St Bernard

Zapperzy · 28-04-2012 11:41pm

lyingeyes wrote: »

Dont bother with vets, my dog has never been vaccinated or neutered, i think that happy dogs are healthy dogs and as long as you take really good care of them they will be unlikely to be ill. Vets will always find somthing wrong.

She hasnt been neutered, i think neutering them makes them age prematurely. They are notoriously hard to breed so she still roams free even in heat and it has never been a problem.

but having said that my whole family adore her, everyone in the house thinks more of the dog than they do anyone else.

If you adore your dog so much then why not bring her to a vet?

Vet's don't make illnesses up. For example unless you've a stethoscope yourself and have done extensive research yourself and know what to listen out for and know what a healthy heart sounds like how do you know she doesn't have heart problems? Lots of people say their older dog is slowing down and just pass it off as old age when actually it could be any number of problems including heart problems, joint issues, kidney problems or a whole list as long as your arm, which all can be diagnosed by a vet and either treated or put on pain relief. I can name off dozens of well loved happy pets given the best care at home but they still end up sick from one thing or another. My own dog has had a knee problem most likely all his life, probably genetic so no matter how well cared for or happy he is he still has it.

Of course vets are a business, most are not charities, 99% of vets have the welfare of the animal first but yes obviously they have to cover costs and at the end of the day like every other business they want to make a profit!

You also do realise that males will do everything to get to a female in heat, it is also not unusual for females to lie down for smaller dogs. Have you ever heard of pyometra? It's an infection in the womb where the womb fills up with pus. It's VERY common, and the older the bitch the more common it is. They get very sick, very dull and depressed and I would imagine in a tremendous amount of pain since the womb swells to sometimes 10 times the size it should be with just pure vile smelling pus. In a younger middle aged bitch it's risky, they have to be on a drip because they're so dehydrated and antibiotics for a few days before they're fit for the operation. Older bitches a lot of the time don't pull through unless you catch it early, even with the best care it takes a toll on them.

Even if you don't believe in neutering and have no intention of changing your mind please research pyometra and keep in mind the symptoms (excessive thirst and urination, dull and depressed and they may or may not have a foul smelling discharge, it usually occurs 5-6 weeks after a season), and bring her to a vet immediately if you notice any.

lyingeyes · 29-04-2012 12:31am

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

Apologies for the off-topic post OP but lyingeyes does your dog always lean so heavily on that same hip or is it just a coincidence that you posted those two pictures? TBF - that's a sign of serious problem with her hips if she always sits like that.[/Quote/
Her walk is fine and she is well able to run and jump up on things, not quite as good as when she was say 14/15mths but she has no problems getting around. Her hip score at 13mths was 5/5.

lyingeyes · 29-04-2012 3:10am

I have read over my original post and I think it was badly worded with the “not bother with the vet” comment. If my dog were to get sick I would bring her to the vets and get her treated, but not unless she was sick, thankfully she is a really healthy dog and never had any illness. I never vaccinated her because I think given the way she is cared for, they are unnecessary and more importantly st’s have fragile immune systems and vital organs and giving medication causes long term strain and damage.
I found an interesting article which I agree with if anyone would like to read it.
http://www.dogs4dogs.com/blog/2009/04/22/no-unnecessary-dog-shots/
I never spayed her because I think that the operation is too severe in itself, the anaesthetics are damaging to vital organs and long term weight gain and hormonal imbalances will shorten her lifespan. I understand the risks of pyometra are really high, up to 25% in females and 33% in male dogs when left full, but the risk does not significantly reduce unless the dog has had the full reproductive system removed, which is not done in routine spaying. I don’t know if I am best to spay her or not to spay her, I think she will be healthier overall for not having been spayed. I’m not concerned about her having pups, she has nothing to breed with.
She is given flea drops regularly, because of the volume of her coat and she gets a lot of ticks at certain times of the year. She is only wormed because we have horses and she is at the dung sometimes, all dogs have worms and some levels of stomach worms are actually essential in their digestive systems, so broad spectrum killers are actually bad for them. Heartworm is uncommon in dogs and unheard of in dogs living in cool climates, despite what pharmaceutical companies say.
I just think that people should do their own research into healthcare and draw their own conclusions because it is a massive industry and it is driven by profit,
I agree that pet insurance is vital, and you need a good cover plan.

Zapperzy · 29-04-2012 3:41am

lyingeyes wrote: »

I have read over my original post and I think it was badly worded with the “not bother with the vet” comment. If my dog were to get sick I would bring her to the vets and get her treated, but not unless she was sick, thankfully she is a really healthy dog and never had any illness. I never vaccinated her because I think given the way she is cared for, they are unnecessary and more importantly st’s have fragile immune systems and vital organs and giving medication causes long term strain and damage.
I found an interesting article which I agree with if anyone would like to read it.
http://www.dogs4dogs.com/blog/2009/04/22/no-unnecessary-dog-shots/
I never spayed her because I think that the operation is too severe in itself, the anaesthetics are damaging to vital organs and long term weight gain and hormonal imbalances will shorten her lifespan. I understand the risks of pyometra are really high, up to 25% in females and 33% in male dogs when left full, but the risk does not significantly reduce unless the dog has had the full reproductive system removed, which is not done in routine spaying. I don’t know if I am best to spay her or not to spay her, I think she will be healthier overall for not having been spayed. I’m not concerned about her having pups, she has nothing to breed with.
She is given flea drops regularly, because of the volume of her coat and she gets a lot of ticks at certain times of the year. She is only wormed because we have horses and she is at the dung sometimes, all dogs have worms and some levels of stomach worms are actually essential in their digestive systems, so broad spectrum killers are actually bad for them. Heartworm is uncommon in dogs and unheard of in dogs living in cool climates, despite what pharmaceutical companies say.
I just think that people should do their own research into healthcare and draw their own conclusions because it is a massive industry and it is driven by profit,
I agree that pet insurance is vital, and you need a good cover plan.

Just to comment on the spaying part. I think you are mixing up your %'s with something as males cannot get pyometra, it is an infection of the uterus which obviously males don't have.

The majority of vets in Ireland remove both the uterus and ovaries which is the full reproductive system, a few vets only remove the ovaries, (mostly german vets I'v noticed), the ones that remove everything say it's due to the risk of stump pyometra if the uterus is left, while the vets I have spoken to who only take the ovaries say the risk of stump pyometra once the ovaries are gone (the hormones which trigger pyometra are removed) is so miniscule it's not worth worrying about.

As for the anaesthetics being damaging, yes and no. Anaesthetic deaths do happen but the risks can be drastically reduced by pre-op bloods (to check if the kidneys and liver are functioning properly to metabolise the drugs) and proper monitoring. Most small animal practices have nurses who monitor the anaesthetic from start to finish, some have better equipment than others and can monitor things like blood pressure but a good nurse is as good as any equipment! Most practices now use gas anaesthesia which means you can adjust the depth and it's much safer.

After spaying her energy needs are reduced, people make the mistake of still feeding the same amount of food and this leads to weight gain so people blame the spay causes their animal to become fat and lazy. When really all you need to do is reduce the food or up the exercise. Not sure what you mean by hormonal imbalances reducing the lifespan, as far as I'm aware I don't think there is any indications that spaying/neutering reduces lifespan, looking at the overall picture it possibly increases lifespan for females due to the risk of pyo.

If you want to do some more research into pro's and con's for spaying there was a one or two really good threads with some really good info (even if a bit scientific at times) in them if you want to do a search. If I remember correctly the overall consensus was there may be an arguement for leaving males intact (certainly until their fully grown and developed) but that it's best to spay females once they are fully grown. If you can't find it I'l do a search in the morning as I'm too tired to go looking now.

onegrandplan · 29-04-2012 5:30am

lyingeyes wrote: »

If my dog were to get sick I would bring her to the vets and get her treated, but not unless she was sick, thankfully she is a really healthy dog and never had any illness.

You've never had a dog before and you're not a vet, so how are you qualified to judge this? Not all illnesses result in vomiting or diarrhea.

I never vaccinated her because I think given the way she is cared for, they are unnecessary and more importantly st’s have fragile immune systems and vital organs and giving medication causes long term strain and damage.

Once again, you are not a vet, you are not qualified to draw such conclusions.

I found an interesting article which I agree with if anyone would like to read it.
http://www.dogs4dogs.com/blog/2009/04/22/no-unnecessary-dog-shots/

One, single article to support your very narrow minded point of view. I could do the same with basically anything really, the internet has a lot of pages on it. However, almost every single person qualified to talk about animal health disagrees with you.

I agree that pet insurance is vital, and you need a good cover plan.

Well, you're clearly not qualified to talk about insurance either, because if you read any of the terms and conditions of the supposed "good cover plan" you supposedly have for your dog, you'd see that your reckless behaviour actually voids any insurance policy you may have on the dog.

Lets take Allianz's policy, widely regarded as the best cover for dogs in Ireland.

<MODSNIP>

So no, you do not need a "good cover plan" when you don't adhere to the very first conditions of that cover plan and void the entire policy immediately.

You are the very definition of an irresponsible dog owner. You never had a dog and bought a giant breed which you're now taking absolutely no care of, yet are preaching at others to ignore the advice of those who do know about caring for dogs. You are totally and utterly clueless and I truly, honestly, feel so sorry for that poor dog that has to live with you.

To anybody reading this, please, please do not listen "lyingeyes". Their ignorance isn't just frustrating to read - it made me register when I usually just lurk! - it's outright dangerous to the health and well being of your or any other dog whose owner believes such bull****. Get your dogs their vaccinations and yearly health check ups and bring it to a vet any time you suspect something is up. Get them insurance and make sure to stick to the terms of that insurance, because otherwise that insurance is worthless.

star-pants · 29-04-2012 7:44am

Guys - attack the post, not the poster please.

Taltos · 29-04-2012 8:33am

Anyway getting back to the OP on this

Hi OP - glad to hear the last week has been fun.

As to food - yup - you need to transition in any new foods very very slowly. If Charlie is anything like mine a change in food has a really bad effect on their stools - resulting in very slushy wet runs...

We did a lot of research on the right type of food as we believe that many vets recommend foods based on the research sponsored by the manufacturing companies...

Key thing for you right now is to choose a food that will not encourage growth - fast growth in this breed is a high causing factor of hip dysplayis - see photos above for some of the symptoms of possible hip issues. This can be quite a serious issue for the breed - one of ours as a 5mth old totally dislocated her right hip as she played with some puppies - yup - her right hip came totally away from the socket.
Food - reasonable exercise - no stairs ... all key.

Right now we are feeding our Orijen (I think is spelling). We mix in some suppliments (powder and oil). Along with some boiled chicken and rice. Occassionally we will mix it up a bit - some mozzerella cheese when they are not that hungry, or some mince instead of the chicken. And every so often some wet dog food (specialised brand) instead of the chicken as well.. Oh and some ham.
All of the food we give them has been certified for human consumption - key for us.

We did try them on the raw food diet - but one of the girls kept having a bad reaction to the fish and hated lamb so we had to go back to Orijen. We have to get this shipped in from one of the websites but have heard that maxizoo might soon start stocking it.

To start with - try feeding Charlie 2 or 3 times a day, suggest you have the food bowl held slightly off the ground. It is not good for this breed to stretch their neck down to the floor to eat. We have adjustable stands to raise the bowls higher and lower.
Also - don't exercise for an hour before and an hour after eating - this can cause gut problems where the intestines wrap around themselves - if you see his stomach swelling rush immediately to the vet - it's rare but can happen - and if untreated is fatal.

Another thing to protect their neck is to use a harness (we use the sensible one - front chest facing harness) - this way when he pulls when walking he will face back towards you. But - big thing - right now if he pulls at all - stop walking immediately until he relaxes and comes back a bit - trust me - when he tops the 7stome mark this will stand to you. My wife is able to walk both of ours - combined weight nearly 15 stone - on her own...

Best of luck - and hope he is doing well.

Photo - photo - photo....

Note: one had a bad case of runs for a few days. Kept her hydrated loads of water and then put both on a simple diet for a week - only boiled chicked breast and boiled rice (with supplements). Check that the rice has no added salt etc. Not great for long term feeding but helped settle their tummies.

deejer · 29-04-2012 11:19am

Before I came to this forum I was under the impression that it was just a happy go lucky place with people swapping photos of their lovely pets. How wrong was I

We have always had a dog at home but I have learned more about them, and pedigree dogs in particular, over the last week than I had in all the time before

Stools are fine again anyway! Changed the food yesterday. Basically the same content from what I can see, just a different brand but he loves it. Im just wondering what are peoples view on the protein content. I read somewhere (maybe here) that it should be kept as low as possible (20%?). The food I see in the pet store for large breed puppies all has protein between 20-30%.

And also insurance has been sorted. That was the fist thing I did.

lyingeyes · 29-04-2012 3:07pm

Zapperzy: My post was confusing, i found this snip of an article "In Sweden, 25% of the intact female dogs will be present for canine pyometra before the age of 10 years. Pyometra is most commonly seen in intact dogs 4-8 weeks after estrus (mean time of 5.4 weeks); however, it can be seen 4 months post estrus as well. Although seen less commonly, cats generally develop pyometra between 1-4 weeks after estrous. Pyometra generally occurs in older (7 to 8 years) intact bitches and queens; however, it may occur in younger animals that have been given estrogen (mis-mating shots) or progestins for estrus suppression".
From this article it says that the most common incidence of pyometra occurs in females that have been left intact but given synthetic hormone shots to supress their heat cycle.
Up to 33% of unneutered male dogs will develop cancer of the reproductive system,

I found this article about neutering:
You often read that neutering will help your dog avoid getting cancers associated with reproductive organs. This is true to the same degree that having a hysterectomy or being castrated will prevent cancer associated with reproductive systems in humans.

If you look beyond the old wives tales, you'll find that veterinarians disagree on the best practice.

For example Veterinary Oncologist Keven Hahn writing in Veterinary Practice News said that after reviewing studies over the last 30 years, he's not sure what to recommend to his clients.

There is a higher incidence of testicular cancer in unneutered dogs, but a higher incidence of cancer of the blood vessels in neutered males. This issue is whether there is a cause and result relationship to any of these.

I dont agree with giving my dog an unnatural synthetic steriod in order to treat a disease or condition that she doesnt have. I think when you start down this path one procedure will lead onto the next, i know a lot of well intentioned owners who followed the advise of their vet and not only did their animals die prematurely "despite the excellent care", they also spent alot of their lives in crates in animal surgeries.

This is not vet bashing, there are some very very good vets out there, but i fear the majority of people in the industry have profit as their main motivation.

planetX · 29-04-2012 3:21pm

lyingeyes wrote: »

If she develops any symptoms of any ailments, then of course she will be brought to the vet, but i dont believe in vaccinations or health check ups. Vets are business people, there to make a profit. This is my opinion,

Did you ever consider that the reason your dog has remained healthy without vaccinations is thanks to the majority of owners who do vaccinate. If everyone thought like you we'd have epidemics of horrific diseases like parvovirus. To advise others to do likewise is grossly irresponsible.

onegrandplan · 29-04-2012 4:16pm

lyingeyes wrote: »

If you look beyond the old wives tales, you'll find that veterinarians disagree on the best practice.

How would you know? You don't use vets, as you've said yourself a number of times here. What you mean is that in your cursory and quite desperate searches on the internet to find some credible resource to back up your quite frankly lunatic point of view you've found a few questionable sources that question the practices recommended by the majority of those qualified to speak on the matter. You are grasping at straws.

This is not vet bashing, there are some very very good vets out there, but i fear the majority of people in the industry have profit as their main motivation.

Again, how would you know? You've no interaction with them. I've a number of friends who are vets, from small animal/pet vets to farm animal/large animal vets and not one of them is in it for the money. There's an awful lot of easier ways to get the same salary as a vet without going through 5 years of an extremely tough course and then working a job that not only includes working crazy hours and being on call most of time but also dealing with an emotional rollercoaster on a personal and professional level every single day.

Your posts are bull**** and nothing more than it and I truly fear for the fate of any animal you come into contact with.

I notice you glossed over the fact that you clearly don't have your dog insured either, or that you've got a policy that you've voided in your reckless behaviour and ridiculous beliefs you hold that contradict that of every credible professional out there. Was that intentional?

The quote was snipped out of my post above but here's a link to the PDF containing the details of the pet care policy from Allianz. http://allianz.ie/Pet-Insurance/Claims/Pet_Insurance_Policy_Document_0610.pdf

I will ask you to look at the General Conditions and particularly 1 and 2. You are expected to bring your dog to the vet and maintain a record of good dog ownership in treatment with a vet. Your "policy" is worthless when you break these conditions. So not only are you not in any position, and I really mean any position, to be recommending to others how to look after a dog, you are in absolutely no position to be preaching to others about insurance.

These may be your "beliefs" or "opinions" but that does not mean they have to be respected, they are absolutely ****ing ludicrous. You are endangering your own dog with your behaviour and that of anyone stupid enough to listen to you, and through potentially carrying diseases from your unvaccinated and un-vet cared dog you are potentially risking the lives of any dog or pup who hasn't had their full set of vaccinations also.

People like you should be banned from homing animals, you're not fit to look after them in any way if you truly believing the absolute sh1te you've spouted on here for the past few days. I truly fear for the health of your dog, if you're so reckless with regards to something as important as basic vet care then I'd hate to think what other areas of the dogs life you're neglecting.

star-pants · 29-04-2012 4:28pm

LAST Warning -- attack the post not the poster and stay ON topic guys.
Anymore off-topic posts (i.e. not directly related to the OP) and ye'll be getting an infraction.

onegrandplan · 29-04-2012 5:05pm

Star-pants, please see the definition of an internet forum and contrast it with the definition of a question and answer site. An example of a question and answer site is StackOverflow.com where one posts a question and people seek to answer that question. A discussion forum is supposed to entertain relatively free flowing conversation on a diverse range of topics, yet for some reason this page, which describes itself as a discussion forum, has people interfering with and surpressing conversation in a way that I've never seen in any conversation medium online in my years of using it.

I'm fully aware of the charters and site policies here, yet none of them say to expect petty, pointless intervention by people who've nothing better to do as the norm. I suppose it explains why most of the more frequent posters here can be found talking more regularly on forums off Boards.ie, away from the over-zealous displays of "power" by the three clowns monitoring this forum.

It's hilarious that Tom Murphy is freaked out over the damage he perceives Sean Sherlock to be capable of doing to Boards.ie, when the people he trusts to keep an eye on the place do more damage to its perception and member participation than any copyright law ever will.

Back to lurking I shall go.

lyingeyes · 29-04-2012 5:07pm

http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/40323_1162795725471_1695202568_317813_7793671_n.jpg

lyingeyes · 29-04-2012 5:20pm

http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/38579_1162794805448_1695202568_317808_84187_n.jpg

http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/39039_1162802725646_1695202568_317852_747729_n.jpg

Op sorry for going off topic, I wish you and your girlfriend all the best with him, i hope he has a long and healthy life and you get as much enjoyment from him as i do mine.

lyingeyes · 29-04-2012 5:23pm

they are beautiful as pups,

http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/197257_1008174260031_1695202568_10545_3506471_n.jpg

Cherry Blossom · 29-04-2012 5:38pm

lyingeyes wrote: »

they are beautiful as pups,

http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/197257_1008174260031_1695202568_10545_3506471_n.jpg

There is a thread in this forum for posting pet pics, don't post any more on this thread.

lyingeyes · 29-04-2012 5:45pm

adrenalinjunkie wrote: »

There is a thread in this forum for posting pet pics, don't post any more on this thread.

why not?? Im not offending anyone, mabe the op wouldnt mind seeing them up here??

Cherry Blossom · 29-04-2012 6:00pm

lyingeyes wrote: »

why not?? Im not offending anyone, mabe the op wouldnt mind seeing them up here??

Because star-pants has already asked that people stay on topic and direct their posts in reply to the OP, and because they add nothing to the thread.

Magenta · 29-04-2012 7:31pm

lyingeyes wrote: »

I have a female saint who will be six in June. She is in good health, she has never been to the vet.

lyingeyes wrote: »

Her hip score at 13mths was 5/5.

I'm confused. She's never been to a vet but she's been hipscored?

Also, her hip score at 13 months is not relevant, she is 6 now. Hip dysplasia progresses over time, hence why decent breeders make sure their dogs have CURRENT certs for their dogs before breeding, not ones from 5 years ago.

lyingeyes · 29-04-2012 7:53pm

Magenta wrote: »

I'm confused. She's never been to a vet but she's been hipscored?

Also, her hip score at 13 months is not relevant, she is 6 now. Hip dysplasia progresses over time, hence why decent breeders make sure their dogs have CURRENT certs for their dogs before breeding, not ones from 5 years ago.

She has been to the vets, but she has never had any vaccinations or operations, she had her dew claws clipped, but that's it. I hip scored her because we wanted to leave the option open for breeding her.

meoklmrk91 · 29-04-2012 8:13pm

lyingeyes wrote: »

I have a female saint who will be six in June. She is in good health, she has never been to the vet. She isnt as supple jointed as she was when she was a pup but is still well able to go. My advise for looking after them, is as follows.
Dont bother with vets, my dog has never been vaccinated or neutered, i think that happy dogs are healthy dogs and as long as you take really good care of them they will be unlikely to be ill. Vets will always find somthing wrong. She is wormed and gets flea drops regularly and during the summer is washed about once a week or every two weeks depending on how dirty she is. We use warm water and dog shampoo or any shampoo really. We never clipped her, we just snip the tangles on her bum and behind her ears. She hasnt been neutered, i think neutering them makes them age prematurely. They are notoriously hard to breed so she still roams free even in heat and it has never been a problem.
I think health is dependent on how happy the dog is. A dog will get ill and die young if you keep them in a cage or tied up, my dog has never been tied up or caged, ever. She is constantly with us, if she is not off in the car somewhere then she is usually waiting in the car to go, but whatever is going on she constantly has company. She is left at home on warm days (13degrees or more). She is always in and out of the house or asleep in someones bed. (put shower curtain on bedspread if your dog has similar bad habits). We bring her for short walks regularly, mabe 1km at a time more because she looks idle and bored than for exercise.
She is fed, 1/2 of a kg of mince a day, usually with dog nuts (cheap ones) or spagetti and mabe some carrots. She is a fussy eater, some days she eats nothing and some days she eats everything. You can get cheap mince in dunnes/ tesco/ aldi/ lidl for 3eur/kg. She has been fed on this since a pup 8weeks old, but sometimes dad puts a drop of cod liver oil or veg oil in her food. She is 75kg.
She has never been trained as such, she kind of learned on the job, like i said she comes everywhere with us, we usually let her off the lead and she potters about and does her own thing. This may sound really irresponsible, but she has done this since a pup so we have never had any issues with it. She is very protective at home and would stop strangers from coming in, but when in strange places she is very gentle and quite clingy. Adults and children are drawn to her and she is constantly being rubbed and played with and she never had a bad reaction to anyone.
She sleeps on a single bed in a well ventilated shed at night. it is really important their bed is up off the ground and that they are in cool places at night as they tend to overheat, but having said that on the rare occasion she does sleep in the house. (very rare, she doesnt like it and i think it is really bad for her).
We never had any dogs before her and im sure others wont agree with the way we keep her.Saints are alot of work, they are very hairy, shed alot, take a long time to mature, can be hyperactive, will chew everything as pups, cost alot to feed, need alot of space and alot of company. If i had realised all this before i got her, i probably would have thought twice, but having said that my whole family adore her, everyone in the house thinks more of the dog than they do anyone else.

Wow you have a very bad a view of the Veterinary Industry. I am training to be a Veterinary Nurse, and I can tell you from the time I have spent in practice the money grabbing idea that you have is for the most part not the case.

Two weeks ago my cat started limping, I thought it was nothing serious, put her on crate rest for a few days. After I saw no improvement I took her to the vet, it turned out she had a luxiating patella (knee cap slipping in and out of place) and due to the difficulty she was having the vet recommended surgery which was €450, this surgery would have be done by a specialist so the cat was put on painkillers until the surgery could be done.

Fast forward to this Friday when surgery was scheduled for, I met my own vet and dropped the cat off. About a half an hour later I got a call. The orthopaedic surgeon had examined her and found that she had not 1 but 2 luxiating patella's but since she had done so well on the painkillers surgery could be put on hold for atleast a year when she would have be examined again.

Now if the vet just wanted money then they would have done the op anyway and told me that I needed to do a 2nd op a few months down the line. But no they didn't and they also charged me nothing even though the cat had a consult with an orthopaedic surgeon.

Finally I know a few people who like you think vaccines are a waste of money, however if you saw a dog with parvo or lepto then you would change your mind faster than you could whip out your money to pay for the vaccine. I have only ever seen one case of Lepto and a few of Parvo, the look in each of those dogs eyes will stay with me forever, you could see the pain and the suffering.

lyingeyes · 29-04-2012 8:31pm

Hip scoring is a perfect example. Hip scoring is done by taking x-rays of the animals hips and by manual extension and flexing of the limbs. X-ray radiation is cancerous and is especially damaging to the reproductive system and i believe it is cruel to flex an animals joints until they show resistance or discomfort. There is nothing wrong with my dogs hips and gait, she is in no discomfort, so it would be counter productive to put her through this.

Dog disease and population control is really important, so i dont think vaccinations or spaying are a waste of money or time. I just dont believe my dog is at a high enough risk to justify putting synthetic medications into her. Im sorry to hear about your cat, i hope she will be ok and good luck with the vet nursing.

Cherry Blossom · 30-04-2012 12:31am

Lyingeyes if you post in this thread again you will be given a month off from the forum, stop taking this thread off-topic. From this point on any responses from anyone else to these posts will be infracted and the thread will be locked. It's completely ridiculous that the OP can't ask their questions without all this rubbish.

andreac · 30-04-2012 9:07am

Magenta wrote: »

I'm confused. She's never been to a vet but she's been hipscored?

Also, her hip score at 13 months is not relevant, she is 6 now. Hip dysplasia progresses over time, hence why decent breeders make sure their dogs have CURRENT certs for their dogs before breeding, not ones from 5 years ago.

Magentas i just want to correct you on this and it is relative to the thread

Hip scoring can only ever be done once on your dog, so saying them being up to date is incorrect.

Hip scoring can only ever be submitted to the BVA in the UK once so its crucial to make sure the x-rays are taken correctly and by a vet who really knows what they are doing because if bad x-rays are taken it could have an affect on the grading the dog is given.

For the OP, your dog can be hip scored anytime from 12 months onwards so just keep that in mind when you are going to get your dog done.
Both hips and elbows are done in Saints as elbows can be an issue as well.

deejer · 05-05-2012 9:54pm

A few more photos of the 19kg Charlie (we at the vet yesterday for the last of his shots and all looking good

)

https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/attachments/382332/203716.jpg

https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/attachments/382332/203717.jpg

https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/attachments/382332/203718.jpg

https://us.v-cdn.net/6034073/uploads/attachments/382332/203719.jpg

Taltos · 06-05-2012 6:51pm

Charlie is going to be massive - just adorable

carleigh · 06-05-2012 8:09pm

Charlie is gorgeous. Wishing ye a long happy life together

deejer · 06-09-2012 9:25pm

Hi All,

Been a while since I have posted here! Charlie has gotten alot bigger than the photos i have posted here - better add a few updates!

Anyway, his size is the reason I am posting here. I am looking at getting a new collar as the extra large one we got is getting too small for him. Can someone recommend a good place to get an extra extra large one

deejer · 12-09-2012 9:04pm

Hi guys,

Still looking if anyone can help!

St Bernard

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