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Lack of sympathy over killing of Roma girl.

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    #182
    themandan6611
    Registered Users Posts: 1,627 ✭✭✭themandan6611


    I have a lot of interest, both in the recent arrest of a Mr W and his relations


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    #183
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,215 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    amdublin wrote: »
    Millicent wrote: »
    I never heard that about the father. Oh God, that's awful. Or about the inability to report her missing. :( Can you remember where you heard/read that?

    Think it was Paul Williams on the Saturday night show. Gards checked CCTV to see if they could see her. No sign, but they saw the father numerous times :(

    He went to a garda station but could not speak English. He showed her ID card but the gards thought he was enquiring had she been arrested for begging.
    After a few days someone from his community told him to go to the four courts to find a translator.

    She managed to ring her brother at one stage from the house she was being held in. She looked out a window and could see the street name but because she could not read or write she couldn't describe where she was.
    Fuk... me... :(


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    #184
    Ellie2008
    Registered Users Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭Ellie2008


    Jezek wrote: »
    Don't feed the troll guys. Normal humans feel compassion and empathy. Socio/Psychopaths may not, but they know to fake it. Trolls on the other hand, have no emotions except a need to stir up some sh1t.

    Well I know this is After Hours and all that but anyone who would troll on this subject really fecks me off... what if it was their 18 year old sister, not such a source of banter then I dare say.


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    #185
    Grayson
    Registered Users Posts: 16,124 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    Dudess wrote: »
    Yeah, person goes missing - up to their family to create awareness, particularly if they're a member of an already disenfranchised community.

    And in fairness, people look to news outlets to provide information - seems unfair to object to people not discussing something they don't know about because it was not covered by their publication of choice.
    Is Katy French still being discussed btw?

    Even though it took a few days for the father to report her missing (I don't think either of us knew that when you were responding to me) it'd not the singular responsibly of parents and family.

    And my whole point was what you reiterated, if it's not in the news, we won't be discussing it. And you can see that simply by doing a quick search for katy french here. There's thousands of references to her. There's less than a page of results for this girl.

    And the biggest thread is this one. The one that appeared after a garda said it was a horrific crime that was not being discussed because of her nationality. If you remove this thread from the search, there's only two or three threads.

    So back to my original point, if we take boards as a basic gauge of how much press the killing got, it's showing a very low amount of attention from the press (I'm not saying you could use boards as a 100% indicator, but as a metric it would indicative of the press coverage)

    And the only argument we've had to counter this was someone saying "Well, I remember it was in loads" "Well except for the papers I don't read" and "Well, I can't remember exactly what the coverage was"

    Well, that a load of people saying it's to be expected since Roma beg.


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    #186
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    Jezek wrote: »
    Don't feed the troll guys. Normal humans feel compassion and empathy. Socio/Psychopaths may not, but they know to fake it. Trolls on the other hand, have no emotions except a need to stir up some sh1t.

    I'm far from a troll, just because my opinion differs from your does not make me one.


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    #187
    MagicSean
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,897 ✭✭✭MagicSean


    weldoninhio wrote: »
    I'm far from a troll, just because my opinion differs from your does not make me one.

    No, your opinion makes you something much worse than a troll.


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    #188
    paddyandy
    Site Banned Posts: 2,037 ✭✭✭paddyandy


    Bad behaviour effects those around us ; a truism as old as man himself . Reputations good or bad are generated and their results .


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    #189
    darkdubh
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,628 ✭✭✭darkdubh


    Is the fella charged related to the guy who was convicted of murder in Spain recently and whose mother clobbered a Sunday World reporter?


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    #190
    tayto lover
    Registered Users Posts: 51,485 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    weldoninhio wrote: »
    I'm far from a troll, just because my opinion differs from your does not make me one.

    It's a good job that there are not many with your disgusting and diverse opinions. Take a good look at yourself and examine your opinions.
    I have often stopped to help an injured animal on the road. You would probably inflict more injury.


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    #191
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    tayto lover wrote: »
    It's a good job that there are not many with your disgusting and diverse opinions. Take a good look at yourself and examine your opinions.
    I have often stopped to help an injured animal on the road. You would probably inflict more injury.

    Infilct more injury?? Hahaha, where did you pull that from??


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    #192
    AudreyHepburn
    Registered Users Posts: 5,673 ✭✭✭AudreyHepburn


    There are some seriously sick and messed up opinions on this thread.

    We are talking here about a young girl viciously murdered after being subjected to days ( or was it weeks?) of horrific tortured for no apparent reason. Racism and bigotry have no place here.

    Now I have complained and badmouthed Roma, I admit it, but I would never generalise about them nor would I ever suggest that poor Marioara is not deserving of sympathy because of her culture and backround.

    Certain posters here need to take a long hard look at themselves and their ideals.

    RIP Marioara.


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    #193
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,215 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    Grayson wrote: »
    Dudess wrote: »
    Yeah, person goes missing - up to their family to create awareness, particularly if they're a member of an already disenfranchised community.

    And in fairness, people look to news outlets to provide information - seems unfair to object to people not discussing something they don't know about because it was not covered by their publication of choice.
    Is Katy French still being discussed btw?

    Even though it took a few days for the father to report her missing (I don't think either of us knew that when you were responding to me) it'd not the singular responsibly of parents and family.

    And my whole point was what you reiterated, if it's not in the news, we won't be discussing it. And you can see that simply by doing a quick search for katy french here. There's thousands of references to her. There's less than a page of results for this girl.

    And the biggest thread is this one. The one that appeared after a garda said it was a horrific crime that was not being discussed because of her nationality. If you remove this thread from the search, there's only two or three threads.

    So back to my original point, if we take boards as a basic gauge of how much press the killing got, it's showing a very low amount of attention from the press (I'm not saying you could use boards as a 100% indicator, but as a metric it would indicative of the press coverage)

    And the only argument we've had to counter this was someone saying "Well, I remember it was in loads" "Well except for the papers I don't read" and "Well, I can't remember exactly what the coverage was"

    Well, that a load of people saying it's to be expected since Roma beg.
    Well the garda said it was lack of public outcry, not lack of initial reportage - two different things.
    I understand the man is distraught but I don't think he's being fair. To say there's a significant proportion of people not bothered about what that girl went through because she was Roma is quite the allegation. Most people are compassionate. Only speculating but I'm confident the majority of the worst comments would simply be "I don't like Roma but she didn't deserve that".
    As Millicent said too, numerous missing persons, of settled Irish background, aren't highlighted by the media.


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    #194
    The_Thing
    Registered Users Posts: 1,017 ✭✭✭The_Thing


    One of the girl's abductors handed her brother a €10 note from the car before they drove off with her and in the overall context of Mariora Rostas murder I find this in itself to be a very dark act indeed.

    I have no experience of them - apart from some Roma women selling flowers outside nightclubs, but I doubt very much that this young woman's hopes and dreams amounted to nothing more than begging on the streets of a foreign city.

    May she rest in peace.


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    #195
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,215 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    That thing about the tenner - wtf?! :confused::(


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    #196
    Sunnyisland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,562 ✭✭✭✭Sunnyisland


    themandan6611 wrote: »
    I have a lot of interest, both in the recent arrest of a Mr W and his relations


    Why, just curious, The mother lives not far from me .


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    #197
    JohnMarston
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,881 ✭✭✭JohnMarston


    The_Thing wrote: »
    One of the girl's abductors handed her brother a €10 note from the car before they drove off with her and in the overall context of Mariora Rostas murder I find this in itself to be a very dark act indeed.

    I have no experience of them - apart from some Roma women selling flowers outside nightclubs, but I doubt very much that this young woman's hopes and dreams amounted to nothing more than begging on the streets of a foreign city.

    May she rest in peace.

    Agreed.
    Irredeemably evil b*stards to have done a thing like that.

    RIP Mariora


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    #198
    Solair
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,230 ✭✭✭Solair


    I think there's a worrying acceptance of violent crime in Ireland as if it were just something we should put up with.

    There's too much being turned a blind eye to in Ireland.


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    #199
    RiseToTheTop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 956 ✭✭✭RiseToTheTop


    I feel that when people heard about the killing the thought that she was a girl who would watch her pockets, etc. That went into theire heads.


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    #200
    Sunnyisland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,562 ✭✭✭✭Sunnyisland


    darkdubh wrote: »
    Is the fella charged related to the guy who was convicted of murder in Spain recently and whose mother clobbered a Sunday World reporter?


    Yes thats his step brother, same mother different fathers.


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    #201
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,215 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    tayto lover wrote: »
    I have often stopped to help an injured animal on the road. You would probably inflict more injury.
    In fairness I don't think he would - I don't think he's sociopathic or anything like that... just a person who doesn't put thought into things, and kneejerk reaction makes up his mind for him rather than actual critical thinking.


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    #202
    The_Thing
    Registered Users Posts: 1,017 ✭✭✭The_Thing


    Dudess wrote: »
    That thing about the tenner - wtf?! :confused::(

    The tenner sticks in my mind because I think it symbolises how little she was 'worth' to them.


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    #203
    Jess16
    Registered Users Posts: 1,176 ✭✭✭Jess16


    Of course Irish people will be more affected by something that happens to a fellow Irish person as opposed to someone foreign. It's an entirely natural response to feel protective over things we're familiar with and the greater the familiarity, the greater we're affected.

    It's nothing to do with lack of sympathy and I'm tired of basic human responses being sensationalised into something they're not. Can we not hold personal views anymore without being condemned by the thought police?

    What happened to that poor girl is heartbreaking but that doesn't justify jumping to negative conclusions about an entire nation of people based on their responses to what's essentially, a news headline for the majority of people who didn't know the poor girl.


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    #204
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,215 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    The_Thing wrote: »
    The tenner sticks in my mind because I think it symbolises how little she was 'worth' to them.
    Oh I know - I agree. And to even do it at all - such a goading, gloating act. Depraved bastards.


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    #205
    Ellie2008
    Registered Users Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭Ellie2008


    I find some of the opinions in this thread very disturbing, so what the Roma steal and beg, they are rejected by every society they come into contact with and a lot of them are dirt poor, sleeping rough, no education etc., they do what they can to get by. Of course neither of these traits are desirable in a society but I think a lot of them don't have a choice. There are criminal gangs at work in our own society who seem to have little regard for human life, which is far more worrying.

    Whilst I don't see the benefit in a protest, I would like to see a candlelit procession or something along those lines to remember this girl and show her family some respect. As for the Sunday World taking pictures of her poor family receiving a cheque, it just lacked sensitivity.


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    #206
    Carter P Fly
    Registered Users Posts: 618 ✭✭✭Carter P Fly


    Ellie2008 wrote: »
    I find some of the opinions in this thread very disturbing, so what the Roma steal and beg, they are rejected by every society they come into contact with and a lot of them are dirt poor, sleeping rough, no education etc., .

    They are rejected because they are scammers and thieves by nature.

    The fact that you think them homeless and poor shows how little you know about them and how easily they get away with their act.


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    #207
    strandroad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,676 ✭✭✭strandroad


    Carter P Fly wrote: »
    They are rejected because they are scammers and thieves by nature.

    The fact that you think them homeless and poor shows how little you know about them and how easily they get away with their act.

    This girl's family was indeed homeless and poor, they lived in squalor in a roofless building. They didn't even own a mobile phone between them. To quote you: "The fact that you think them scammers and thieves shows how little you know about them and how easily you get away with your stereotyping."


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    #208
    charlemont
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    darkdubh wrote: »
    Is the fella charged related to the guy who was convicted of murder in Spain recently and whose mother clobbered a Sunday World reporter?

    First cousins..
    Scumbag's and I'm delighted the Guards made an arrest and charged him, Lousy on the poor girl, A lovely looking woman she was too, They probably thought they would have a better life here.


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    #209
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,215 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    Ellie2008 wrote: »
    they are rejected by every society they come into contact with and a lot of them are dirt poor, sleeping rough, no education etc., they do what they can to get by. Of course neither of these traits are desirable in a society but I think a lot of them don't have a choice.
    I agree, but tbh, a lot of Roma do cause hassle - hence the dislike people have for them.

    However I don't think the fact this girl was Roma even needs to be mentioned. She was a human being who was subjected to a hellish death, that's all that matters.


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    #210
    Carlos_Ray
    Closed Accounts Posts: 685 ✭✭✭Carlos_Ray


    I'm often horrified by my own apathy towards the pain of people who I perceive as somewhat different from me. When I hear of 50 people being killed by a car bomb in Iraq, for example, it doesn't register. However, if the same thing happened in Western Europe or North America I would almost certainly have a more emotive reaction.

    The media has played a large part in desensitising people to violence. Particularly violence in poorer countries. I grew up seeing images of starving Africans and dead bodies on the news. This was brought to a new level last year when all major news channels broadcast gadaffi being beaten to death by a mob. Most supposedly civilised people hate to admit it, but Western people are far more disgusted by violence if its carried out against middle class white people. We have been conditioned this way.

    Similarly, the Roma people have been vilified to such a degree that sadly people, whether they admit it or not, look at them as almost a sub-human species. This is why the poor girls ordeal received little attention and provoked little reaction in the country.

    I'm ashamed to admit that I was one of the people that glanced over the story and lost interest as soon as i read she was a Roma. By acknowledging my own hidden prejudice, I hope I can change my frame of mind in the future.


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    #211
    coffee_cake
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Politics Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 81,310 CMod ✭✭✭✭coffee_cake


    we're all the same in death


This discussion has been closed.
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