Ireland to assist in migrant crisis in the Med.

jackofalltrades · 04-07-2015 10:29pm

Nodin wrote:

The vast majority leave.

Source?

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

The more economically active people living in a country the healthier the economy teds to be. Economically active people tend to spend their money on goods and services which also benefits the economy. Even better if the economically active people arrive in the country with their education already paid for by someone else. Better still if some of the economically active people set up businesses and even better still if they employ others.......

Yes but non-EU immigrants tend to be less economically active than the native population.
Can you point to economic data that shows that non-EU immigrants provide a net economic benefit to this country?

Nodin · 04-07-2015 10:46pm

jackofalltrades wrote: »

Source?

..........

Those that don't leave voluntarily are deported. It's roughly the same system as in Britain.
http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/PR13000002

AlekSmart · 04-07-2015 11:18pm

Nodin wrote: »

Those that don't leave voluntarily are deported. It's roughly the same system as in Britain.
http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/PR13000002

So,Ireland managed to actually deport 298 failed asylum seekers and illegal migrants from the State in 2012.

Provisional figures for end 2012 indicate that there were approximately 4,750 persons seeking international protection accommodated in direct provision centres in the State,

It would appear then,that without taking in a single Quota migrant from the L.E Eithne's Mediterranian cruise,we still have c.4,400 to process.

Commonsense would suggest that Ireland processes it's existing cases,and either accepts OR deports these BEFORE launching forth with some half-baked attempt to revive the Mare Nostrum programme.

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly · 05-07-2015 12:32am

xhoundx wrote: »

Fantastic idea and seeing as you make it sound so easy howabouts we try get our own unemployed economically active before we take in any illegal immigrants?

Perhaps "our own unemployed" don't have the skill sets to match whatever positions may be available at this time but that if overall economic activity were to increase then opportunities could become available.

xhoundx · 05-07-2015 9:21am

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

Perhaps "our own unemployed" don't have the skill sets to match whatever positions may be available at this time but that if overall economic activity were to increase then opportunities could become available.

So are you suggesting we follow the Australian model where we would create a skills shortage list and invite applications for temporary visas to come here and take up employment in these areas?

If so that sounds like a good idea, I'd be in favour of such a plan.

In the meantime what do you suggest we do with thousands of unskilled illegal immigrants who most likely don't speak English and come from a completely alien culture to our own? What jobs do you suggest they are coming here to take up? How will they coming here help the country economically?

_Kaiser_ · 05-07-2015 12:31pm

xhoundx wrote: »

So are you suggesting we follow the Australian model where we would create a skills shortage list and invite applications for temporary visas to come here and take up employment in these areas?

If so that sounds like a good idea, I'd be in favour of such a plan.

In the meantime what do you suggest we do with thousands of unskilled illegal immigrants who most likely don't speak English and come from a completely alien culture to our own? What jobs do you suggest they are coming here to take up? How will they coming here help the country economically?

Wasting your time mate

The only reasoning put forward is some vague notion of immigration being good for an economy, or it's our "duty" to help those worse off etc - and both of these ideas aren't incorrect so long as the new arrivals offer some benefit or skill that we need and don't have, and so long as the country is able to support these people and offer them employment that doesn't come at the expense of its own citizens.

The reality is that there is no argument for taking in thousands of illegal immigrants, the majority of which won't speak English, may be illiterate, unskilled, and who come from cultures that we - in our enlightenment - consider savage and backwards but which is perfectly normal to them. The security risk this last bit poses is also very real and not being considered in the rush to show what good EU citizens we are :rolleyes:

It'll be interesting to see how these same people react if parts of Ireland end up like our UK neighbours... no-go ghettos with vigilante enforcement of religious and cultural practices that are wholy incompatible with a modern Western country... or do we need the return of security checkpoints and maybe a terror attack before the liberal advocates of this idea wake up to the reality of what they're supporting?

DeadHand · 05-07-2015 12:40pm

xhoundx wrote: »

Fantastic idea and seeing as you make it sound so easy howabouts we try get our own unemployed economically active before we take in any illegal immigrants?

... Or try to stop or own youth leaving instead of forcing them into exile and replacing them with parasitic illegals...

xhoundx · 05-07-2015 2:20pm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Wasting your time mate

The only reasoning put forward is some vague notion of immigration being good for an economy, or it's our "duty" to help those worse off etc - and both of these ideas aren't incorrect so long as the new arrivals offer some benefit or skill that we need and don't have, and so long as the country is able to support these people and offer them employment that doesn't come at the expense of its own citizens.

The reality is that there is no argument for taking in thousands of illegal immigrants, the majority of which won't speak English, may be illiterate, unskilled, and who come from cultures that we - in our enlightenment - consider savage and backwards but which is perfectly normal to them. The security risk this last bit poses is also very real and not being considered in the rush to show what good EU citizens we are :rolleyes:

It'll be interesting to see how these same people react if parts of Ireland end up like our UK neighbours... no-go ghettos with vigilante enforcement of religious and cultural practices that are wholy incompatible with a modern Western country... or do we need the return of security checkpoints and maybe a terror attack before the liberal advocates of this idea wake up to the reality of what they're supporting?

I know but it's funny asking questions I know the shills can't answer.

If there was a good reason for taking in illegal immigrants then the countries of Europe would be fighting over who gets to take them, rather than fighting over not wanting anything to do with them.

jackofalltrades · 05-07-2015 2:45pm

Nodin wrote: »

Those that don't leave voluntarily are deported. It's roughly the same system as in Britain.
http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/PR13000002

That link doesn't prove that the "vast majority leave".
It just shows how many left voluntarily in one year.
And that number doesn't say whether they were asylum seekers or not.

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly · 05-07-2015 3:00pm

DeadHand wrote: »

... Or try to stop or own youth leaving instead of forcing them into exile and replacing them with ...

But were not FORCING them to do anything -They're economic migrants (TM)

Nodin · 05-07-2015 3:19pm

jackofalltrades wrote: »

That link doesn't prove that the "vast majority leave".
It just shows how many left voluntarily in one year.
And that number doesn't say whether they were asylum seekers or not.

Fair enough, they're all hidin in the bushes in Fairview park.

xhoundx · 05-07-2015 3:27pm

Nodin wrote: »

Fair enough, they're all hidin in the bushes in Fairview park.

As plausible a notion as any of your posts on this topic

xhoundx · 05-07-2015 3:28pm

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

But were not FORCING them to do anything -They're economic migrants (TM)

So reading between the lines you can't give a single good reason why we should take on illegal immigrants?

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly · 05-07-2015 4:23pm

I already have

xhoundx · 05-07-2015 4:43pm

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

I already have

You said something about economic activity being good for a country, maybe your post explaining how importing unskilled illegal immigrants would be a good thing got deleted?

DeadHand · 05-07-2015 5:45pm

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

But were not FORCING them to do anything -They're economic migrants (TM)

They are.

But the countries that recieve them want them and they contribute toward those countries. In comparison...

Europe does not want or need these illegal, illiterate, misogynistic, homophobic, intolerant invaders. They will contribute exactly zero. They will be at best a parasitic presence. At worst, they are a serious risk to the lives and livelihoods of the indigenous populations.

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly · 05-07-2015 6:15pm

xhoundx wrote: »

unskilled

DeadHand wrote: »

illiterate, misogynistic, homophobic, intolerant .

Been reading their CV's......all of them ?

xhoundx · 05-07-2015 6:19pm

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

Been reading their CV's......all of them ?

Well go on educate us, what skill sets should we expect to find amongst these illegal immigrants?

DeadHand · 05-07-2015 6:38pm

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

Been reading their CV's......all of them ?

No,

Have you? I guess not since most wouldn't feel inclined to or are capable of doing so.

If you are in a boat in the Med trying to get to Europe by default you are illegal and uneducated.

Eutow · 05-07-2015 8:07pm

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

Been reading their CV's......all of them ?

No need to. If they had the skill set they wouldn't be coming here illegally, they would apply for a temporary work permit through legitimate means. Coming here illegally gives a good indication that they don't have they skills we want.

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

I already have

You haven't, all I see is a load of waffle, defending people coming here illegally. If you think that is ok, why have any sort of immigration control if you think it is okay to break the rules?

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly · 06-07-2015 12:23am

Eutow wrote: »

all I see is a load of waffle, defending people coming here illegally.

If they are fleeing persecution they are not "coming here illegally"

All I see here is scaremongering and incitement to hatred but then people tend to be very selective over which forms of lawbreaking they pontificate from their high horses about.

SeanW · 06-07-2015 1:07am

end of the road wrote: »

the australians are not that much stronger then ours, they still don't stop extremism. 99 % of them aren't extremists. our soft ways work

Work? Seriously? Islamic State is flooding Europe with illegals, some of them undoubtedly terrorists coming to commit mass murder (remember IS is running the smuggling from its territory in Libya) and our politicians are either to weak-willed or treasonous to protect European borders.

How in the name of all that is holy can you say that "works?"

al22 · 06-07-2015 1:27am

Strange news are coming
Economic migrants who successfully crossed the Mediterranean Sea want to go to the UK, the Netherlands and to Germany as the best places where to go.
The last countries they want to move in are France and Ireland...

darkpagandeath · 06-07-2015 2:09am

xhoundx wrote: »

Well go on educate us, what skill sets should we expect to find amongst these illegal immigrants?

Are they not just going to ask them ?

Interviewer "What's your profession ?"

Migrant "Doctor"

Interviewer "Can we see your Qualifications ?"

Migrant "Err I lost them"

Interviewer "Ah sure it's Grand We will take your word for it"

DeadHand · 06-07-2015 3:50am

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

If they are fleeing persecution they are not "coming here illegally"

All I see here is scaremongering and incitement to hatred but then people tend to be very selective over which forms of lawbreaking they pontificate from their high horses about.

Typical sh1te.

You don't have a leg to stand on or a single, valid counter to the facts presented on this thread so you resort to shrieking about "incitement to hatred" and "scaremongering".

SJW debating 101: when you are clearly wrong and defeated paint your opponents as bigots.

Nodin · 06-07-2015 4:53am

DeadHand wrote: »

Typical sh1te.

You don't have a leg to stand on or a single, valid counter to the facts presented on this thread so you resort to shrieking about "incitement to hatred" and "scaremongering".

SJW debating 101: when you are clearly wrong and defeated paint your opponents as bigots.

Jaysus....where would he get that idea.....

Europe does not want or need these illegal, illiterate, misogynistic,
homophobic, intolerant invaders. They will contribute exactly zero. They will be at best a parasitic presence. At worst, they are a serious risk to the lives and livelihoods of the indigenous populations

AlekSmart · 06-07-2015 6:50am

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

If they are fleeing persecution they are not "coming here illegally"

All I see here is scaremongering and incitement to hatred but then people tend to be very selective over which forms of lawbreaking they pontificate from their high horses about.

Not quite 100% correct though is it ?

Currently,the EU countries have no idea what all of these people are "fleeing".

All we know with any certainty is that large numbers of them,suddenly began departing from Libyan ports almost at a pre-arranged signal ?

If you are suggesting that seeking to maintain the integrity of OUR country's Immigration and Asylum system,flawed as it may be,is "Scaremongering and Incitement to Hatred",then so be it.

However to make such a suggestion rather veers towards "Scaremongering" in itself.

Refusing entry to these people UNTIL they are verifiably compliant is the only reasonable and self-protectant action ANY country can take in the face of what is a highly suspicious migratory flow.

_Kaiser_ · 06-07-2015 8:37am

[QUOTE=AlekSmart;96134704Refusing entry to these people UNTIL they are verifiably compliant is the only reasonable and self-protectant action ANY country can take in the face of what is a highly suspicious migratory flow.[/QUOTE]

.. and until we determine whether this country is in a position to support them in the first place - something I'd seriously question given the thousands already in the system and our existing domestic social/housing/employment issues - and what these people will be able to contribute to the above rather than ending up as a further drain on the State.. something that I'm sure those with a legitimate case wouldn't want themselves.

As I've said before.. if you come here to work, contribute and integrate into your host country and satisfy the conditions for entry and offer valuable skills then by all means welcome to Ireland. If not however, well.....

Eutow · 06-07-2015 9:04pm

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

If they are fleeing persecution they are not "coming here illegally"

All I see here is scaremongering and incitement to hatred but then people tend to be very selective over which forms of lawbreaking they pontificate from their high horses about.

Yes, if....

Anyway, they are illegal because they are trying to enter Europe illegally, no paperwork no documents, very convenient. The majority are economic because they are trying to pick and chose which European country they want to stay in.

Those at Calais are fleeing France because they are getting persecuted..:rolleyes:

As for being selective over forms of law breaking, your buddy EOTR thinks these people are only breaking a small insignificant law, but you and him are surely not being selective now are you...?

I am suspicious of you both as I believe you may be either lawyers or have some other financial way of gaining from this mess.

BlaasForRafa · 07-07-2015 2:34am

Enjoy Heroin Responsibly wrote: »

If they are fleeing persecution they are not "coming here illegally".

The vast majority are not fleeing persecution, if they were then they should look for refugee status in the next neighbouring country to their home state, but they don't do that, they come to the EU.

Ireland to assist in migrant crisis in the Med.

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