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2700s being withdrawn, possibly sold off?

  • 08-02-2012 1:18pm
    #1
    Jehuty42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 560 ✭✭✭


    This thread is probably going to descend into anarchy, but this is an issue worth talking about.

    Recent rumbings on IRN indicate IE seem to be planning to withdraw the 2700 series DMUs from service. When the new 22000s come on stream, that will free 29000s from long distance work which will allow them to displace 2800s on commuter work. The 2800s will then be sent out of the Dublin area to operate Limerick, WRC, South Tipp and Ballina trains.

    A few 2800 sets have already gone south to Limerick for driver training.

    Whatever about disposing of the Alstom DARTs that never worked, or the MK3s where you could at least make the case of staff savings and operating effencies, this move totally baffles me. The 2700s were repainted and lightly refurbished to remove gangways in the past year, at a cost of thousands per set I would assume.

    Does anyone have any more information? Am I alone in thinking this is slightly scandalous, if true(which I am not sure of yet)?


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Comments

  • #2
    corktina
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    As a guess, I would say that this is an indication of the intention to reduce services and cut out branches, thus less stock is required.


  • #3
    Jehuty42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 560 ✭✭✭Jehuty42


    corktina wrote: »
    As a guess, I would say that this is an indication of the intention to reduce services and cut out branches, thus less stock is required.

    That's true. If things work out properly we will have a network set up for fast and express travel between Dublin and the few other other population centers(Cork, Limerick, Galway and a couple of the larger towns along the way). Buses can handle the minuscule demand currently served by branch trains in Nenagh and South Tipp.

    It would be nice if IE were a bit more open and transparent about their future plans, but I guess they can't make any plans, they can just operate the services the DoT tells them to.


  • #4
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,521 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Unless they just want rid of anything and everything made by GEC Alsthom in Spain, there's no reason for this.


  • #5
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,468 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Following a pattern, getting rid of more reasonably young stock for no obvious reason apart from wanting to waste millions on new stuff


  • #6
    Oscar Bravo
    Registered Users Posts: 10,054 ✭✭✭✭Oscar Bravo


    2600s to go back on Ballina Branch when 2700s go from it.


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  • #7
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    Following a pattern, getting rid of more reasonably young stock for no obvious reason apart from wanting to waste millions on new stuff
    I can't see them getting new stuff for quite some time, by the time they shut down more lines they will have ample rolling stock.


  • #8
    Cookie_Monster
    Registered Users Posts: 24,468 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Run_to_da_hills wrote: »
    I can't see them getting new stuff for quite some time,

    new stuff only arrived recently.


  • #9
    dowlingm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭dowlingm


    Jehuty42 wrote: »
    When the new 22000s come on stream
    No need to book the farewell special just yet then :rolleyes:


  • #10
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    Cookie_Monster wrote: »
    new stuff only arrived recently.
    They would have all been ordered several years back when things were good and before they scuttled the MK3's.


  • #11
    Hungerford
    Registered Users Posts: 912 ✭✭✭Hungerford


    The IRRS are now advertising one of their infamous farewell specials for the 2700s. It will take in Ballybrophy to Limerick and Limerick to Waterford.


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  • #12
    Jehuty42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 560 ✭✭✭Jehuty42


    http://www.irrs.ie/Journal%20176/FORM%2012%2002%20%20%20%202700%20OUTING.pdf

    Wow, that's mad, I guess it really does confirm it then.


  • #13
    dowlingm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭dowlingm


    On a discussion on RUI the issue of the "last train" to and from Waterford has come up again. Back in April 2010 and the south Wexford closure I was kicking around the thought of extending the Limerick Junction 2700 set arrival at 2027 into Waterford up to Carlow. This would give a connection to the last northbound service ex Carlow and also a connection from the last southbound to Carlow. This would mean a transfer across the footbridge at Carlow though.

    Normally I would scoff at the notion of replacing the current 2700 with a 22000, a 100mph 200 seat set for tens of passengers at 40mph (I may have done some scoffing along those lines with respect to the WRC).

    Now the Waterford-LJ set is the only 2700 working out of Waterford to my knowledge. Should it be replaced by a 3 x 22000 then the Carlow transfer would become unnecessary - the 2010 ex Heuston (also a 3 x 22000 I understand) would simply run through to Waterford and the service ex Waterford would pick up the Carlow traffic heading back north, essentially a set swap, assuming the crews could exchange sets at some point to get back to their bases. A no change service would be more convenient for the passengers.

    Additionally, being an all-22000 base would mean having a spare 22000 on hand on Sundays to extend any 3-car runs to 6 where useful which the 2700 is useless for at present as well as offering some possible crewing opportunities to make best use of rosters.

    The cherry on top would be the explosion of rage from the Wesht if they got "stuck" with 2800s while the Clonmel line was fully converted to 22s :D


  • #14
    dowlingm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭dowlingm


    dowlingm wrote: »
    No need to book the farewell special just yet then :rolleyes:
    Hungerford wrote: »
    The IRRS are now advertising one of their infamous farewell specials for the 2700s. It will take in Ballybrophy to Limerick and Limerick to Waterford.
    :o

    I guess Rotem have got off their ass and fixed at least some of the "block 2" sets to free up 2800s to replace the 27s.


  • #15
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,521 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    If the DOT don't do something to ensure these do not get scrapped or "Mark 3"ed, I'd be amazed. Forcing them to be stored for a putative private operator entry (the EU exemption from that will fall soon) would be the best thing to do.


  • #16
    Niles
    Registered Users Posts: 1,186 ✭✭✭Niles


    A 2700 farewell special... I feel old (at 23!).


  • #17
    Our man in Havana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 29,476 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    Hungerford wrote: »
    The IRRS are now advertising one of their infamous farewell specials for the 2700s. It will take in Ballybrophy to Limerick and Limerick to Waterford.
    Will there be food available?


  • #18
    Jehuty42
    Closed Accounts Posts: 560 ✭✭✭Jehuty42


    Our man in Havana wrote: »
    Will there be food available?

    Yes, Rail Gourmet will be providing catering.


  • #19
    Captain Chaos
    Registered Users Posts: 11,174 ✭✭✭✭Captain Chaos


    What will happen to the hybrid 2600/2700 set, 2609/2716? All the work that went into that. It spent months in Scotland and then almost another half year in Drogheda to get it into service.

    I take it that will be scrapped too. I doubt 2609 will be able to act as a spare car for the 2600 fleet again with all the work that was done to it to enable it to be a 2700 D1 or D2 car. So it looks like the first 2600 loss.


  • #20
    dowlingm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭dowlingm


    It will be interesting to see where the 2700s are parked up into rustage. Will the scrapping of the Mark 3s be "justified" by "we've nowhere to park the 27s"?

    Their aircon units should be removed and the DMUs shrinkwrapped. When CIE finally have their trainsets removed from them by Austerity maybe Porterbrook or Angel Trains or HSBC Rail will find a use for them.


  • #21
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    Jehuty42 wrote: »
    http://www.irrs.ie/Journal%20176/FORM%2012%2002%20%20%20%202700%20OUTING.pdf

    Wow, that's mad, I guess it really does confirm it then.

    "Catering will be provided on the special train by Rail Gourmet" :p


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  • #22
    Our man in Havana
    Closed Accounts Posts: 29,476 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    So not the usual fare. ;)


  • #23
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Our man in Havana wrote: »
    So not the usual fare. ;)
    Bags of crisps warm sandwiches and warmer bottles of sparkling water:) and no I don't want to speculate about the sandwich fillings:D


  • #24
    dmcronin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 267 ✭✭dmcronin


    A 2700 class preservation society? ;)


  • #25
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    dmcronin wrote: »
    A 2700 class preservation society? ;)
    That's only if they have enough room for them in Moyasta. :p


  • #26
    dowlingm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭dowlingm


    It's always important that IE have the excuse "shure we've no stock" available at all times, and if that means scrapping, well... :rolleyes::D


  • #27
    Poxyshamrock
    Registered Users Posts: 4,823 ✭✭✭Poxyshamrock


    If the 2700s are being withdrawn, what rolling stock will be deployed on the Limerick to Galway line?


  • #28
    dowlingm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭dowlingm


    2800s by the looks of things - 2805/6 is already down in Limerick. 22000s will be taking over 2800 duties in Greater Dublin and they have large commonalities with the 2600 fleet in Cork. 2700 fleet is an outlier. Of course, this was probably known last year when IE was spending money boarding up gangways and repainting said 2700s into "fake 22000" livery.


  • #29
    duffmckegean
    Registered Users Posts: 17 ✭duffmckegean


    What would then be deployed on the Limerick Junction - Waterford Line?

    Surely a 3 car 22000 would be overkill for this line?


  • #30
    Run_to_da_hills
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    duffmckegean wrote: »
    What would then be deployed on the Limerick Junction - Waterford Line?

    Surely a 3 car 22000 would be overkill for this line?
    They could always do away with the middle bit and have just two cars. :p


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  • #31
    dowlingm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭dowlingm


    The 5-car 22000 laid up in Inchicore implies that even if you can (operate minus a B carriage), they don't want to.


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