The 16 Days Campaign.

Mikel · 07-12-2008 9:39pm

metrovelvet wrote: »

I dont know where you were volunteering but I can see in certain instances where being denied use of the car would be an abusive power trip. Lets say you live, as many do, in plaaces with no public transport. How are you supposed to get food for yourself and your children without the car? How are you supposed to leave someone abusive with no way to get anywhere. In certain cases it could be seen as a means to imprison someone.

That doesn't mean that being denied the use of the car = abuse.
Again, what you are doing is widening the scope of the definition to the point it becomes meaningless.
I could deny my wife the use of the car because she keeps crashing it. Does that make it abuse? No.
This way of thinking could be applied to anything, add enough 'what ifs' and voila! it's 'abusive'.

In certain cases it could be seen as a means to imprison someone.

if there was such as case, there would be other things of a more serious nature that would render the inclusion of such a criterion redundant

metrovelvet · 08-12-2008 3:21am

Not at all. I'm providing a context in which it becomes quite meaningful and is abusive.

Dragan · 08-12-2008 10:36am

cuckoo wrote: »

I don't understand how men are removed from the solution.

I'm just really confused by the responses here from some posters about this campaign, I know picking apart stats is the closest thing to a national sport that boards.ie has, but i'm still bemused by this.

How can campaigning against domestic violence, and abuse, not be a Good Thing?

Because what is it going to acheive? How much benefit will all the money, time and effort that people put into this campaing actually have?

I mean, who are they aiming this at? Women? Men? Chances are if you are the type of person to physically abuse another then an add on the telly or a sig on boards is not going to help.

Raising awareness? Already quite aware, thank you very much.

Chances are if the people behind this would just put the money into a shelter, free counselling and other avenues of suppport it would have a better impact.

imho.

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 10:42am

Dragan wrote: »

Raising awareness? Already quite aware, thank you very much.

That great but not everyone is you and it is still for many such a taboo subject that until it starts happening to them they are in the dark.

Dragan wrote: »

Chances are if the people behind this would just put the money into a shelter, free counselling and other avenues of suppport it would have a better impact.

imho.

Actually if you had bothered to click on the links you would see that they already do provide " shelters, free counseling and other avenues of support " but people need to know those services are there.

IF this thread or the campaign get 1 person who is in an abusive relationship the help they need or makes them reach out and look for help or makes 1 have a think about partner abuse and domestic abuse and resolve never to be the abused or the abuser then the time and electrons that go into the campaign has been worth it IMHO.

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 10:50am

Oh and as for all the rubbish about leaving 'men' out of the equation, I agree that it is a male issue also not just in terms that men can be and are victims of partner abuse but that the fathers, sons, brothers, friends, of victims are effected and play a part in saying such abuse is not to be tolerated and is not an acceptable way to treat anyone and esp not the person who is ment to be our partner.

But as Jules pointed out this IS the ladies lounge and I choose to place it here to talk about these issues from a female point of view with the majority of other posters who are female.

I will happily applaud and support any poster esp a male poster who wants to start a thread on this topic from a male perspective in another forum with a male remit.

Dragan · 08-12-2008 11:13am

Thaedydal wrote: »

Actually if you had bothered to click on the links you would see that they already do provide " shelters, free counseling and other avenues of support " but people need to know those services are there.

Eh.......where did i say they didn't? I said if they put the money for all this campaigning etc into those avenues, it would be, in my opinion, a much better move.

With regard to campainging in general, the people who these folk NEED to reach, that is to say the victims of the abuse are hihgly unlike to ever see this information in this format. That is a simple truth.

IF this thread or the campaign get 1 person who is in an abusive relationship the help they need or makes them reach out and look for help or makes 1 have a think about partner abuse and domestic abuse and resolve never to be the abused or the abuser then the time and electrons that go into the campaign has been worth it IMHO.

And with all due respect Thae it is exactly this line of thinking that allows ineffectual and pointless waste of money to continue. If something is only reaching 1 person that thing is a complete failure.

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 11:21am

Dragan wrote: »

Eh.......where did i say they didn't? I said if they put the money for all this campaigning etc into those avenues, it would be, in my opinion, a much better move.

What is the point of having a web presence if you do not use it, I think it is great to see that it is being used.

Dragan wrote: »

With regard to campainging in general, the people who these folk NEED to reach, that is to say the victims of the abuse are hihgly unlike to ever see this information in this format. That is a simple truth.

I disagree from just having been able to link info from those sites to people over my 6 years on this site alone it has been helpful to being able to reach people who are in need and make others aware. And those in turn then are equipped to pass it on.

Dragan wrote: »

And with all due respect Thaed it is exactly this line of thinking that allows ineffectual and pointless waste of money to continue. If something is only reaching 1 person that thing is a complete failure.

I was talking about my time in making some small effort to make a difference.

I absolutely fúcking hate that when this topic come up that it gets hopped on and people try to make less of it
or say they don't believe it happens and side track the issue into other stuff rather then say, Domestic abuse is
intolerable, it is not excusable and it happens far to often.

Dragan · 08-12-2008 11:57am

Thaedydal wrote: »

I absolutely fúcking hate that when this topic come up that it gets hopped on and people try to make less of it
or say they don't believe it happens and side track the issue into other stuff rather then say, Domestic abuse is
intolerable, it is not excusable and it happens far to often.

And i definitively never said anything like that.

I can't actually see anyone say that in this thread. Asking for solid numbers around these things is not "making less of it".

It's asking for a bit of proof that the people doing the asking have some kind of foothold in reality.

JC 2K3 · 08-12-2008 1:19pm

Re: the whole men being left out thing, it's easy to say that this campaign doesn't disregard the fact that men get abused, it's just not the focus of this particular one etc., but unfortunately, such a campaign can come across as slightly anti-male.

In the same way that a lot of women, presumably, feel great sympathy for female victims of abuse due to being members of the same gender, a lot of men feel uncomfortable with statistics telling them that 20% of men in relationships are abusive, or that one in four men attending college are rapists (assuming no serial rapists and a 50:50 male:female divide). This is why such statistics are questioned and a lot of men are unlikely to support something like this.

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 1:57pm

I don't think those fact if they are right are anti men it think they are anti abusive arseholes and anti rapists.

I for one would love to see that more men speak out against rape and domestic abuse
saying to their friends and peers "that **** is not cool".

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 2:11pm

http://ireland16days.blogspot.com/2008/12/16-days-in-ireland-day-13.html

Today is Day 13 of the 16 Days Campaign. The Yana North Cork Domestic Violence Project have organised a bingo evening to raise funds for the project in Woodview Drive Community Centre, Mallow at 3pm.

There are 4 days left in the campaign so you still have time to support the events running throughout the 16 Days period (25th November to 10th December):

Events which began earlier in the 16 Days continue today, including:

* The Women's Aid 'Love Hearts' Postcard Awareness Campaign
* The Women's Aid '16 Facts for 16 Days' Email Campaign
* Sonas Housing Association Postcard Awareness Campaign
* 'In Her Shoes' exhibitions in Westport, Castlebar, Ballina, Claremorris and Belmullet (Mayo) and in the Solas Family Resource Centre, Headford, and Aonad Family Resource Centre, Galway
* Newpark Close Family Resource Centre in Kilkenny will start their exhibition entitled 'Secret Life'.
* Northwest Roscommon CDP Ltd will also be running an "In Her Shoes" Exhibition in support of the 16 Campaign.
* St. Fergal's Family Resource Centre 'Don't Bring Me Flowers' Campaign in Bray
* The South West Kerry Women's Association 16 Days Art Competition
* Castlerea Women's Group, Co. Roscommon 'Shine a Light' awareness campaign
* Ronanstown CDP, Dublin 'Light a Candle Campaign'
* The Doras Buí community 'vision wall' and large banner display, Coolock, Dublin 5
* Newbridge Family Resource Centre's 'Leave Your Mark against Violence against Women' Campaign
* Ringsend Action Project, Dublin 4 'The Phone' Campaign
* Aoibneas Women and Children's Refuge in Coolock, Dublin 5 '16 Days - 16 Scenarios' email campaign
* Donegal Women's Domestic Violence Service Art and Poetry Exhibition
* YANA, North Cork Domestic Violence Project, 'Where there is darkness there is light' 16 Days Campaign
* Inishowen Women's Outreach will be carrying out training and awareness raising sessions in local health centres and surgeries throughout the 16 Days.

Other events may be taking place around the country. Contact your local domestic violence service or Rape Crisis Centre directly.

belfastbelle · 08-12-2008 4:22pm

I think that is it unfair to say that resources would be better used in providing services rather than raising awareness - if you did a bit of research you would find that all of these support agencies provide information and support to women experiencing domestic violence 365 days of the year.

The 16 Days Campaign as far as I can see is a specific 16 day period set aside to raise awareness about the issue - for the general public and for women who may benefit from knowing what help is available.

There is, imho, still a need to debunk all of the myths surrounding violence against women as there are plenty of out there in Irish society.

metrovelvet · 08-12-2008 5:16pm

Dragan wrote: »

With regard to campainging in general, the people who these folk NEED to reach, that is to say the victims of the abuse are hihgly unlike to ever see this information in this format. That is a simple truth.
.

Why do you say this? How do you know this? Maybe its not just the victims who need to see this,but their neighbors,communties, families, children, etc.

Dragan · 08-12-2008 5:27pm

metrovelvet wrote: »

Why do you say this? How do you know this? Maybe its not just the victims who need to see this,but their neighbors,communties, families, children, etc.

Eh, based of various years of helping out with other charities, organisations, campaigns etc.

I can apply the exact same question to people who think i am wrong.

Let me put it this way, other than Thae's posts and the odd sig i have seen nothing, anywhere, about this.

belfastbelle · 08-12-2008 5:56pm

So, you didn't see all of the newspapers on 25th November which featured a picture of the 5 brides at the Women's Aid demo outside the Dail the day before, or any of the postcards in the dublin cafes and restaurants, or any of the chatter online?

I suspect that we don't hear it on TV, radio, bus shelters etc is that the organisation/s are doing brilliant work on miniscule budgets.

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 6:02pm

Dragan wrote: »

Let me put it this way, other than Thae's posts and the odd sig i have seen nothing, anywhere, about this.

Which was why I made a point of having the sig and starting the thread
for those who had not seen it campaign cos they aren't' watching the new or reading the paper or subscribed to irishblogs or any of the other online place which are taking part in and reporting on the 16 days campaign which is a global campaign.

Again there is a list of all the events being run NATIONWIDE, all around the country as part of this.

The whole point is awareness raising and if I have managed to help in that then that my altruism appeased for a while.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2008/1125/1227486545306.html

Protection urged for women suffering abuse
In this section »

GENEVIEVE CARBERY

LEGAL PROTECTION for women experiencing abuse in relationships outside of marriage was urged by a charity yesterday.

Almost a quarter of calls to the Women's Aid helpline last year were from women being abused by their ex-spouse.

Women's Aid yesterday launched a 16-day campaign on domestic violence and marked the eve of the international day for the elimination of violence against women.

Women dressed as brides holding love-heart placards stood outside the Dáil for the launch. One in five hearts read "raped or beaten", as one-fifth of Irish women experience domestic abuse, the organisation said.

However, many women experience violence outside the marital context, by boyfriends, cohabitees and ex-husbands, but many cannot avail of protection, Margaret Martin, director of Women's Aid, said. She called on the Government to use the new Civil Partnership Bill to "extend protection from domestic violence to all those experiencing it" by removing "all residency requirements for domestic violence safety and protection orders". This would mean people dating and post-separation could also have protection.

She compared the abuses experienced by women in the home to those suffered by prisoners of conscience. "The type and levels of violence which women in Ireland experience at home is shockingly similar, from being tied and beaten to denied sleep or food and drink to regular rapes.

metrovelvet · 08-12-2008 6:12pm

Why only outside of marriage?

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 6:14pm

Cos if you are married and experiencing domestic abuse you are offered more protection under the law then if you are not.

metrovelvet · 08-12-2008 6:16pm

Thaedydal wrote: »

Cos if you are married and experiencing domestic abuse you are offered more protection under the law then if you are not.

Really? That seems a little disgusting. Can you elaborate?

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 6:35pm

http://www.womensaid.ie/pages/services/legal.htm

Who can avail of Protection through the Courts?

You are eligible to apply for the above orders if you belong to one of the following categories:

* Married Couple - a married person can apply for protection against violence by their spouse.
* Cohabiting Couples - The protection available depends on how long the couple have been living together, and who owns the family home. If you have been living with your partner for 6 months out of the previous 12 months, you can apply for a safety order. To apply for a barring order, you must be living with your partner for 6 months out of the previous 9 months. Orders will not be granted if the violent person owns or has greater ownership of the family home than you do.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/birth-family-relationships/problems-in-marriages-and-relationships/barring_safety_and_protection_orders

Rules

If you are married, and can show the court that your spouse is violent in any way towards you or the children, you can get an order against him/her no matter how long you have lived together and even if he/she owns most or all of the house.

If you are not married, you can get an order against a violent partner if:

* you have been living together for a prescribed length of time (six out of the previous twelve months for a safety order, or six out of nine months for a barring order)
* he/she does not own most or all of the house you are living in.

metrovelvet · 08-12-2008 6:39pm

^ That is so so screwed up. Is there any reasoning behind it?

belfastbelle · 08-12-2008 6:41pm

http://archives.tcm.ie/irishexaminer/2008/11/25/story78384.asp

I think this longer Examiner piece might explain, but from what I read, I think it means that there are certain residency clauses necessary that prohibit women accessing protective orders under the Domestic Violence Act.

I think that if you are not living with a person you cannot avail of orders (so this would affect people not living together or a woman who has left the relationship but still suffering abuse).

Also, I also think that there is something like a 6 month rule whereby you have to be able to show that you have been living with someone for this length of time in order to access protective orders (protection, safety, barring).

Seems like a legal loophole that leaves some women in abusive relationships vulnerable.

But hey, I am no legal brain, that is just my reading of it.

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 7:09pm

http://archives.tcm.ie/irishexaminer/2008/11/25/story78384.asp

Campaign highlights domestic abuse

VICTIMS of domestic abuse were remembered at the launch of a campaign to stop violence against women.

The fear felt under the facade of a loving partner was highlighted by Women’s Aid which revealed women are most vulnerable in their own home.

One in five females in Ireland experience domestic violence, with one in seven suffering severe physical, emotional or sexual abuse.

Margaret Martin, director of Women’s Aid, said almost 2,500 incidents ofphysical abuse were reported to its helpline last year, with some victims being tied up and locked in a room for days, having boiling water thrown in their face, punched, beaten, burnt and even shot at.

Almost a quarter of callers said they were abused by an ex-spouse or former partner.

Its Home Truths Campaign marked International Day Against Violence Against Women and the 60th anniversary year of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

“When we think of human rights abuses we tend to think of the prisoner of conscience in a distant land or the actions of an oppressive regime,” said Ms Martin.

“But the type and levels of violence which women in Ireland experience athome, is shockingly similar, from being tied and beaten to denied sleep or food and drink, to regular rapes.”

Since 1996, 146 women have been murdered in Ireland. Of the resolved cases, half were murdered by a partner or ex-partner.

The organisation used traditional symbols of intimate relationships — the wedding dress, bride, and love hearts — to highlight the underside of theserelationships in an installation outside the Dáil.

Ms Martin said the items highlighted the darker side of being in love.

“While the Women’s Aid Helpline Statistics show that marriage is still the most common context for domestic violence, it is by no means the only context, and many women experience domestic violence at the hands of cohabitees, boyfriends and exes,” said Ms Martin.

“However, many of those who experience domestic violence outside the context of marriage cannot avail of legal protection from the violence.

“The new Civil Partnership Bill provides a wonderful opportunity to extend protection from domestic violence to all those experiencing it. Women’s Aid welcomes the changes to date, but is calling on the Government to ensure that all residency requirements be removed from domestic violence Safety and Protection Orders. This will ensure that those experiencing domestic violence in dating relationships and after separation will be eligible for protection.”

The National Women’s Council of Ireland (NWCI) vowed to stand in solidarity with Women’s Aid to oppose violence against women.

Joanna McMinn, NWCI director, said home is not a safe place for victims ofdomestic violence, but a place of fear, violence, rape, abuse and terror.

“Women in Ireland continue to face discrimination, violence and injusticesimply because of their gender,” said Ms McMinn.

“The 16 Days of Action Campaign highlights domestic violence as an abuse of basic human rights.”

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 7:10pm

metrovelvet wrote: »

^ That is so so screwed up. Is there any reasoning behind it?

It is not the 'family' home unless you are married.

Permabear · 08-12-2008 7:22pm

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metrovelvet · 08-12-2008 7:37pm

No you are most certainly not alone. I find this kind of street theatre embarrassing for a number of reasons including the one you mention above. Furthermore, they coopt the Christian and heterosexual wedding symbols to get their sinister point across.

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 7:39pm

donegalfella wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

That is the point being made.

Permabear · 08-12-2008 7:43pm

This post has been deleted.

Nevyn · 08-12-2008 7:47pm

IT has the trappings of love and the symbols and the person being abused will often forgive the abuser due to 'love'. When we love someone we become vonerable to them
and there should be mutual respect so that that is not taken advantage of and clearly this is not the case for everyone.

Permabear · 08-12-2008 8:02pm

This post has been deleted.

The 16 Days Campaign.

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