PC has Piracy Rate of 93-95%

richymcdermott · 22-08-2012 3:33pm #1

That's according to ubisoft , now im no pc gamer though i do dabble into pc gaming now and again but that number ubisoft pulled out seems bit stupid to me

what are your guys thoughts on the matter

they also go on to say F2P is the future

http://ie.ign.com/articles/2012/08/22/ubisoft-pc-has-piracy-rate-of-93-95-f2p-the-future

Dave_The_Sheep · 22-08-2012 3:39pm

Ubisoft are ****ing idiots.

Steam's usage, and the popularity of sites that make getting and playing games easy, without restrictive DRM and a reasonable price structure show that people don't pirate when there's a better alternative.

Maybe if Ubisoft's DRM wasn't so retarded, less people would pirate their games.

ScumLord · 22-08-2012 3:39pm

I can only remember one time I pirated a PC game, it was such a pain in the hole throughout the experience I have no problem paying for PC games.

It's not like PC games are expensive either. I'd use the likes of steam more now if I had a way to pay and don't really have any problems with online distribution other than steam being one of the most expensive places to buy new games.

RolandIRL · 22-08-2012 3:40pm

More like 93-95% of Ubisoft's games are pirated cos of their crappy DRM practices.

With the advent of Steam, where you can get 10 games for €40 during sale time, I doubt the figure is that high for other publishers or indeed for them.

Shiminay · 22-08-2012 3:41pm

I'd love to know what they're basing that on.

tuxy · 22-08-2012 3:45pm

Shiminay wrote: »

I'd love to know what they're basing that on.

My guess would be estimated torrents downloaded vs. actual sales.

Of course a torrent downloaded does not equal a lost sale.

Azza · 22-08-2012 3:46pm

Dave_The_Sheep wrote:

Steam's usage, and the popularity of sites that make getting and playing games easy, without restrictive DRM and a reasonable price structure show that people don't pirate when there's a better alternative.

No it doesn't, piracy is still alive and well regardless of the popularity and success of Steam and other digital distrabutors. Many would be of the opinion that Steams pricing policy is far from reasonable when it comes to new games.

Steam and other digital distrubitors do make getting games very easy but it doesn't offset the massive attraction piracy has of been entirely free and for many pc gamers piracy isn't significantly harder method of obtaining games.

Dave_The_Sheep wrote:

Maybe if Ubisoft's DRM wasn't so retarded, less people would pirate their games

Piracy came before DRM.

degrassinoel · 22-08-2012 3:48pm

Ubisoft could be right about F2P, it does seem to be massive trend these days. Marvel Heroes, and C&C Generals 2 (that was also renamed back to commandandconquer) have gone with a free2play system. Countless others over the years have done this and are making a mint from it. World of Tanks, any mmo that isnt WoW have done it or are in the process of doing it.

by the looks of things, the days of single player games are numbered.

Dave_The_Sheep · 22-08-2012 3:55pm

Azza wrote: »

No it doesn't, piracy is still alive and well regardless of the popularity and success of Steam and other digital distrabutors. Many would be of the opinion that Steams pricing policy is far from reasonable when it comes to new games.

Steam and other digital distrubitors do make getting games very easy but it doesn't offset the massive attraction piracy has of been entirely free and for many pc gamers piracy isn't significantly harder method of obtaining games.

Piracy came before DRM.

Some people will always pirate. The majority (I believe) will pay for services (in this case - games) when it's at a reasonable price, and it's easy to do so. The way to combat piracy isn't DRM or anything like that. You're never going to beat the segement of the population that'll pirate regardless. Best you can do is make things as worthwhile and straightforward for your geniune customers.

As for your last comment, it's true, but I don't see the point. I didn't say DRM causes piracy, I said that if their DRM wasn't so **** and restricted geniune customers, less people would pirate.

Icyseanfitz · 22-08-2012 3:56pm

Shiminay wrote: »

I'd love to know what they're basing that on.

from the looks of it thin air :pac:

gizmo · 22-08-2012 3:58pm

Dave_The_Sheep wrote: »

Steam's usage, and the popularity of sites that make getting and playing games easy, without restrictive DRM and a reasonable price structure show that people don't pirate when there's a better alternative.

Yet despite all of this Portal 2 was the fifth most downloaded game of 2011 on public sites alone.

Dave_The_Sheep wrote: »

Maybe if Ubisoft's DRM wasn't so retarded, less people would pirate their games.

Or maybe their current DRM measures are in place because of these figures?

Not that I agree with said measures of course, on the contrary, I think they're ****ing ridiculous. That being said, I also think that no company should have to sit by and witness those kids of piracy figures while being told to just suck it up. They could always move to Steam in a similar manner to Football Manager but even then you'll have people whining.

As for using these kinds of DRM methods as a justification for piracy, I'll just say what I always do. Vote with your wallet, don't buy it, don't play it and for the love of **** don't go and pirate it as you're just feeding the figures they use to justify putting these measures in place.

Dave_The_Sheep wrote: »

Some people will always pirate. The majority (I believe) will pay for services (in this case - games) when it's at a reasonable price, and it's easy to do so. The way to combat piracy isn't DRM or anything like that. You're never going to beat the segement of the population that'll pirate regardless. Best you can do is make things as worthwhile and straightforward for your geniune customers.

More people downloaded The Witcher 2 on the PC than have bought the entire series on both platforms so far. If that doesn't bum you out then I don't know what would.

Cravez · 22-08-2012 4:01pm

degrassinoel wrote: »

Ubisoft could be right about F2P, it does seem to be massive trend these days. Marvel Heroes, and C&C Generals 2 (that was also renamed back to commandandconquer) have gone with a free2play system. Countless others over the years have done this and are making a mint from it. World of Tanks, any mmo that isnt WoW have done it or are in the process of doing it.

by the looks of things, the days of single player games are numbered.

I wouldn't say Single Player games are numbered, just that online games are changing their structure to replace the 'subscription' model of paying for online games - give people a game Free to Play but with basic features, where additional features can be purchased once off or via online marketplace (items, armours, weapons etc). In a way it does make sense as you are attracting more potential players to play your game and players could end up spending more money per month on extra features or items than a recurring subscription price.

Id be hard pressed to find any F2P game that offers full features or does not have a Marketplace of some kind.

Azza · 22-08-2012 4:05pm

tuxy wrote:

Of course a torrent downloaded does not equal a lost sale.

I don't think they are claiming that. But say they do suffer from a 93-95% piracy rate. If around 7-8% of those who pirated a product purchased it instead, then it would of been a doubling of the sales figures.

Its hard to imagine that at least some of the piracy isn't leading to lost sales. Even a small % would translate to a significant loss of earnings.

gugleguy · 22-08-2012 4:06pm

Yeah, ST Format went on a CRUSADE about it.
Game developers like David Braben were spoke to about it inside this mag with a stern look on his face. I bought Elite 2 legally for ST ( Canon fodder was the last mainstream game available if I can remember)
Oh, how many hours sleep I lost, as an STe owner.
Fat lot good it did.

balkieb2002 · 22-08-2012 4:06pm

Ubisoft's DRM didn't help - being made to stay online to play a single-player was never going to work out - and would have helped increased priacy of Assasins Creed II for example so it becomes more like ACII has Piracy Rate of 93-95%

I'd would also love to see a breakdown on the information they are using to base this on.

Azza · 22-08-2012 4:16pm

balkieb2002 wrote:

Ubisoft's DRM didn't help - being made to stay online to play a single-player was never going to work out - and would have helped increased priacy of Assasins Creed II for example so it becomes more like ACII has Piracy Rate of 93-95%

Any evidence to support that claim?

Ubisofts problem is that they didn't have a game big enough to force the system through like Blizzard did with Diablo 3.

martomcg · 22-08-2012 4:21pm

Eh did anyone actually read the article?

So high are the rates of piracy (5-7%), Ubisoft is actively looking to the F2P model as an important way of making money from the PC market going forward, especially in territories badly affected by piracy.

The OP's title is bull****.

Piracy is claimed here to be only 5-7% which is a realistic estimate, i.e 1 in 10 people download and pirate games.

People can complain all day about how Piracy came first and will always be around, blah, blah, blah.

Prices is what originally pushed people to piracy in the first place. These game companies were making stupid margins on their games. Now with the popularity of DLC content, studios are deliberately giving you only part of the full gaming experience so they can charge you for "extra" content a couple of weeks/months after the games release.

Online passes too are becoming all to common to prevent the sale of used games, practically creating another monopoly on how much studios can charge for their games. I never pirated games before they brought in online passes. I'd just buy it 2nd hand (1st hand if i really wanted it) and play away. Now i have absolutely no moral qualms about pirating at all.

Greed is the only motivator for these games developers and that isn't gonna change anytime soon.

Lone Stone · 22-08-2012 4:28pm

If i own a game on my ps3 say, id probably pirate it if i wanted to get it on the pc aswell but i haven't pirated a game in years its a pain in the arse and i prefer to pay for things.

Although that said i have noticed the massive price hike in pc games, they were always around 30 euro and recently ive noticed them being 50-60 euro :eek: that would definitely have some thing to do with people turning to piracy.

Skerries · 22-08-2012 4:29pm

the article says

Ubisoft's CEO Yves Guillemot has revealed that the percentage of people who pay in free-to-play games is roughly the same as those who buy boxed games (approximately 5-7%)

On PC it's only around five to seven per cent of the players who pay for F2P, but normally on PC it's only about five to seven per cent who pay anyway, the rest is pirated. It's around a 93-95 per cent piracy rate, so it ends up at about the same percentage.

So OP's title is correct

Magill · 22-08-2012 4:29pm

martomcg wrote: »

Eh did anyone actually read the article?

The OP's title is bull****.

Piracy is claimed here to be only 5-7% which is a realistic estimate, i.e 1 in 10 people download and pirate games.

People can complain all day about how Piracy came first and will always be around, blah, blah, blah.

Prices is what originally pushed people to piracy in the first place. These game companies were making stupid margins on their games. Now with the popularity of DLC content, studios are deliberately giving you only part of the full gaming experience so they can charge you for "extra" content a couple of weeks/months after the games release.

Online passes too are becoming all to common to prevent the sale of used games, practically creating another monopoly on how much studios can charge for their games. I never pirated games before they brought in online passes. I'd just buy it 2nd hand (1st hand if i really wanted it) and play away. Now i have absolutely no moral qualms about pirating at all.

Greed is the only motivator for these games developers and that isn't gonna change anytime soon.

you could never trade in PC games to begin with, least i know game up here in newry wouldn't ? Besides, theres no real need to buy second hand games for PC anyway since usually you'd have to be a mug to buy them in the first place since you generally only save 50p or something stupid on a new game. Never understood how the second hand market got so big when they were/are clearly ripping the dick out of everyone that sells/buys 2nd hand games..... hell i got bioshock 2 in GAME for cheaper than they were selling the it 2nd hand...

Obviously for older games that you can't get new anymore... i understand.

Kiith · 22-08-2012 4:31pm

martomcg wrote: »

The OP's title is bull****.

Piracy is claimed here to be only 5-7% which is a realistic estimate, i.e 1 in 10 people download and pirate games.

It says the below further down though.

IGN wrote:

"It's a way to get closer to your customers, to make sure you have a revenue. On PC it's only around five to seven per cent of the players who pay for F2P, but normally on PC it's only about five to seven per cent who pay anyway, the rest is pirated. It's around a 93-95 per cent piracy rate, so it ends up at about the same percentage. The revenue we get from the people who play is more long term, so we can continue to bring content.

While piracy is definitely a massive problem, there's no way it's as high as Ubisoft claim. I don't know what the actual number are, but it's not that high. The problem is that if you give some people the option of getting it for free, they will take it, regardless of who it hurts. That's just people for you. It would be the exact same if it was so easy to pirate games on the consoles.

Unfortunately, as long as people are able to pirate, they will pirate. The only way i can ever see piracy being stopped is by changing the laws in regards to privacy. Not something i want, but if people started getting sued anytime they downloaded something illegally, it would stop (or massively lessen) really fast.

Gizmo wrote:

More people downloaded The Witcher 2 on the PC than have bought the entire series on both platforms so far. If that doesn't bum you out then I don't know what would.

Is that true? If so....**** sake

Dave_The_Sheep · 22-08-2012 4:34pm

gizmo wrote: »

Yet despite all of this Portal 2 was the fifth most downloaded game of 2011 on public sites alone.

More people downloaded The Witcher 2 on the PC than have bought the entire series on both platforms so far. If that doesn't bum you out then I don't know what would.

Not something I was aware of. Guess I'm just speaking for myself and my friends so, fair enough. I used to pirate games a few years back. Then I stopped because I realised that it's not helping and I love games enough to actually contribute financially.

Jesus, people are arseholes.

That said, until someone comes up with a 100% unbeatable way to stop piracy, or stop people playing pirated games (probably impossible), then I would still say the best option isn't to inconvenience paying customers.

ShadowHearth · 22-08-2012 4:40pm

right. starcraft 2 sold 4.5 million copies at 2010, so by now it is way more then 5mil, but lets have it 5 mil as a round number.

so if 5 mill sold is that 5% that was sold, then 100% of all playing gamers is?

*doing some basic calculations

so according ubisoft if there is in the market legal and non legal 100.000.000 (100mil )copies of SC2... :pac:

Azza · 22-08-2012 4:46pm

Ubisoft where speaking about there own piracy rates not Blizzards. I can't see any of there games selling 5 million on PC.

Incidently Crytek claimed a piracy rate of between 15-20 times the number of sales of Crysis 1 on PC.

The creators of World of Goo claimed a piracy rate of 90%

Varik · 22-08-2012 7:13pm

Azza wrote: »

Ubisoft where speaking about there own piracy rates not Blizzards. I can't see any of there games selling 5 million on PC.

Incidently Crytek claimed a piracy rate of between 15-20 times the number of sales of Crysis 1 on PC.

The creators of World of Goo claimed a piracy rate of 90%

Crysis has it's own reasons unique reason for the high rates, many downloaded it to see if it would work before buying ( that was their excuse anyway). I don't believe those who generally say they pirated a game to try it.

I hated Steam when i got half life 2, i spent all Christmas morning and most of the day downloading before i could play it.

Myrddin · 22-08-2012 7:37pm

The same Ubisoft who actually incentivise piracy/cracking, due to their ridiculous DRM? Idiots.

gizmo · 22-08-2012 7:50pm

Varik wrote: »

Crysis has it's own reasons unique reason for the high rates, many downloaded it to see if it would work before buying ( that was their excuse anyway). I don't believe those who generally say they pirated a game to try it.

Crytek released a demo of the game a month before release to avoid this specific scenario.

EnterNow wrote: »

The same Ubisoft who actually incentivise piracy/cracking, due to their ridiculous DRM? Idiots.

I'd wager that their horrific DRM is a result of these figures and not the cause. There's also the fact that Ghost Recon Online, which has been in development for about two years, was a pretty early sign that they were unhappy with the situation and wanted to move into the F2P / piracy free zone.

Azza · 22-08-2012 7:52pm

EnterNow wrote:

The same Ubisoft who actually incentivise piracy/cracking, due to their ridiculous DRM? Idiots.

The pirates don't need incentives to pirates game. They will do in droves with or without DRM.

Nody · 22-08-2012 8:09pm

Azza wrote: »

The pirates don't need incentives to pirates game. They will do in droves with or without DRM.

But it does drive buying customers to pirate a copy as well instead of dealing with the DRM being constantly online.

degrassinoel · 22-08-2012 9:17pm

Another reason people obtain pirate copies of games is due to release dates being so far apart from each other. example; game released in USA on Jan 1, doesnt get Austrailian release til March.
That's fairly dramatic i know, it's not usually that long or that bad here in europe, but i feel it needs to be addressed by the publishers.

Other issues like mature ratings and banned games in certain regions would also give rise to people choosing to get a pirate copy.

Of course, that doesnt mean it's all the publishers fault either, it's just part of the problem they are complaining about.

hal9000 · 22-08-2012 9:24pm

ahh ubisoft games, 93-95% style / 7-5% substance

PC has Piracy Rate of 93-95%

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