CI AGM 1 November 2014

Beasty · 12-10-2014 11:04am

Even at 20 km and the fastest race at say 42km/h and the slowest at 37km/h over 4 laps you will have problems

wav1 · 12-10-2014 11:12am

Good man Beasty...I knew someone would be able to work out the maths...
So in an 80k race with 5kph difference between fast and slow we could have a bunch of 350 crossing the line at exactly the same time on a 20k circuit and no one would know what race they are in...Lovely

Beasty · 12-10-2014 12:17pm

Actuallly my maths was sligfhtly awry in terms of the fact the fastest race would gain just over half a lap over 2 hours, but when you take into account the gaps between the fastest race setting off first and the slowest last you get to pretty much the same conclusion. Add to that the possibility of breaks who can then end up with a bit of a pull as they catch up with dropped riders from the slower races and it would be as potential recipe for disaster

buffalo · 12-10-2014 12:39pm

Beasty wrote: »

I also note with interest the Cycling Ulster proposal that next of kin details should be included when applying for a licence - I definitely think this should be the case, and may well be the "reason" Cycling Ulster decided to put this forward:pac:

I wrote to CI in mid-2013 to suggest this should be included on a licence, never even got an acknowledgement.

Donegaler · 12-10-2014 12:42pm

Is it not the turn of Connaght to host the Agm?

wav1 · 12-10-2014 12:42pm

buffalo wrote: »

I wrote to CI in mid-2014 to suggest this should be included on a licence, never even got an acknowledgement.

Mid 14?Wouldn't have got to that email yet.

wav1 · 12-10-2014 12:45pm

Donegaler wrote: »

Is it not the turn of Connaght to host the Agm?

If the 4 province cycle is still in place you're correct.But if you remember the last time [2010] it was in Connaght it was also in Athlone,albeit on the western side of the Shannon.

buffalo · 12-10-2014 12:48pm

wav1 wrote: »

Mid 14?Wouldn't have got to that email yet.

haha! I meant 2013. Would they have gotten to those? :P

Donegaler · 12-10-2014 12:57pm

wav1 wrote: »

If the 4 province cycle is still in place you're correct.But if you remember the last time [2010] it was in Connaght it was also in Athlone,albeit on the western side of the Shannon.

TO HELL OR TO CONNAGHT.
Maybe Co.Westmeath has been annexed by Connaght.
Queens Maeve has form for doing that type of thing.
Would love see CI consider Westport,Castlebar or Galway as being worthy of hosting an Agm.

slow · 13-10-2014 2:41pm

The wording of most of the motions is a bit suspect, to be honest. I'm presuming the over 50 thing refers to the fact that over 50s have the option not to be upgraded? If that's the intention of this motion, the actual technical regulation in question should be named with the alternative wording proposed.

The Chairman will have no choice, but to rule some of these motions out of order, like the classic motion which was submitted to the Clonmel CI AGM written in 'text messagese'.

morana · 13-10-2014 2:51pm

slow wrote: »

The wording of most of the motions is a bit suspect, to be honest. I'm presuming the over 50 thing refers to the fact that over 50s have the option not to be upgraded? If that's the intention of this motion, the actual technical regulation in question should be named with the alternative wording proposed.

The Chairman will have no choice, but to rule some of these motions out of order, like the classic motion which was submitted to the Clonmel CI AGM written in 'text messagese'.

they usually give the proposer an opportunity to amend the wording on the day.

@Donegaler. I think you are right it would be great to have the agm in the likes of westport or galway or even donegal town. I still like the idea of a bus being hired to bring people if people wouldnt travel because of mileage...and the craic would be great. Maybe if you get in you could work on this!

slow · 13-10-2014 3:14pm

If you remember back to the Sneem AGM, there was a low turnout. You'd get a few diehards who'd love an adventure to the ends of the country. But for the rest of those with families, etc., if it ain't accessible, the numbers won't turn up.

Beasty · 13-10-2014 3:38pm

I am hoping following last year's meetings (and the build-ups thereto!) a few more members/club delegates are actually engaged in the CI workings and will make the effort to head to Athlone on 1 November

wav1 · 13-10-2014 4:00pm

morana wrote: »

they usually give the proposer an opportunity to amend the wording on the day.

@Donegaler. I think you are right it would be great to have the agm in the likes of westport or galway or even donegal town. I still like the idea of a bus being hired to bring people if people wouldnt travel because of mileage...and the craic would be great. Maybe if you get in you could work on this!

They were great when they were a 2 day affair.Fight all day Saturday,have a session Saturday night and fight again on Sunday.Great craic altogether.

Donegaler · 13-10-2014 5:47pm

slow wrote: »

If you remember back to the Sneem AGM, there was a low turnout. You'd get a few diehards who'd love an adventure to the ends of the country. But for the rest of those with families, etc., if it ain't accessible, the numbers won't turn up.

I remember Sneem.Not a bad turnout there but as usual there was an adjournment to try to get a quorum. It even happened at tha Dublin Agms.
Best turnout ever was in Monaghan in 2013.Almost 100 delegates.no problem with quorums nor was there any in Cavan in 2009 even though there was only a handful of CI members in that County at that time.
Donegal will host the CI Agm in 2017 as far as I know.(You heard it first here).Some families will be well reared by then.!!
Provincial Executives should pick the venue for CI.

wav1 · 13-10-2014 6:18pm

I wonder how the motion proposing to levy racing licences by e2 each,to help try and ensure/maintain that the junior tour goes ahead,will go down with delegates.Interesting one.I do know that the organisers have been struggling for yrs financially with no title sponsor,but im sure its going to meet a mixpeed response.It will depend totally on themix of delegates gathered IMO.

Inquitus · 13-10-2014 6:21pm

wav1 wrote: »

I wonder how the motion proposing to levy racing licences by e2 each,to help try and ensure/maintain that the junior tour goes ahead,will go down with delegates.Interesting one.I do know that the organisers have been struggling for yrs financially with no title sponsor,but im sure its going to meet a mixpeed response.It will depend totally on themix of delegates gathered IMO.

I don't see how you can mix motions to reduce spending on races with motions to levy racers for the Junior tour, as I pointed out above roughly half the license fee money comes from racers even though in the minority, so a reduction in race spending coupled with an increase is race license fees seems a tad harsh!

That said I'd happily pay 2 for the junior tour.

wav1 · 13-10-2014 6:29pm

Inquitus wrote: »

I don't see how you can mix motions to reduce spending on races with motions to levy racers for the Junior tour, as I pointed out above roughly half the license fee money comes from racers even though in the minority, so a reduction in race spending coupled with an increase is race license fees seems a tad harsh!

That said I'd happily pay 2 for the junior tour.

There is no motion to reduce spending on races,That was something that was being mooted by CI last week and wouldn't require to go to AGM as theres no regulation in the rules in this regard.This motion re junior tour levy is the only motion in that regard.

Beasty · 13-10-2014 7:25pm

Is the junior tour promoted by a club, or is this something CI itself puts on. perhaps via the youth commission? How much would the €2 levy raise?

I presume there will be trophies awarded. Is there any prize money for this event?

wav1 · 13-10-2014 7:34pm

Beasty wrote: »

Is the junior tour promoted by a club, or is this something CI itself puts on. perhaps via the youth commission? How much would the €2 levy raise?

I presume there will be trophies awarded. Is there any prize money for this event?

JT is promoted by a club as is indeed the ras and all other events,but I suppose is seen as one of our National events.Just like the ras it depends on a host of volunteers to put the show on the road as no one club could possibly come up with the bodies required.There is a prize fund[relatively modest] and yes there are trophies for various things along the way.
Don't have exact figures of how much it would raise,but I think theres approx 4k adult racing and limited competition licences,so approx 4000 x e2
About 8k if that's the situation.Figures I heard mentioned earlier this year suggested it costs 30k to put on.Others on here may be able to give a more definitive answer.Youth commission never had any input as their remit finishes at U16 level.

Beasty · 13-10-2014 7:44pm

I know the IVCA hav been sponsoring in recent years and there are a few more sponsors listed on the website. However €30k is a hell of a lot and if it's actually then down to a single club I can see some reluctance to commit, particularly if we are talking of a potential €8k shortfall. However I do have a suspicion the Ras na mBan gets along on quite a lot less and am wondering where all that cash goes (I'm not suggesting these events should be in any way "cheap", but I would question whether we should be incentivising riders at youth level with any cash - I take on board though your comments that it's a relatively modest amount overall)

CI are clearly shown as supporting it as well as the Ras and Ras na mBan so I presume some membership cash already heads in to support these events.

cornet · 13-10-2014 7:50pm

Beasty wrote: »

I know the IVCA hav been sponsoring in recent years and there are a few more sponsors listed on the website. However €30k is a hell of a lot and if it's actually then down to a single club I can see some reluctance to commit, particularly if we are talking of a potential €8k shortfall.

The NatChamps were supposed to have cost in excess of €20k this summer - little or no assistance from CI.

wav1 · 13-10-2014 7:52pm

Beasty wrote: »

I know the IVCA hav been sponsoring in recent years and there are a few more sponsors listed on the website. However €30k is a hell of a lot and if it's actually then down to a single club I can see some reluctance to commit, particularly if we are talking of a potential €8k shortfall. However I do have a suspicion the Ras na mBan gets along on quite a lot less and am wondering where all that cash goes (I'm not suggesting these events should be in any way "cheap", but I would question whether we should be incentivising riders at youth level with any cash - I take on board though your comments that it's a relatively modest amount overall)

CI are clearly shown as supporting it as well as the Ras and Ras na mBan so I presume some membership cash already heads in to support these events.

Yes the JT gets grand aid along with other events through the stage race grant system,as already discussed in another ongoing thread on this forum.I think the difference here is that the ras and ras na mban have both got a title sponsor where as the JT relies on a combination of smaller but very welcome sponsors.The perception for the past few yrs is that basically the organisers just don't have the budget to run the event in the way they would wish,and I think that this is the logic behind this motion,which BTW is from a club other than the organising club.

Lusk_Doyle · 13-10-2014 8:00pm

Hold on a sec, the national organisation is not responsible for running the ras? It's down to a club? The same club each year?

wav1 · 13-10-2014 8:08pm

Lusk_Doyle wrote: »

Hold on a sec, the national organisation is not responsible for running the ras? It's down to a club? The same club each year?

Yep you've got it...Cuman Ras Tailteann are the promoters and have about 8 members.OK there are dozens of helpers[volunteers]who assist,but yes its down to a very small crew of people who put it all together.Huge huge commitment through the yrs luskdoyle...You see the perception is that CI run things but they don't actually promote a single event themselves..Totally reliant on clubs to fill their calendar..

Inquitus · 13-10-2014 8:09pm

wav1 wrote: »

Yep you've got it...Cuman Ras Tailteann are the promoters and have about 8 members.OK there are dozens of helpers[volunteers]who assist,but yes its down to a very small crew of people who put it all together.Huge huge commitment through the yrs luskdoyle...You see the perception is that CI run things but they don't actually promote a single event themselves..Totally reliant on clubs to fill their calendar..

Is this the case in other countries? or a uniquely Irish thing?

wav1 · 13-10-2014 8:13pm

cornet wrote: »

The NatChamps were supposed to have cost in excess of €20k this summer - little or no assistance from CI.

They probably did cost that kind of money and a mighty show they were...Major difference is that promoters of Nat Champs probably only have to do once every 15/20 yrs or whatever.They don't have to keep going back to the well yr after yr...Hence the ongoing problem AFAIK.

ragazzo · 13-10-2014 8:17pm

Inquitus wrote: »

Is this the case in other countries? or a uniquely Irish thing?

In other countries most big races would be run by sport promotion companies with sponsorship and paid officials. The Ràs is pretty unique.

Lusk_Doyle · 13-10-2014 8:17pm

This just gets better. They do sfa for the single biggest international race we have. They do sfa for our national road races. They do sfa to protect club and open road racing. Am I mistaken here or should we be very disappointed and disillusioned with ci?

RobFowl · 13-10-2014 8:19pm

Inquitus wrote: »

Is this the case in other countries? or a uniquely Irish thing?

It's the same in most countries.

CI AGM 1 November 2014

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