Minister to force flat rate introduction

vinnyfitz · 24-10-2002 1:03pm #1

Report on the lunch time news today

13.20 Herewith text of the press statement which I just got from a journalist friend:

Minister Dermot Ahern Outlines Move to Flat Rate Internet Access

Policy Directive Issued To Communications Commission

Dublin, Thursday, 24th October, 2002
The Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources, Dermot Ahern TD, today announced that he was directing the Commission for Communications Regulation to introduce flat rate internet access as an absolute priority.

The Minister said that flat rate Internet access was vital in driving the Information Society and was seen as a pivotal part of our development as an economy and as a society.

The Minister told the TIF Annual Telecommunications Conference in Dublin: “It is not alone my view that we need flat rate access. It is the opinion of FORFÁS, it is the opinion of the National Competitiveness Council, the Advisory Committee on Infocoms and just about anyone who has examined our Information Society requirements - that Ireland needs flat-rate internet access. Sooner rather than later.”

Minister Ahern said he would be issuing the Commission with the policy direction immediately under powers laid out in the Communications Regulation Act which came into law in the Spring.

He said the first step was the publication of a draft direction which would then allow a 21 day period for comment before finalising the direction.

The Minister said Ireland’s Internet penetration was just 30% in homes although business penetration stood at 98%.

The telecommunications sector was a major driver of economic prosperity. “We have to lead in this area. It is not enough to trail behind Europe, the US and the Far East in terms of policy and infrastructure. We need a stable, modern and competitive communications market. We need to be the best. The most competitive in the world,” the Minister stated.

The Minister said other provisions he was proposing was minimising the cost of regulation to industry and the need for consistency between the regulatory obligations imposed in Ireland and those of other European countries. These are very important for creating the right climate for investment in Ireland. The Minister has also proposed that regulatory obligations are focused only where required.

The Minister said the challenge facing him was to create a vibrant, innovative and competitive telecoms sector which will benefit Ireland, individual business and the economy in general.

The Minister said the rollout of broadband throughout the country was continuing, in particular via the Metropolitan Area Networks which was initially targeting 20 key towns. “This will support continued foreign investment, not only in the urban centres but also in more rural areas,” the Minister declared.

Minister Ahern said Ireland’s telecoms sector was evolving since the introduction of competition, with 21% of the market now shared among new competitors.

The Minister added: “We need to improve cost effectiveness, enhance price competitiveness and improve services – this will allow us to encourage private investment and keep the Irish telecommunications sector strong.”

ENDS

LoGiE · 24-10-2002 1:09pm

I've just heard that report and it sounds like excellent news. I've one question...how long will it take to get the telco's and isp's to get a fully flatrate product out?

seamus · 24-10-2002 1:18pm

Originally posted by LoGiE
I've just heard that report and it sounds like excellent news. I've one question...how long will it take to get the telco's and isp's to get a fully flatrate product out?

Not long. UTV and EsatBT are ready and waiting. Hopefully they'll get the jump on eircom, and force them to compete (and cop on).

CodeMonkey · 24-10-2002 1:23pm

http://www.onbusiness.ie/2002/1024/odtr.html

spongebob · 24-10-2002 1:31pm

The article sez

The Minister for Communications, Marine & Natural Resources, Dermot Ahern, is issuing a directive instructing

The ODTR was already supervising negotiations so it IS policy
The Directives refer to the Commission which is not yet in existence. He has not announched the establishment date yet which his first job. Afterwards he can issue a directive which will start a 21 day consultation period. The directive then becomes policy.

He cannot direct anyone at the moment. Muppet.
This is why, Section 4 followed by section 13 of the Act and then after 21 days.

Its as stupid and pointless as having the minister of transport telling CIE to run their trains on time.

Ahern is playing politics for the meeting with IoffL next week (see sticky up top)

q. Why did u issue a directive (Dermie babe) to a non existent body with no legal force behind it in the full knowledge that the policy of the current body which will be replaced in time by the non existent body is the facilitation of flatrate ?????

Go back to Fish Dermie, or else go and Direct Ray Burke .....

M

cuddles_ie · 24-10-2002 1:31pm

hi all

and just as i took my netsmart form to bring to the postbox, I listened to the news...yippee. will wait and see whats agreed and offered.

Can I be the first to congratulate IOFFL for all your efforts on this issue and look forward to your futher inputs on the development of flatrate.

S

seamus · 24-10-2002 1:35pm

Yes, today has turned into quite a good day for IOFFL......

BoneCollector · 24-10-2002 2:15pm

Ahem"

It looks like there finaly! repeating what we have ALL being telling them for nearly 2 years! (so its true!! brainwashing realy does work!!)

KEEP Sending those Mails!!

Maybe if your talking to your representative minister on the phone you could have some sound bite playing backwards in the background like i do...

"ireland needs flat rate" "eircom must be crushed"
which would translate as... (for those who need practice)

"dshurk eeb tsuum mawkre" "tayer taylef sdeeein dnahlrei"

now i realy must! stop taking that LSD...

Dangger · 24-10-2002 2:22pm

This is taken directly from Minister Ahern's speech at the The TIF Annual Telecommunications Conference 2002

Today in Ireland, only 30% of homes now have Internet access. This is too low.

The growth rate in residential penetration of the Internet is still far
lower than that of Business Internet penetration, which stands at today at 98%.

I will be doing all in my power to alter this.

Under the Communications Regulation Act 2002 I am authorized to issue Policy Directions to the Commission for Communications Regulation.

Today, I am announcing that it is my intention to issue such a Policy Direction.

I will be directing the Commission that the provision of flat-rate internet access or FRIACO is an absolute priority.

Internationally flat rate internet access has proven to be a key driver in the development of the Information Society.

It is my opinion,
It is the opinion of FORFÁS,
It is the opinion of National Competitiveness Council, the Advisory Committee on Infocoms and just about anyone who has examined our Information Society needs - that Ireland needs flat-rate internet access. Sooner rather than later.

I would also envisage that the scope of these Policy Directions would include a requirement that the Commission take account of the national broadband programme.
…………./
Other provisions I am considering are:
· ensuring that regulatory obligations are focussed only where required,
· that the cost of regulation to the industry be minimised and
· that there be consistency between the type of regulatory obligations imposed in Ireland and those of other European countries where conditions are similar.

Of course, it is my intention to work with industry to deliver these goals.

The legislation requires that before issuing directions, a draft of the
directions be published for consultation.

In this context industry as well as the Commission will have an opportunity to comment on them.

Stand by for press releases from Forfas, IOFFL a gang of others and of course there should be something worth seeing from Eircom....then again maybe there won't be

Cabaal · 24-10-2002 2:25pm

Excellent news!!

Now all we need is some baseball bats and a mini-bus and a trip to EirCONSs HQ

We'll be sorted then

Good work IOFFL!

Dustaz · 24-10-2002 2:34pm

Well holy god, what a day

Muck, i see your concern with regards to the powers that certain offices do and dont have. The main thing about this is that a minister is saying in public that FRIACO is an absolute must and he will do everything to get it introduced. This is a first, AFAIR none of the previous ministers made speeches that came anywhere near this level of action.

The next few weeks will be interesting indeed.

Tazz T · 24-10-2002 2:40pm

'The Office of the Director of Telecommunications Regulation - now headed by Etain Doyle but shortly to be joined by two additional regulators - must now engage phone companies and internet service providers to establish flat rate services. But perhaps more importantly for the consumer, the regulators and the industry must also agree a price range.'

Substitute for that last line. 'Prepare for eircom to drag out the pricing negotiations as long as they can.'

spongebob · 24-10-2002 2:44pm

The wording as quoted by Dangger is cagey

Today, I am announcing that it is my intention to issue such a Policy Direction.

I will be directing the Commission that the provision of flat-rate internet access or FRIACO is an absolute priority.

It makes it sound as if he is signing it when he gets back to the office. He never explained that he cannot do so until he appoints a commission to direct. Did he say when he would (section 4) 'Establish The Commission' ....did he fondue!

This is political muppetry of the highest order, attempting to garner some of the good vibes from UTV and later ESAT for himself. I would pointedly ask him for the establishment date if I was in the meeting next week....sez he uninviting himself from the Clarence Hotel forever and ever.

The ghost of Biddy is lurking in there still

Dermie should have announced a fibre ring while he was at it. Get me the entire Mackerel Fishing Quota for Lough Corrib while ye are in with him lads, I'm sure Dermie could manage that too.

M

Tellox · 24-10-2002 2:45pm

unbeleivable, just heard it on 2fm while coming home from school

looks like I wont have to lash out €100 for DSL for a flat-rate product... utv, the moment you bring it out, make sure you have it 128k-compatible

Dustaz · 24-10-2002 2:54pm

Originally posted by Muck
It makes it sound as if he is signing it when he gets back to the office.

Well in fairness, if you go around believing politicians your going to be VERY disapointed in life.

I didnt read this and think "Great, well have flat rate in a month". I read this and thought "Great, at last we have a politician who is making the right noises. Flat rate is now in the political arena and not just the subject of some vague secret negotiations. The ball is rolling and gaining momentum"

I dont see flat rate happening before christmas, and Q1 is probably unlikely. However if the minister (and any further ministers should there be an election) manages to "stay on the boil" on this subject, we just might be knocking off one of the objectives.

dahamsta · 24-10-2002 2:56pm

I'm afraid I have to side with Muck on this one. I can see Dustaz's point, but let's remember our old friend Mark O'Rourke, who made plenty of promises and never followed through on ONE of them. Sure, we can hold Ahern to it, but WHEN? IrelandOffline should make it a priority to tie Ahern down to a date.

It should also make it a priority to bring a Lemming and blunt instrument to the meeting, to hammer it into his head that Eircom's wholesale pricing must come down. Ahern thinks he has the power to issue directives, great: Issue more. Now.

adam

PS. Since I'm feeling truly cynical today: Has anyone asked Ahern exactly what he means by "flat-rate"?

spongebob · 24-10-2002 3:07pm

as in Bunny. He did nothing and now wants some of the credit.

I am pointing out that he has no authority to direct any such thing and that it is Entirely his own fault for not complying with Section 4 of the Communications Act 2002 which sets out his responsibilities clearly.

Get me my mackerel quota , I know where ye live!

M

LFCFan · 24-10-2002 3:37pm

I agree 100% with Dustaz. I can't believe so many people in here actually believe what comes out of a politicians mouth. I'll believe it when I see it.

spongebob · 24-10-2002 3:43pm

I am sorely Tempted so I am.

LFCFan · 24-10-2002 3:52pm

Originally posted by Muck
I am sorely Tempted so I am.

LOL

SkepticOne · 24-10-2002 4:11pm

Agree with the concerns of Adam and Muck. The whole thing depends on a) the Commission being set up and b) the Commission having the appropriate powers to carry out the directive.

Right now, if you asked the ODTR about FRIACO they would no doubt say that it is already a high priority but they would also state that they can't 'force' it, i.e., it is still down to 'negotiations' between the various parties.

Whether these powers change sufficiently under the Comms Act or the new EU regulatory framework is the real issue.

vinnyfitz · 24-10-2002 4:28pm

Perhaps:
1. Welcoming the announcement and asking the Minister to publish the Direction
2. Expressing the hopes that it won't get bogged down in legalities and that the ODTR will treat it with the same urgency that the Minister now appears to.
3. While accepting the Minister has the power to issue policy directions to the regulator, Querying whether the regulator has the power to implement them?
4. Inviting Eircom to confirm they will not seek to obstruct this initiative and rather to embrace now what they must now accept will be the reality sooner or later.
5. Announcing IOFFL will be discussing the direction and timetable for its impact in detail with the Minister when meeting him on Tuesday. and
6. Inviting Ahern to spell out what price he feel is "affordable" for a flat rate offering.

Is that more or less it?

dahamsta · 24-10-2002 4:42pm

I am sorely Tempted so I am.

You should register it and tell him you'll take it down when he proves he isn't.

My offer of domains at cost stands by the way. I think it's time I added one actually. Hmmm....

adam

gurramok · 24-10-2002 5:08pm

Did Ahern actually mention FRIACO in his statement ?
Can't seem to find it !
Only mention is about flat-rate not a mention of how this new 'directive' will be implemented !

SkepticOne · 24-10-2002 5:17pm

Originally posted by gurramok
Did Ahern actually mention FRIACO in his statement ?
Can't seem to find it !
Only mention is about flat-rate not a mention of how this new 'directive' will be implemented !

See David Long's post on the text of the speech to the TIF on previous page.

Stonemason · 25-10-2002 12:06am

Sounds like sleeping beauty has finaly woken up, great news but...... It makes you wonder what it was that finaly got through to the eeeeeejits.As for getting ahead of europe/usa/asia Daahhh
that race was over months ago the punters have left and a blokes brushing up the ticket stubs and hotdog rappers.O well still good to see some movement in the right direction.

kamobe · 25-10-2002 1:19am

What ye reckon - 4 year court battle resulting in Eircom conceding that maybe their wholesale is a bit pricey, followed by a delayed over priced introduction of flat rate, while taking care to ensure none of their competitors can undercut them?

Article here.

Not to mention of course a 10MB download cap, in case anyone might just be crazy enough to actually apply for it....

De Rebel · 25-10-2002 1:26am

On the one hand.....

pure, thoroughbred, WAFFLE language

Under the Communications Regulation Act 2002 I am authorized to issue Policy Directions to the Commission for Communications Regulation.

Today, I am announcing that it is my intention to issue such a Policy Direction.

I will be directing the Commission that the provision of flat-rate internet access or FRIACO is an absolute priority.

Read it again

Today,
I am announcing oh so this is an announcement - nothing more
that it is
my intention ah, its an intention, he didn't say he would, he said he intended to
to issue such
a Policy Direction. a Policy Direction, a policy direction, A POLICY DIRECTION, scratch, scratch, what exactly is a policy direction..

I will be directing the Commission that the provision of flat-rate internet access or FRIACO
is an absolute priority. ah, I am directing them that its a priority. I am not directing them to do anything in particular, I am simply telling them to regard it as a priority. Because they aren't capable or competent to read the enabling legislation and figure out their own priorities. And anyway they don't exist.

So in summary, this is the sort of loose, carefully hewn civil service speak that says nothing definite.

BUT ON THE OTHER HAND......

He’s only a wet week in office, this is a lot more intelligent that the sort of stuff his predecessor trotted out and repeated at regular intervals, he is a lot more intelligent and a lot less arrogant than his predecessor, he commands a lot more respect than his predecessor, and it sounds as though he is listening, or at the very least tuned in.

And at the moment, he is our very very bestest chance of achieving anything

I'd be prepared to give it six months, and see what emerges.

Thats what the Cork jury thinks anyway

wormhole · 25-10-2002 2:43am

this is what my dear old dad called throwing shapes...
think of the minister as a mime artist

look he's walking against a strong wind
now he's trapped in a glass box
and finally he's issuing a directive on flatrate to people who dont
exist!

the first two are more believable

wormhole

VeeEmmy · 25-10-2002 8:06am

There could be some momentum gained from what he said, even though it is heavily laced with waffley words: MOST people will hear it like this: "I, Dermot Ahern, am forcing inexpensive flat rate internet to be available in Ireland by the New Year."

Now perhaps more of the general population will be demanding it because they "heard it was coming." I am hopeful that it will put more pressure on all parties concerned.. As someone else said, IOFFL's message being parroted by more people and people of influence.

I am finding that most of my friends who use the internet at home know nothing about UTV-ip or Esat's "NetSmart." The advertising has not sunk in. They think that Eircom's pay-by-the-minute is the only game in town.

Maybe they will get excited about what they think they heard on the news and start asking Eircom "Is it ready yet?"

Can I be an optimistic cynic? or a Cynical optimist??

timod · 25-10-2002 9:40am

Haven't seen it mentioned in the thread, but this news was on the 6:01 news on RTE 1 yesterday, and also on 5-7 live, so it got a good spread across the populatation.

Minister to force flat rate introduction

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