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People power halts eviction

  • 21-02-2012 9:31pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭


    A home repossession was peacefully stopped by supporters who talked the Sheriff out of turfing someone from their home in Laois.
    http://laoistatler.ie/2012/02/house-repossession-in-laois-stopped-thanks-to-people-power/

    With many more foreclosures in the post for the near future different groups are pledging to try and halt these evictions.
    Video:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpUjl4LvQM8

    An interesting development and one that is sure to become more common since so many householders are in mortgage arrears at the moment.
    The mortgage timebomb is the next big crash something needs to be done about it quickly or there will be a lot more incidents like this.

    I think evicting thousands of people is not feasible and the attempts at resolving the problem so whats going to happen? Seems like some sort of debt forgiveness is inevitable.


«134

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,949 ✭✭✭The Waltzing Consumer


    Do you have any articles about this that are not so emotive? Something that might inform us what happened without the obvious bias?

    The only intelligent thing I saw in that link is the first comment, ha, which goes completely against the argument :o

    "1. Repossessions in Ireland are not “all too common”. They are 80% less common than in the UK.
    2. Bondholder payments go onto our national debt, they do not come out of daily spending. The fate of that debt is yet to be decided.
    3. People are being squeezed because Bertie Ahern gave them fake transfers with fake money that we do not earn, and that mess has to be unwound if we are to recover.
    4. The Troika are giving us cheap money to pay for wages and salaries, and without them either we’d be borrowing more expensively or we’d be slashing welfare, PS pay and service costs by something like 30%.
    5. The Toika are not our “masters” and we could have them out of the country by 9am tomorrow morning if we wanted to, and if we wanted to live with the consequences.
    6. If this person isn’t repossessed, then neither is Paddy T. Developer or Sheila P. Solicitor from their homes on Shrewsbury Road or Orwell Park if they can’t pay their mortgage. Am I supposed to campaign to keep them in their houses too?
    7. Does the repossessee here own any more property? Do they have high credit card or unsecured debt?

    Ireland – a poor country pretending to be a rich one, in McWilliams acid phrase."

    But seriously, OP, what happened?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,728 ✭✭✭rodento


    20Cent wrote: »
    A home repossession was peacefully stopped by supporters who talked the Sheriff out of turfing someone from their home in Laois.
    http://laoistatler.ie/2012/02/house-repossession-in-laois-stopped-thanks-to-people-power/

    With many more foreclosures in the post for the near future different groups are pledging to try and halt these evictions.
    Video:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpUjl4LvQM8

    An interesting development and one that is sure to become more common since so many householders are in mortgage arrears at the moment.
    The mortgage timebomb is the next big crash something needs to be done about it quickly or there will be a lot more incidents like this.

    I think evicting thousands of people is not feasible and the attempts at resolving the problem so whats going to happen? Seems like some sort of debt forgiveness is inevitable.

    Sorry but how can it be their own home if they haven't paid for it


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,541 ✭✭✭Heisenberg.


    This post has been deleted.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 321 ✭✭Socialist_Pig




  • Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    Dunno if its freeman stuff but it worked in this case anyway!
    The Sheriff plus Gardai turned away.

    Better description of what happened from the Journal
    http://www.thejournal.ie/i-stopped-the-sheriff-activists-prevent-eviction-of-man-from-laois-home-362020-Feb2012/


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  • Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    20Cent wrote: »
    Dunno if its freeman stuff but it worked in this case anyway!
    The Sheriff plus Gardai turned away.

    Better description of what happened from the Journal
    http://www.thejournal.ie/i-stopped-the-sheriff-activists-prevent-eviction-of-man-from-laois-home-362020-Feb2012/

    I'd say, worked for now, is a better description. Will be interesting to see how it ends up.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭celticcrash



    Common law rules, thats not freeman stuff.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,980 ✭✭✭meglome


    K-9 wrote: »
    I'd say, worked for now, is a better description. Will be interesting to see how it ends up.

    Yeah I think they'll go off and regroup then come back with a few extra bodies with a better understanding of the law. I'll be surprised if he actually hangs on even in the medium term.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,554 ✭✭✭jaykay74


    20Cent wrote: »
    Seems like some sort of debt forgiveness is inevitable.

    aka Debt Sharing since someone has to pay in the end.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,483 ✭✭✭Ostrom


    I'm a bit out of touch - where did the term 'freeman' come from?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,078 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    20Cent wrote: »
    A home repossession was peacefully stopped by supporters who talked the Sheriff out of turfing someone from their home in Laois.
    http://laoistatler.ie/2012/02/house-repossession-in-laois-stopped-thanks-to-people-power/

    With many more foreclosures in the post for the near future different groups are pledging to try and halt these evictions.
    Video:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpUjl4LvQM8

    An interesting development and one that is sure to become more common since so many householders are in mortgage arrears at the moment.
    The mortgage timebomb is the next big crash something needs to be done about it quickly or there will be a lot more incidents like this.

    You mean like get the rest of us who don't owe money or are actually covering our debts to stump up even more money to pay off the debts of those who can't pay them back ?

    I think evicting thousands of people is not feasible and the attempts at resolving the problem so whats going to happen? Seems like some sort of debt forgiveness is inevitable.

    As the other poster mentioned repossessions in this country are not common at all.

    And I think asking those of us who didn't overborrow and/or repaying our debts to cover other peoples' debts is not feasible either.

    With regards to this exact case the guy borrowed 80,000, but then got a top up mortgage of 30,000.
    That is 1/3 again of his initial mortgage.

    Yeah welcome to the craziness of Ireland 2002 to 2007 where people decided that their mortgages need an ould top up.
    Any ideas what this guy spent the old top up on ?
    Hopefully it wasn't on the usual vehicles, credit cards, hols, etc.

    This guy it appears stopped repayments back in 2006 so that was even before all the people lost their jobs so what is the real story.

    I just love the Freedom From All Debt brigade.
    Basically they are saying to the rest of us that we can go fook ourselves and repay the debts of those that they are defending.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    It seems that the registrar of the court who grants repossession is also the Sheriff who does the evicting. Considering that the Sheriff gets a commission for doing this there is a big conflict of interest here?

    There are apparently about 600 properties repossessed each year.
    With 53,000 odd homes in six month or more arrears now expect this to become more common.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,560 ✭✭✭Wile E. Coyote


    20Cent wrote: »
    It seems that the registrar of the court who grants repossession is also the Sheriff who does the evicting. Considering that the Sheriff gets a commission for doing this there is a big conflict of interest here?

    I doubt very much that anyone is signing off on repossessions simply to get an extra few quid each month. If an order for possession is granted it's because the owner hasn't paid and hasn't engaged with their bank over their arrears.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    I doubt very much that anyone is signing off on repossessions simply to get an extra few quid each month. If an order for possession is granted it's because the owner hasn't paid and hasn't engaged with their bank over their arrears.

    I doubt it also but even the possibility seems wrong.


  • Registered Users Posts: 516 ✭✭✭Atlantis50


    20Cent wrote: »
    A home repossession was peacefully stopped by supporters who talked the Sheriff out of turfing someone from their home in Laois.
    http://laoistatler.ie/2012/02/house-repossession-in-laois-stopped-thanks-to-people-power/

    With many more foreclosures in the post for the near future different groups are pledging to try and halt these evictions.
    Video:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpUjl4LvQM8

    An interesting development and one that is sure to become more common since so many householders are in mortgage arrears at the moment.
    The mortgage timebomb is the next big crash something needs to be done about it quickly or there will be a lot more incidents like this.

    I think evicting thousands of people is not feasible and the attempts at resolving the problem so whats going to happen? Seems like some sort of debt forgiveness is inevitable.

    Forget it. There's no such thing as a free house.

    Pay your bills or GTFO.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    Atlantis50 wrote: »
    Forget it. There's no such thing as a free house.

    Pay your bills or GTFO.

    Under normal circumstances I'd agree but considering the banks have been bailed out and the developers this isn't a normal situation. Plus thousands of evictions is the last thing we need now re housing these people will probably cost more than letting them stay.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 11,391 Mod ✭✭✭✭Captain Havoc


    Saw the video there and knew there would be a thread in here on it. I think it's making a mockery of the people who are working hard, sacrificing and worrying to pay their mortgages.

    https://ormondelanguagetours.com

    Walking Tours of Kilkenny in English, French or German.



  • Registered Users Posts: 516 ✭✭✭Atlantis50


    20Cent wrote: »
    Under normal circumstances I'd agree but considering the banks have been bailed out and the developers this isn't a normal situation. Plus thousands of evictions is the last thing we need now re housing these people will probably cost more than letting them stay.

    People should come to a payment plan with their banks. Pay a smaller monthly installment over a longer period.

    If they won't agree to that, it's perfectly reasonable to repossess the house.


  • Registered Users Posts: 514 ✭✭✭bedrock#1


    Saw the video there and knew there would be a thread in here on it. I think it's making a mockery of the people who are working hard, sacrificing and worrying to pay their mortgages.

    Well hate to break the news to you, while you're here complaining about people attempting to stand up for something/anything in this shambles of a country the government the banks and the EU are making a mockery of YOU and ME and every other chump on the island.

    Maybe wreak some havoc over there in Leinster house Captain?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,949 ✭✭✭The Waltzing Consumer


    bedrock#1 wrote: »
    Well hate to break the news to you, while you're here complaining about people attempting to stand up for something/anything in this shambles of a country the government the banks and the EU are making a mockery of YOU and ME and every other chump on the island.

    Maybe wreak some havoc over there in Leinster house Captain?

    really? You may be right in regards the bank bailouts, but lets just put that aside for the moment.

    We spend a hell of a lot more then we take in as a country.
    Right now, we are getting loans from EU/IMF with a much lower interest rate then if we were borrowing on the markets.
    So with or without bank bailouts, we would be in same position.
    So the EU/IMF are making a mockery of us by giving us loans at a cheaper rate???:confused:
    Do you prefer we default, or maybe pay a much higher interest rate?
    Do you prefer we cut our budget to exactly what we spend?

    I don't get why you said the Government are making a mockery of You and Me, cause we had an election a year ago, it was all free, there have no major protests, opinion polls are strong for the Government and it all is fairly stable. So looking at it objectively, it seems the Government are acting exactly the same the majority of people want it to act.

    and that my friend is democracy. It is the worst form of Government until you try anything else.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,949 ✭✭✭The Waltzing Consumer


    20Cent wrote: »
    There are apparently about 600 properties repossessed each year.
    With 53,000 odd homes in six month or more arrears now expect this to become more common.

    First, well no, there is not 600 properties repossessed each year, that's bull.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0104/1224309779037.html

    2011 - 250 homes
    2010 - 327 homes
    2009 - 293 homes
    2008 - 238 homes
    2007 - 109 homes

    I don't like people fear mongering and predicting mass evictions with sobbing families crying by the roadside. It makes you sound like Fox News.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    First, well no, there is not 600 properties repossessed each year, that's bull.

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0104/1224309779037.html

    2011 - 250 homes
    2010 - 327 homes
    2009 - 293 homes
    2008 - 238 homes
    2007 - 109 homes

    I don't like people fear mongering and predicting mass evictions with sobbing families crying by the roadside. It makes you sound like Fox News.

    The central bank have it as much higher.
    http://www.centralbank.ie/press-area/press-releases/Pages/ResidentialMortgageArrearsandRepossessionStatisticstoDecember2011.aspx

    The IBA are warning of a flood of repossessions this year.
    Don't think its fear mongering to say it is going to be a huge problem in the near future.
    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/brokers-fear-20000-home-repossession-cases-in-year-2527398.html
    Didn't Bill Clinton even single it out as what he thought would be a major inhibitor of recovery.


  • Registered Users Posts: 988 ✭✭✭LostinKildare


    20Cent wrote: »
    The central bank have it as much higher.
    http://www.centralbank.ie/press-area/press-releases/Pages/ResidentialMortgageArrearsandRepossessionStatisticstoDecember2011.aspx

    The IBA are warning of a flood of repossessions this year.
    Don't think its fear mongering to say it is going to be a huge problem in the near future.
    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/brokers-fear-20000-home-repossession-cases-in-year-2527398.html
    Didn't Bill Clinton even single it out as what he thought would be a major inhibitor of recovery.

    The Central Bank counts all repossessions -- about 600 last year; the article Waltzing Consumer points to tallies only court-ordered repossessions. That's the discrepancy.

    EDIT: There are also about 12,000 repossessions "in train" -- final demand notices made and/or legal proceedings underway. http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/finance/2012/0218/1224311977384.html

    Most repossessions are "voluntary," i.e., the properties are abandoned, or the home owners don't fight the repossession in court, perhaps because they don't think they can win and don't want to have costs held against them on top of everything else.

    For people who are in the position where they 1) they drew down their mortgage before Dec 1 2009, and 2) the bank's demand for possession was made after Dec 1 2009, they should seek advice before they voluntarily submit to repossession. Apparently there is a legal loophole that will stop the repossession if they see the case to court:

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2011/0726/1224301383116.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,949 ✭✭✭The Waltzing Consumer


    20Cent wrote: »
    The IBA are warning of a flood of repossessions this year.
    Don't think its fear mongering to say it is going to be a huge problem in the near future.
    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/brokers-fear-20000-home-repossession-cases-in-year-2527398.html
    Didn't Bill Clinton even single it out as what he thought would be a major inhibitor of recovery.

    No offense, but that is an article from Feb 2011 saying within the next 12 months. So we have gone through that 12 months and they have amazingly wrong.

    They predict: 15000-20000
    What actually happened: 250 homes

    I am not sure what you are trying to prove here with your predictions. You base your prediction on a prediction which has been proved, in fact, thoroughly wrong.

    The only reason they got it so wrong is fear mongering or absolute stupidity.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,934 ✭✭✭20Cent


    No offense, but that is an article from Feb 2011 saying within the next 12 months. So we have gone through that 12 months and they have amazingly wrong.

    They predict: 15000-20000
    What actually happened: 250 homes

    I am not sure what you are trying to prove here with your predictions. You base your prediction on a prediction which has been proved, in fact, thoroughly wrong.

    The only reason they got it so wrong is fear mongering or absolute stupidity.

    See LostInKildares post above, not scaremongering.
    Leaving problems until them become a crisis has not worked out to well for us recently.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,949 ✭✭✭The Waltzing Consumer


    20Cent wrote: »
    See LostInKildares post above, not scaremongering.
    Leaving problems until them become a crisis has not worked out to well for us recently.

    Ahhhhhhh :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 14,005 ✭✭✭✭AlekSmart


    20Cent wrote: »
    See LostInKildares post above, not scaremongering.
    Leaving problems until them become a crisis has not worked out to well for us recently.

    SO.....there is a "Problem" ?

    What exactly is the "Problem" and how many are affected by it ?

    I have little doubt but the subjecty of the Laois occurrence will have further proceedings institued or the same proceedings re-visited after a suitable pause for thought...

    In many cases highlighted in accounts of Court Ordered Reposessions payments stopped up to 7 years ago and all communications also halted.....Our Courts in general are very fair and accomodating towards persons who display a willingness to recognize the seriousness of the problem.

    However,this engagement and accomodation process does not make for stimulating or thunderous bloggerey....:(


    Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.

    Charles Mackay (1812-1889)



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,299 ✭✭✭✭MadsL


    How do we feel about a TD taking part?

    Joan Collins - not the only one she's been involved in.

    http://www.peoplebeforeprofit.ie/node/683


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators, Regional South East Moderators Posts: 11,391 Mod ✭✭✭✭Captain Havoc


    bedrock#1 wrote: »
    Well hate to break the news to you, while you're here complaining about people attempting to stand up for something/anything in this shambles of a country the government the banks and the EU are making a mockery of YOU and ME and every other chump on the island.

    Maybe wreak some havoc over there in Leinster house Captain?

    No, I think I'd prefer to voluntarily go to the bank, take out a mortgage and not bother to pay it back. Whilst I don't want to see a family turfed out onto the street, I can't get my head around someone taking out a mortgage and expecting there to be no consequences when they can't pay it back. Why would a bank give anyone money? If this sort of codology goes through, the banks will never give another mortgage again. Surely at some stage it would have been possible for him to cut a deal with the bank, sell, downsize?

    https://ormondelanguagetours.com

    Walking Tours of Kilkenny in English, French or German.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,078 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    20Cent wrote: »
    See LostInKildares post above, not scaremongering.
    Leaving problems until them become a crisis has not worked out to well for us recently.

    So what do you suggest ?
    That people who are not repaying their mortgages are allowed stay in their properties and the bank or lending institution just takes the hit ?

    Basically you are talking about a "bailout" of all people who are in mortgage default.
    Where do you draw the line ?
    Would you only bailout those in normal family homes or would you include those who bought 6 bedroom, 6 bathroom mansions ?
    After all it would still be someones home.

    From memory over on Accomodation and Property were you a property investor/speculator and even a couple of years ago were telling us how it was a time to invest.
    Didn't you also start a thread some time about debt forgiveness ?

    You mentioned something about Bill Clinton saying mortgages defualts, repossessions would be inhibitor to economic growth.
    Aren't you really saying that anything that may have detrimental effect on house prices will affect economic growth ?

    Funny how some always sing the hymm that house prices are important to our economy. :rolleyes:


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