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News and views on Greystones harbour and marina [SEE MODERATOR WARNING POST 1187]

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Comments

  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 274 ✭✭The Durutti Column


    The restoration of the hulk of the La Touche Hotel would indeed be a noble cause but not for anyone of sane mind and body. The outer appearance of this once famous hotel and indeed her insides show her to be way past her best. You would need more than a lick of paint here and there to spruce her up and restore her to her former beauty. The receiver was seeking €15 million a couple of years ago for her and her site. She should now be CPO’ed and taken over by the County Council and demolished and in her place a world class hotel and event centre could be built.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KODXiz2jBfg

    Well, let's get the one done before / if we move on to this.... But you suggestion is a good one, and indeed the opening of the harbour will emphasise the need for a hotel -- accommodation in Greystones near the harbour is scarce. There will be demand.

    But, Blanch, what are your views on preserving the facade? My wife and I have a vague sentimental attachment to the old dear, as we spent our wedding night there most pleasantly, having walked from our home at 1.00am leaving the party guests to do as they liked in our newly-bought house. We'd like still to be able to walk past and look up at the window of our room, if not the actual room itself.


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,736 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Can we keep this on topic - there are already threads discussing the la touche hotel

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users Posts: 304 ✭✭F3


    Johnnymcg wrote: »
    Can we keep this on topic - there are already threads discussing the la touche hotel

    With respect, the reopening of the harbour is directly linked to the prosperity of the town and the la touché hotel is its next door neighbour and it's continued degradation can be directly related to the harbour works grinding to a halt. When the harbour reopens you will find someone will make a move on doing something with the hotel.


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,736 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    F3 wrote: »
    With respect, the reopening of the harbour is directly linked to the prosperity of the town and the la touché hotel is its next door neighbour and it's continued degradation can be directly related to the harbour works grinding to a halt. When the harbour reopens you will find someone will make a move on doing something with the hotel.

    The harbour and hotel are separate issues. As moderator I do retain the right (as per the forum charter) to set down the direction of threads. Any problems send me a pm.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,250 ✭✭✭pixbyjohn


    The Commodore and members of Greystones Motor Yacht Club are to seek an early meeting with the developers of Greystones Harbour. The club represents over 100 boaters from the sail and cruiser community in North Wicklow and is affiliated to the Irish Sailing Association.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    So the yacht club is now detaching itself from the county councillors?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,250 ✭✭✭pixbyjohn


    recedite wrote: »
    So the yacht club is now detaching itself from the county councillors?

    No, its more a case of backing the councillors as in......
    "GUBOH accepted that further consultations between Sispar and the local community would be via the meetings recommended unanimously by Town Councillors at their meeting on 31 May, where GUBOH will be represented. "


  • Registered Users Posts: 304 ✭✭F3


    I don't know, but I sense a feeling of underlying back-biting going on amongst the so-called "various groups". What is fueling this can anyone tell me? Or am I picking up the wrong end of the stick, I'm a member in GMYC and also a member of GUBOH and pretty much every other member I know is too.

    I'm probably been overly sensitive about nothing, as we are all singing off the same hymn sheet aren't we??


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,250 ✭✭✭pixbyjohn


    Going on the recently posted information,I think everyone is all for the reopening of the harbour and the removal of the hoardings.The various groups and the town councillors appear to be united in this outcome and Sispar appear to be co-operating with them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭The Bishop Basher


    Having drank there for many years and met my wife wo was working there at the time I can honestly say that building was beyond salvagable well before it was closed. We all agree it's an eye sore but let's get back on topic and go after something that is salvagable...Our Harbour !!


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    pixbyjohn wrote: »
    The Commodore and members of Greystones Motor Yacht Club are to seek an early meeting with the developers of Greystones Harbour.
    F3 wrote: »
    I'm a member in GMYC and also a member of GUBOH and pretty much every other member I know is too.

    Sorry, not being a sailor, I was getting mixed up between the sailing club and the yacht club.
    The sailing club was pretty much inextricably linked to the councillors in everything they did previously, so I was surprised the club were looking for an independent meeting with Sispar. I see now it's a different club that you are in.
    http://gsc.ie/
    http://www.greystonesmyc.ie/
    In the early days, when the councillors were pushing through the harbour development against the wishes of the majority of the people of Greystones, the clubs operating out of the "old harbour" were offered "free club houses". They then came out in support of the councillors and developers.
    My sense is that GUBOH has developed more out of the anti-development faction, though I am open to correction on that.
    Anyway, I agree that there is no going back now, and everyone should be united in trying to make the best out of the current situation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 304 ✭✭F3


    My senses tell me that GUBOH are not anti development at all, I know a couple of the guys that are leading the charge and embrace the fact that the entire devoplment will go ahead someday, they just want in the mean time for us all to use the amenity as the reality is that the Irish property Market is not going to recover to make the developement viable any time soon.

    That's my understanding anyway. Note also there is not a thing anybody can do to stop it right? Contracts are signed years ago, the development will happen it's just a matter of when.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,993 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Nobody can bring back the old harbour now. But neither will we see all the facilities that were promised for the new one. It's just a matter of seeing what we can salvage from the current unsatisfactory situation.


  • Registered Users Posts: 304 ✭✭F3


    recedite wrote: »
    Nobody can bring back the old harbour now. But neither will we see all the facilities that were promised for the new one. It's just a matter of seeing what we can salvage from the current unsatisfactory situation.

    Yes we are where we are today, we all have different visions of where or what the harbour will be in the future, but in the mean time, let's enjoy it, if we do nothing now, we will be looking at hoardings for a very very long time


  • Registered Users Posts: 9 Opinel


    I've just joined Boards and stumbled on this thread. Good discussion (although not going to go through all 51 pages of it!).

    I'm from Greystones. I'm getting a little fed up with GUBOH. They've done quite well so far but they seem to be getting into a tit for tat with the Mayor. I think they should stay out of it and concentrate on the end goal. What do you think?


  • Registered Users Posts: 304 ✭✭F3


    Opinel wrote: »
    I've just joined Boards and stumbled on this thread. Good discussion (although not going to go through all 51 pages of it!).

    I'm from Greystones. I'm getting a little fed up with GUBOH. They've done quite well so far but they seem to be getting into a tit for tat with the Mayor. I think they should stay out of it and concentrate on the end goal. What do you think?

    Welcome Opinel, start from page 40 to get the gist of the thread, I agree with the Mayor GUBOH thing and I'm getting fed up too, but the one thing that drives me ballistic is public representative not acting for the public, it appears to me thats the difference between the two, GUBOH act for the entire community and not just the boaters who are not 'blow ins' I've lived in Greystones for 2 years and I'm actually quite offended that out towns Mayor does not count my opinion but then it would appear he doesn't care for the opinion of our towns visitors either, its just wrong. Reading the boards and Facebook, his term of office is over in about a week, so I hope we get a better Mayor to represent the people,


  • Registered Users Posts: 209 ✭✭darter


    Opinel wrote: »
    I've just joined Boards and stumbled on this thread. Good discussion (although not going to go through all 51 pages of it!).

    I'm from Greystones. I'm getting a little fed up with GUBOH. They've done quite well so far but they seem to be getting into a tit for tat with the Mayor. I think they should stay out of it and concentrate on the end goal. What do you think?

    Interesting comment. Whenever two sides squabble, third party observers often have difficulty separating out the "good" from the "bad", and brand both as equally at fault.

    Yes, certainly the "Now p**s off, boy!" comment, attributed to Basil Miller who is leading GUBOH, was not useful. But put that in context with the Mayor's view that:

    a) this is entirely a "rowers issue, a sailors issue, a divers issue, a scouts issue, a fisherman’s issue and a boater’s issue" (see his web site) - the other 95% of Greystones people have no say,
    b) parents, children, grandparents, siblings, people who love walking in harbours and watching the sea, have no say,
    c) anyone who is a "blow-in", as in here less than the Mayor has been here, has no say,
    d) anyone who has roots here, who lived here for all of their lives, but who now live elsewhere but nevertheless may come back, has no say,
    e) businesses who operate in Greystones, have no say,
    f) tourists, visitors, other interested parties, have no say.

    It appears that the only people who count, in the Mayor's mind, are those who directly will use the harbour in the restrictive sense of a harbour. And, strangely enough, one of those groups is the Greystones Motor Yacht Club. If you haven't heard of it, that's because it was only formed 2 years ago, and guess who is the Vice-Commodore...??? No prizes for getting the right answer.

    And, to cap it all off, it is reported that the Major said 2 years ago that he was going to "throw his hat in the ring" to become the harbourmaster...

    You can pick your jaw up off the floor now and place it back in your mouth...

    My metric for measuring people is whether their actions are greater than their words. With GUBOH we have had more serious movement over the last few weeks than over the last year or more with our Mayor.

    Most of us really don't give a damn about the Major's posturing and strutting - we see it for what it is - we just want our harbour back, to enjoy, to walk around, to view as we walk from Bray along the cliff path, to be proud of when our friends come and when tourists visit Greystones. Yes, we all want those who use the harbour for water activities to enjoy it also, but the Mayor's view that the rest of us do not count really, really, really, pisses me off!


  • Registered Users Posts: 304 ✭✭F3


    Darter, you started this thread and I can now see why, your last comment is exactly what I feel, well said & thank you.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9 Opinel


    Christ, first post stirred a strong reaction!! Thanks for the excellent background synopsis darter.

    In case it's in any doubt, I want the harbour back as well!! I feel mostly for the poor people who live down by the harbour (most long time Greystones residents) who have had to stare at those hoardings all this time. And yes, I agree GUBOH have moved it along in just a few weeks. But I'd rather see GUBOH concentrate all efforts in discussions with Sispar like they achieved last week and let the Mayor have his rather incoherent posturing and rants to himself. If today's anouncement is anything to go by, he seems like a man in meltdown not warranting comment. Is anyone taking him seriously or are they only paying attention to what he's saying with a kind of morbid curiosity?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 626 ✭✭✭Blanchflower


    It is indeed interesting that the Mayor wants the harbourmasters job. Picture the scene folks.....It is the 14th of June 2012 and a little out of town boy with his out of town mum and dad have just alighted from the 84 bus at Greystones Harbour. The little boy, full of excitment, runs as fast as his little legs will carry him down to play on the harbour beach with his bucket and spade. Suddenly the loud angry voice of the Harbourmaster is heard above the sound of the waves breaking softly on the harbour beach. "Little boy, get out of the water! You are not allowed here! This is a Boating Beach for Boating People we don't want any trouble here!"


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  • Registered Users Posts: 304 ✭✭F3


    It is indeed interesting that the Mayor wants the harbourmasters job. Picture the scene folks.....It is the 14th of June 2012 and a little out of town boy with his out of town mum and dad have just alighted from the 84 bus at Greystones Harbour. The little boy, full of excitment, runs as fast as his little legs will carry him down to play on the harbour beach with his bucket and spade. Suddenly the loud angry voice of the Harbourmaster is heard above the sound of the waves breaking softly on the harbour beach. "Little boy, get out of the water! You are not allowed here! This is a Boating Beach for Boating People we don't want any trouble here!"

    You're wasted Blanch you should have been either a writer or a profit! Maybe you are both?


  • Registered Users Posts: 304 ✭✭F3


    Opinel wrote: »
    Christ, first post stirred a strong reaction!! Thanks for the excellent background synopsis darter.

    In case it's in any doubt, I want the harbour back as well!! I feel mostly for the poor people who live down by the harbour (most long time Greystones residents) who have had to stare at those hoardings all this time. And yes, I agree GUBOH have moved it along in just a few weeks. But I'd rather see GUBOH concentrate all efforts in discussions with Sispar like they achieved last week and let the Mayor have his rather incoherent posturing and rants to himself. If today's anouncement is anything to go by, he seems like a man in meltdown not warranting comment. Is anyone taking him seriously or are they only paying attention to what he's saying with a kind of morbid curiosity?

    I know the key guys in GUBOH and they don't rate the Mayor at all. Empty vessels, he has no power whatsoever, he's clearly no chance of being elected next time round, the serious contenders in Fine Fail were kept out by Roche last time around and will succeed next time since Roche is no more. Maybe it is a morbid curiosity to watch a complete fool with the memory of a gold fish try to fool the people of GREYSTONES as to what the harbour really means to him. It's a bit like watching a bluebottle caught in a spiders web, do you free the fly or do you watch and wait for the inevitable......human nature is normally to watch and wait and it does't matter because it's only a bluebottle. But if it was a butterfly caught in a web, most people would free the butterfly....well that's what I think anyway


  • Registered Users Posts: 9 Opinel


    Judging from a couple of comments on GUBOH's FB page today, it looks like I'm not the only one that feels the same way about the running verbal battles with the Mayor.


  • Registered Users Posts: 304 ✭✭F3


    Opinel wrote: »
    Judging from a couple of comments on GUBOH's FB page today, it looks like I'm not the only one that feels the same way about the running verbal battles with the Mayor.

    I see a calm message posted just now by one of the GUBOH admin guys, time to wait, calm before the storm is my guess! There will be blue bloody murder if Sispar don't deliver!


  • Registered Users Posts: 9 Opinel


    Yes. I think it's a good strategy seeing if Sispar deliver. Let the Mayor rant away.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 21 Buzkashi


    Opinel wrote: »
    Yes. I think it's a good strategy seeing if Sispar deliver. Let the Mayor rant away.

    It's best to ignore Hayden's rantings, but in one way they need to be answered if they are not to cause confusion. Just look at the earlier post which confessed to being fed up with GUBOH because of the row.

    Fact is, GUBOH has not rowed with the mayor. He has picked a fight with GUBOH, which has not responded. OK, there's the FB page but that's an open group with no moderation, and people who are pissed off with Hayden's rantings have vented their anger.

    In fact GUBOH has been very restrained and focused on getting a result while the mayor runs about like a headless chicken.

    Seems to me, and it's hard to understand why, that he picked the fight.

    He met GUBOH about four weeks ago and said they were the best thing since sliced bread.

    Then he turned against them, it seems basically because they would not include his suggestions in their proposals to Sispar, and he launched increasingly intemperate personalised attacks, on the 'shoot the messenger' principle, targeting GUBOH's spokesman.

    He voted for a unanimous decision at the Town Council — and immediately broke ranks.

    All this against a background of unity among the rest of the Town Council and all Greystones county councillors, not to mention three local TDs, basically supporting GUBOH's demands on Sispar. So the mayor is the only one out of step here, and he is in opposition not just to GUBOH but to virtually the whole community, to blow-ins, knockers, emigrants, visitors and tourists.

    You'd have to ask what is going on?

    The latest diatribe came when GUBOH met Sispar and made progress — he rubbished it, said they were lying about what had happened, and went to Sispar to undermine what they had done.

    Now he wants women and children confined to the South Beach, and the harbour restricted to boat users only. It's right there in his latest blog!!

    Eh?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,418 ✭✭✭loobylou


    Buzkashi wrote: »

    Now he wants women and children confined to the South Beach, and the harbour restricted to boat users only. It's right there in his latest blog!!

    Eh?

    I'm no fan of the mayor but find the above very difficult to believe. Can you supply a link?


  • Registered Users Posts: 40,736 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    folks the focus of this discussion should be the harbour NOT Cllr Hayden.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 274 ✭✭The Durutti Column


    loobylou wrote: »
    I'm no fan of the mayor but find the above very difficult to believe. Can you supply a link?

    http://ciaranhayden.com/media/?p=1028

    "Also clarification is required in regards to ‘a bucket and spade issue’. We have a very large South Beach complete with Blue Flag, toilets, ample parking and a lifeguard not to mention nearby shops selling buckets and spades. The Beach at the harbour is shingle, rough stone and the maintained depth is now 7 meters not ideally suitable for buckets and spades. I would be very concerned about children playing without supervision of a lifeguard around these depths. It was always a very stoney, dirty beach and anyone that grew up in Greystones would know that. So it is not ‘a bucket and spade issue’ it is a rowers issue, a sailors issue, a divers issue, a scouts issue, a fisherman’s issue and a boater’s issue and let us not forget that." — CH

    Here's one reply he got: "It was not aways shingles and rough stones... it was fine sand in the dock at low tide and believe it or not, it had condomless and nappyless clean water at high tide. Swam in there when i was a kid, well doggy paddled anyway.!"

    And: "As someone who played in the harbour from the late '50's onwards, let me assure everyone that the harbour was a sandy one, even the dock had water in it at low tide and was beautifull safe and sandy. So to say" It was always this way and anyone that grew up in Greystones would know that" is a load of trot and spoken by someone who does not know the actual history of the harbour."

    The last time my family picnicked on the harbour beach was in 2007. The water was clear, you could swim or paddle, the kids built sandcastles and refused to leave. It was paradisical, slow and easy. For anyone to say it wasn't possible is just a lie.

    That was part of the amenity that the harbour was to many people, especially parents and kids from the north end of town. It's really not good enough to say the 'very large South Beach complete with Blue Flag' is available. When people say they want their harbour back, beach is included — as it was in the plans approved by Bord Pleanala and shown prominently in the montages of the finished harbour prepared by Sispar.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 274 ✭✭The Durutti Column


    Harbour%20Beach.png

    The above is the new harbour beach as foreseen in the Sispar presentation.


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