000-1500MHz range.

Neekall wrote: »

Thanks Cush, I already know the distributor as I am using them myself but was wondering if they are actually licenses by the Spanish regulator - I don't want to use this service and then discover that I need to license it

I'm not 100% sure what you mean.

Are you referring to an individual user requiring a licence to uplink and downlink from the satellite? If so this part of the spectrum is licence exempt throughout Europe - 19.7-20.2 GHz (down) and 29.5-30.0 GHz (up)

Sorry, I picked this up wrong. I thought the R4000, RM4100 were models of LNB/TRIA, but they're the modem models. So maybe the TRIAs are the same, and it has 2 different RX LOs.

OK then, leave the modem attached to the TX port, fit your cable with DC block on the RX port and plug it into the analyzer, and see if you can see a peak. An analyzer will tell you much quicker than a receiver will.

Neekall wrote: »

I'm asking about the tooway operators in Spain whether they are licensed for ka-band VSAT services? I understand that the operator needs a general authorisation and a VSAT ka-band license. I'm pretty sure they have a general authorisation , but not certain if they are legally providing ka-band services?

I would assume the 5 Spanish providers have the necessary licences - http://www.tooway.com/Purchase/(country)/Spain

I started looking in to Saorsat as an alternative to Saorview at the end of April; after I was advised that my ‘marginal’ location in south Belfast, is too far north to receive the digital terrestrial signal from Clermont Carn (both now and after DSO.)

I contacted Eutelsat UK regarding reception of the Eurobird™ 9A (Ka-Sat) satellite. They subsequently referred me to the RoI distributors section of the Tooway.com website.

Today I enquired with my nearest distributor (Digiweb Ltd in Dundalk) about purchasing a Tooway satellite dish and Tria, for the purposes of obtaining Saorsat. The Sales Representative I am dealing with is currently awaiting some information from their technical support section. It seemed to me that their technical support staff were fairly au fait with Saorsat enquiries, as they seemed clear about the details the Sales Rep relayed on my behalf. I’m expecting a call-back with (hopefully) some reasonable figures on pricing the kit.

With this in mind, and looking at the forum posts to date, would I have success with the following set-up:

• Tooway satellite dish
• Tooway Tria
• 2-Way Satellite Splitter (Leave DC power to Modem port live; but block power on other (to a Linux receiver.)

If workable, here’s me next query:

Could I attach a standard Multi-Feed LNB bar/holder to the Tooway Tria (or that area), in order to include Ku-Band LNBs aligned to:

• Astra 28.2°E
• Hotbird 13.0°E

Linux Receiver:

What would be the best budget Linux receiver? I’ve seen the following names on various posts, and would appreciate some feedback:

• VU+ Duo
• VU+ Solo
  
• Spider Box
• Az Box
• Q-Box

I understand that whatever STB I choose, it needs to have a D1.0 or D1.1 DiSEqC switch.

*As always folks, any help, advice or instruction that can be offered, is greatly appreciated here!*

dmcdream wrote: »

FYI – A response I received from RTÉ Transmission Network Support at the end of May, regarding Saorsat reception in Belfast:

…“…in answer to your query regarding reception of Saorsat, please be advised that we are currently engaged in a technical trial on the satellite mentioned below in your email [Eutelsat Eurobird™ 9A ‘Ka-Sat’ antenna].

So they finally indicate that Saorsat and Ka-Sat are linked, albeit not publically but in an email to someone outside the inner circle.

dmcdream wrote: »

Today I enquired with my nearest distributor (Digiweb Ltd in Dundalk) about purchasing a Tooway satellite dish and Tria, for the purposes of obtaining Saorsat.

Let us know what price they quote for above.

Multisat setups for Tooway dishes are described in the Installers Manual and posted previously.



Before Watty comes along shortly to decry all Linux boxes as 'hobbyist', of the boxes you've listed I've tested the Vu+ Solo, Duo, QBox HD and the Azbox. The Vu+ units are currently the pick of the crop. Whether you get the Solo or Duo depends on whether you want the twin tuners and ability to have internal HD with the Duo. None of them would be considered 'budget'.

I have tested my setup.

I have a tooway dish professionally installed with a single cable from the TX port to a tooway indoor internet box. The model of indoor box is:
RM4100N-010
300-800Mhz RX
1800-2300 TX (1 connector)

I first tested the RX port with the TX port still connected as above. I found no signal (300 to 800) nor 1000-1500 using a spectrum analyser.

I then disconnected the indoor box and put a basic 30V DC using a power supply wired to an F-connector. The dish drew 0.3A

If found a valid signal (I assume) from 1000 to 1500Mhz on RX port while there was power on TX port.

I then reconnected the indoor box and rushed out to check the screen on the analyser. For about 20 seconds after the indoor box was powered on the signal appeared on the RX port then it disappeared forever. It seems as if the indoor box tells the outdoor LNB to switch off the RX port and send the signal back the TX connector at a lower frequency.

So basically if you are getting a professional tooway dish installation make sure they use a 2 cable version of the indoor box. Otherwise it will be very difficult to receive Saorsat.

I do have an diy upconverter which may or may not help but I think this would need to be fitted via a power blocking splitter to the TX port. I will also test the US version of the upconverter and update here when I have news.

So in summary it's nearly impossible to get internet and saorview at the same time with a model 4100 indoor unit. This could be a problem for Irish users.

>Unless there is some way of changing to settings in the modem to stop it shutting down the RX port?
I checked all the GUI options and the hidden 192.168.100.1/install/ menu. There is no options I could find.

>Does it look like the modem switches from one RX LO over to the other?

No the 1000-1500 signal just disappears after a while and no lower frequency is present. I would guess that the signal down on the TX line does not appear until the RX port is off. The internet does not work during this time. It's not too big a problem for me as there is Saorview coverage and Saorsat was not the reason for getting tooway in. Others should just be aware before they sign a 24 month contract.

i've just bought a hughes ka band from america and hopefully be able to test on a 1.2m and 1.8m precison dish here in north wales no idea as yet if the signal will be receivable or not i have various sat receivers i can use vu az ect