dog aggressive dog

liquoriceall wrote: »

Anyways just wondering about the trainer? Where did you get the recommendation from? Its unusual to hear of the dominance theory these days as that theory has been discredited.

Good to hear a voice of reason in this thread.:o
OP, it's an unfortunate thing that anyone can call themselves a behaviourist in Ireland. This is heading for change in the UK, and will hopefully follow on in Ireland, because there are too many people doing a lot of harm to dogs, their owners, their families, and the bond between them in the name of "behaviour". In addition, their results are patchy at best, and in some cases, downright harmful and dangerous.
Behaviour is a science, just as much as medicine or veterinary is, and to become a real, proper behaviourist, you need to do a lot of training, study in a recognised 3rd level institution, ongoing professional development etc, just like doctors and vets do.
Which leads me to the point of my post. Anyone who has done the necesary study, and has also gained the necessary experience to call themselves a "behaviourist" under the requirements which are on their way, will tell you that this business of dominance, "me man you dog", insisting that one family member is master (I don't know where that leaves the other family members in a pet dog context), insisting you eat before the dog etc, has been utterly disproven.
Indeed, the man who first postulated Dominance Theory in wolves (David Mech) has long since retracted his research which led him to this conclusion: it's just a pity that so many trainers and "behaviourists" still cling to it. But that's for another thread.
And your case is proof of this: you're following a protocol which is based on an untrue philosophy, and so is almost doomed from the outset. It can sometimes appear to work, but it's not for the reasons one of these untrained behaviourists who advocate Dominance Theory will tell you. But that too is for another thread.
Had you been luckier and been referred to a properly trained behaviourist (and there are some in Ireland!), you would (a) have learned how dogs actually learn, (b) how they actually perceive other dogs and humans, (c) the real reasons your dog is not happy around other dogs, (d) how to use all this knowledge to change your dog's emotional reaction to other dogs for the better.
And by now, after a month (and probably less money), you should be seeing significant improvements in your dog's reaction to other dogs.
Also, I'd suggest not engaging the services of a "trainer" as advocated already. This is a behavioural case, and beyond the remit of a trainer (unless they've got the necessary credentials). It's good practice for an owner to do some research on the people they're paying to work with their dog before engaging that person's services: are they suitably qualified and experienced? Do they belong to a reputable professional organisation whose code of conduct/practice is one you feel supportive of? Does the trainer/behaviourist have insurance in case things go wrong (a minimum of public liability cover, and preferably with professional indemnity in the case of a behaviourist)?
You're in Waterford... maybe give Emmaline Duffy-Fallon of www.citizencanineireland.com a call, as although she's based in south Wicklow she may consider travelling to Waterford. Emmaline has the credentials and I've heard great reports about her work with aggressive dogs.

The very best of luck, you are to be absolutely commended for trying to do the right thing. You've goe to socialisation classes and you sought help when trouble loomed, but unfortunately, you've been poorly served by a so-far unregulated industry.:(

He'd seen my guy getting worse in his classes but put it down to him having no manners and tried to stop him by jabbing him in the neck everytime he growled and saying no

Oh lordy:eek:
It's little wonder your problem has got worse. If a dog is feeling a bit worried about being near another dog (and the vast majority of inter-dog aggression is fear-based), reacts to it, then gets ajab in the neck and shouted at, it only serves to confirm to the dog that other dogs are really bad news.
So, what would any self-respecting dog do? Try to get rid of any and all dogs before horrible things happen.
Sometimes, a trainer will punish a dog so hard (and different dogs have different thresholds... some are really sensitive souls) that the aggressive bahviour is inhibited through fear. In other owrds, the dog becomes afraid to react to the other dog.
But this does not address the underlying emotion of fear, and indeed, I'm sure you can imagine, actually increases the level of fear. So, whilst the dog may not react to other dogs in some situations, the fear has to come out somewhere. Now we're in the realms of really explosive emotional reactions.
This is why getting straight to the nub of the problem, and working with the dog's emotions, gently and patiently, you get better results because you're directly on teaching the dog to self-control, and to change the way he feels other dogs from a fearful response to a happier, more confident response.

(he said this is how his mother would have corrected him as a pup) but it made no difference if anything it made him worse because he'd then just nip without making a sound

Mothers do chastise their pups from time to time, but this business of thinking we understand where and when a mother will correct her pups is a recipe for disaster. As your example shows! Aggression begets aggression, and now your dog no longer gives the normal warnings before becoming aggressive. It is shameful the outdated and disproven stuff you've been told, but luckily good help is at hand and all is not lost! Indeed, a good behavioural session will help you to understand your dog in a way you never thought you could, and really brings you to better place with your dog from this perspective alone.
Good on you, owners who stick by their dogs like you clearly want to need a big round of applause!:)

I suppose my mistake was believing that if this guy was recommended by the vet he must know what he was doing

Unfortunately, this is all too common. Vets get very, very minimal behavioural training in college, and as such are just as misinformed and unaware of the credentials required by behaviourists as many owners are. But again, I can only hope that when the requirements are introduced to the UK, effectively protecting the title of "behaviourist" so that only those entitled to use it can use it, they'll find their way to Ireland too:)

Good luck!