Standing on a train from Athy to Dublin

Emme · 19-11-2014 6:47pm #1

Was anyone listening to yesterday's Liveline? They were primarily discussing water charges but one woman mentioned that her daughter has to stand for an hour on a train from Athy to Dublin, put in a full day's work and travel home again. The train ticket is approximately €3,000 a year. From my observation of people getting on at Athy this woman's daughter is definitely not standing on the train on her own. Indeed she might find it hard to get a standing place on the train. People often faint on the train because it is so crowded.

I know of rail commuters from Portlaoise who have to stand for an hour all the way to Heuston.

How long do other people have to stand on public transport for their daily commute? Does anyone have to stand for more than an hour every day? If so how long?

end of the road · 19-11-2014 9:57pm

Emme wrote: »

Was anyone listening to yesterday's Liveline? They were primarily discussing water charges but one woman mentioned that her daughter has to stand for an hour on a train from Athy to Dublin, put in a full day's work and travel home again. The train ticket is approximately €3,000 a year. From my observation of people getting on at Athy this woman's daughter is definitely not standing on the train on her own. Indeed she might find it hard to get a standing place on the train. People often faint on the train because it is so crowded.

I know of rail commuters from Portlaoise who have to stand for an hour all the way to Heuston.

How long do other people have to stand on public transport for their daily commute? Does anyone have to stand for more than an hour every day? If so how long?

i have genuine sympathy for all concerned as i know this is an ongoing issue on peak services on both these and the sligo/longford routes.

January · 19-11-2014 10:34pm

God forbid anyone that has to spend all day on their feet...

patrickc · 19-11-2014 11:07pm

January wrote: »

God forbid anyone that has to spend all day on their feet...

that's a very helpful post......:rolleyes:

the person might have a very tough job and its nice to relax before/after work standing doesn't allow this. anyway regardless of the job for 3K a year standing IMO is unacceptable up and back everyday.

Sean9015 · 19-11-2014 11:17pm

Emme wrote: »

I know of rail commuters from Portlaoise who have to stand for an hour all the way to Heuston.

I don't know about Athy, but no commuter has to stand the whole from Portlaoise to Heuston or return under normal circumstances - even in the Celtic tiger years with the much lower service level than is in place today. The disrupted service due to the fatality on the line a few weeks back MAY have been an exception.

Cookie_Monster · 20-11-2014 12:31am

So commuting from Portlaoise and spending over 3k per year is seen as reasonable in the first place, but having to stand while doing it isn't

Mrs OBumble · 20-11-2014 3:12pm

It's a new public health measure to combat the obesity epidemic.

(You burn more calories standing than sitting.)

Emme · 20-11-2014 7:53pm

Sean9015 wrote: »

I don't know about Athy, but no commuter has to stand the whole from Portlaoise to Heuston or return under normal circumstances - even in the Celtic tiger years with the much lower service level than is in place today. The disrupted service due to the fatality on the line a few weeks back MAY have been an exception.

It is common for commuters to stand from Athy to Heuston. During the Celtic Tiger years people often had to wait for the next train (a wait of more than an hour) because trains were so crowded on the Waterford line.

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

So commuting from Portlaoise and spending over 3k per year is seen as reasonable in the first place, but having to stand while doing it isn't

It is not acceptable to stand for long commutes and the price of an annual ticket (now more than €3K pa from Athy) adds insult to injury. Standing each way on commutes of an hour effectively adds 2 hours to a person's working day.

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

It's a new public health measure to combat the obesity epidemic.

(You burn more calories standing than sitting.)

If Iarnrod Eireann want to combat the obesity epidemic they can start by getting rid of the stodge outlets at train stations. Heuston Station has 5 of these and I'm not including the restaurant, Butlers kiosk or the juice kiosk. If train passengers are obese it is partly due to them eating fast food on the train.

They should also get rid of the Railgourmet trolley on overcrowded trains. As well as selling stodge it blocks up carriages on overcrowded trains, impedes passengers exit from the train and makes finding seats on the train more difficult.

It is not safe to sell hot drinks on overcrowded trains and pungent food makes overcrowded trains even more unpleasant when passengers can't open a window.

One outlet at Heuston station which shall remain nameless sells food that smells like it has been eaten before. If you smelt that muck on a train you would be forgiven for thinking that someone has lost their dinner.

Standing on overcrowded trains every day for long commutes is detrimental to people's health and has a knock on effect on their productivity at work. People who commute long distances to work by train pay handsomely to do so. Most of them don't choose to do long commutes, the high price of accommodation in the city and the lack of rural employment forces them to do so. The current service is not good enough. I can only speak for the Waterford line which is abysmal and not fit for purpose, but a colleague has to stand from Portlaoise to Heuston from time to time.

Judgement Day · 20-11-2014 9:17pm

OP - you're probably not used to dealing with the cynicism of the C+T Forum. Most of us are seasoned CIE travellers and know that there's little point in complaining to CIE/IE as 'everybody's business is nobody's business'. Perhaps the level of service from Athy will improve when the line is closed south of Kilkenny. Good luck in your efforts.

Cookie_Monster · 20-11-2014 10:20pm

Emme wrote: »

It is not acceptable to stand for long commutes and the price of an annual ticket (now more than €3K pa from Athy) adds insult to injury.

Says who, you?
so take the bus or drive or move closer or find another job or complain to IE or get an earlier / later train instead if it's such an issue.
That person's daughter, whoever she is, decided to make that ridiculous commute part of her daily life, at the end of the day it's no one's fault but her own.

Emme wrote: »

Standing each way on commutes of an hour effectively adds 2 hours to a person's working day.

no; commuting adds the 2 hours, regardless of how you are doing it.

EganTheMan · 20-11-2014 10:26pm

I cannot agree with the previous post - how could you possibly say that it's her fault? Not everyone has the choice, as you put it . . .

We should be supporting people who are honest enough to get up and do a day's work as opposed to staying in bed and claiming Social . . .

We all sit, at times, in work and look out and dream about "running away and joining the circus" but we have to live in reality . . .

Terrible reflection on our infrastructure . . . I wonder will Paul Murphy & Co. speak up for her or does the fact that she work make her of no interest to his cohort?

foggy_lad · 20-11-2014 10:34pm

The situation on the Waterford-Dublin route should improve when the new Dublin Coach express bus service starts, I have heard it will be Dublin City Centre-Waterford stopping only in Kilkenny and at the red cow luas stop(for connections to the airport). A licence has been issued for an inter urban express service Waterford-Dublin.

Roxirose · 20-11-2014 10:40pm

On occasion I have gotten the Waterford train from heuston as far as Kildare. Yes, it seems to be constantly overcrowded. I saw a pregnant lady left standing as far as Kildare today.
However I can say nobody has to stand all the way from portlaoise to heuston or vice versa, in my experience.

Emme · 21-11-2014 12:53am

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Says who, you?
so take the bus or drive or move closer or find another job or complain to IE or get an earlier / later train instead if it's such an issue.

I already said that most people in the commuter belt cannot afford to move closer and there are very few jobs in rural Ireland.

People have complained to IE and got nowhere.

The earlier and later trains are equally crowded.

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

That person's daughter, whoever she is, decided to make that ridiculous commute part of her daily life, at the end of the day it's no one's fault but her own.

If that person's daughter wanted a home for her family they might not have been able to afford anything closer to Dublin than Athy. She has chosen to work to put food on the table for her family. This may be her fault as you say but at least she's getting off her butt and doing something to support her family.

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

no commuting adds the 2 hours, regardless of how you are doing it.

Person A and Person B do the same job in the same company working an 8 hour day (they have a nice boss who doesn't ask them to do overtime). Person A lives in Dublin and walk or cycle 20 minutes to work. Person B commutes by train to work and their commute takes 1 hour and 20 minutes.

Person A's working day is 8 hours and 40 minutes including commuting time. Person B's working day is 10 hours and 40 minutes including commuting time. 2 hours more than Person A. If Person B cannot get a seat on the train they cannot read or sleep on the journey to or from work and will be more tired at the end of the day.

foggy_lad wrote: »

The situation on the Waterford-Dublin route should improve when the new Dublin Coach express bus service starts, I have heard it will be Dublin-Waterford stopping only in Kilkenny and at the red cow luas stop(for connections to the airport). A licence has been issued for an inter urban express service Waterford-Dublin.

Foggy, they will probably cut carriages off the Waterford train when the Dublin Coach express bus service starts and people will still be packed in like sardines.

Roxirose wrote: »

On occasion I have gotten the Waterford train from heuston as far as Kildare. Yes, it seems to be constantly overcrowded. I saw a pregnant lady left standing as far as Kildare today.

Sadly this is not unusual. When the Waterford train platform is announced at Heuston there is always a stampede to get a seat. No matter what time people travel the trains are always overcrowded.

EganTheMan · 21-11-2014 4:54am

Here here

or as they say on Boards

+1

:-)

Sean9015 · 21-11-2014 9:11am

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

So commuting from Portlaoise and spending over 3k per year is seen as reasonable in the first place, but having to stand while doing it isn't

EURO3k for year from Portlaoise? Yes, I think that's OK. Bedford - London (same distance) is STG4,300 for a line with much greater demand (and crowding issues). However, my comment was aimed at the standing from Portlaoise issue - under normal circumstances it simply does not happen.

zl1whqvjs75cdy · 21-11-2014 9:18am

An hour commute really isn't that much to all those saying she shouldn't have moved to athy. I think the Irish have this mentality that we have to live within 30 minutes or less of work or else you are ruining your life. Mad attitude for such a small country.

Sean9015 · 21-11-2014 9:21am

Emme wrote: »

Person A and Person B do the same job in the same company working an 8 hour day (they have a nice boss who doesn't ask them to do overtime). Person A lives in Dublin and walk or cycle 20 minutes to work. Person B commutes by train to work and their commute takes 1 hour and 20 minutes.

Person A's working day is 8 hours and 40 minutes including commuting time. Person B's working day is 10 hours and 40 minutes including commuting time. 2 hours more than Person A. If Person B cannot get a seat on the train they cannot read or sleep on the journey to or from work and will be more tired at the end of the day.

But the point was being made that person B in your example will be more tired than person A whether they are standing or sitting. I used to commute from Portlaoise daily - at first it was hard, but you get used to it after a while.

If you want a guaranteed seat, here is the other option:

http://www.jjkavanagh.ie/images/events/Clonmel-Dublin%20Timetable2012.pdf

Of course, its slower, so you spend even longer commuting, but that's the trade off.

Into The Blue · 21-11-2014 9:28am

Not sure if January is interested in debating this or just popped in yesterday for the one smart comment, but It isn't just standing, it's constant shifting to keep your balance, trying to hang on with one hand while holding your gear..

Far more draining than just standing on the path for an hour.

foggy_lad · 21-11-2014 4:45pm

donkeyoaty0099 wrote: »

An hour commute really isn't that much to all those saying she shouldn't have moved to athy. I think the Irish have this mentality that we have to live within 30 minutes or less of work or else you are ruining your life. Mad attitude for such a small country.

It is not a long commute if you live in london or some large city of several million people but for Dublin it is a long train journey, hopefully more improvements to track and signalling will speed this up over the next few years.

Hilly Bill · 23-11-2014 1:12pm

Sean9015 wrote: »

EURO3k for year from Portlaoise? Yes, I think that's OK. Bedford - London (same distance) is STG4,300 for a line with much greater demand (and crowding issues). However, my comment was aimed at the standing from Portlaoise issue - under normal circumstances it simply does not happen.

€8 a day is alright.

Hilly Bill · 23-11-2014 1:14pm

foggy_lad wrote: »

It is not a long commute if you live in london or some large city of several million people but for Dublin it is a long train journey, hopefully more improvements to track and signalling will speed this up over the next few years.

A 1 hour commute is the same regardless of what city its in .

Aard · 23-11-2014 1:37pm

Averge commute times in Dublin are 28 minutes according to the CSO. Commutes over an hour are unusual.

Emme · 23-11-2014 3:06pm

Aard wrote: »

Averge commute times in Dublin are 28 minutes according to the CSO. Commutes over an hour are unusual.

If the average commute time is 28 minutes there is something wrong with the transport system when people who commute for an hour or more have to stand for the entire journey.

Aard · 23-11-2014 4:26pm

I'm not sure that that statement is logical. I don't think it's possible to draw a correlation or relationship between commute times and propensity for having to stand.

Cookie_Monster · 26-11-2014 3:26am

Aard wrote: »

I'm not sure that that statement is logical. I don't think it's possible to draw a correlation or relationship between commute times and propensity for having to stand.

the more I stand the shorter my commute time

elastico · 26-11-2014 1:32pm

donkeyoaty0099 wrote: »

An hour commute really isn't that much to all those saying she shouldn't have moved to athy. I think the Irish have this mentality that we have to live within 30 minutes or less of work or else you are ruining your life. Mad attitude for such a small country.

I think the small country bit is the point though. With proper planning 50 years ago all the industrial estates, call centres etc. would have been built outside the M50 with another ring motorway 10 miles outside that again, so places like Newbridge and Kildare would be short commutes to the main centres of employment, reducing the pressure on everything.

Aard · 26-11-2014 6:52pm

^ I wouldn't call that "proper planning" tbh

Anyway, we had the opportunity with the Buchanan report in the 60s... Blame "balanced regional development"!

_Kaiser_ · 26-11-2014 7:39pm

elastico wrote: »

I think the small country bit is the point though. With proper planning 50 years ago all the industrial estates, call centres etc. would have been built outside the M50 with another ring motorway 10 miles outside that again, so places like Newbridge and Kildare would be short commutes to the main centres of employment, reducing the pressure on everything.

No, what's needed is for people to get over the obsession with owning a semi-D regardless of where it is or how impractical it may be, coupled with a reform of the rental sector and building up in Dublin not out.

Proper European-sized, family friendly apartments are the answer here not some new wave of "decentralisation" or adding more trains or buses to facilitate commuting that would/should ultimately be unnecessary - especially as many of the workers in these industrial estates and call centres are young, mobile non-nationals who will likely move on again in a (relatively) short timeframe - assuming their employer doesn't beat them to it!

road_high · 27-11-2014 12:22am

foggy_lad wrote: »

The situation on the Waterford-Dublin route should improve when the new Dublin Coach express bus service starts, I have heard it will be Dublin City Centre-Waterford stopping only in Kilkenny and at the red cow luas stop(for connections to the airport). A licence has been issued for an inter urban express service Waterford-Dublin.

Hey there. Any idea when this may start? Sorely needed on the M9 and should do very well indeed with good journey times. Assume Carlow would be on the planned stops as well to boost loading.

lazeedaisy · 27-11-2014 12:34am

I did that commute for years, never saw anyone standing going to Dublin from Athy, it was a very early Train, and I know another train was put on the route since I stopped, as for it being an hour commute, it was half that again on a god day,

Friday afternoons the trains were always packed but you got a seat if you got there on time.

Standing on a train from Athy to Dublin

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