The Walking Dead - Season 2 [AMC - US] Spoilers

pixelburp · 18-10-2011 10:38am

I watched this last night & to be honest, it seemed more like a holding pattern from season 1, than a new series in its own right; typically the stakes are raised or a new arc is introduced, but instead it all felt very "as you were", and with that in mind I'd wonder how they intend stretching out the new season into a 13-episode (iirc) run. We got no new arcs (yet) plus with a supposedly reduced budget, I hope that doesn't mean we're in for a succession of filler episodes in the forest.

Watching the new episode also reminded me how little we actually know any of these characters: aside from the Grimes' & that boring love triangle, we know next-to-nothing about any of the other people in the convoy. Other people here may have felt tense and thrilled during the 'herd' scene - and to be fair it was quite nervy - but when you barely know any of the people stuck in this scenario, it was hard to feel too worried for their safety. Oh noes, generic black stereotype has cut his arm! Wait, what was his name again?

It also got me thinking how 1-note & redundant the whole zombie genre really is. Once you get over the initial shock of "the world as we know it is gone", and play that theme out to its conclusion, what possible motivation or catalyst for stories are there? I'm not sure 13 episodes of continuous running from an inescapable threat is gripping TV tbh. And from what I understand of the comics, most of the other humans the Grimes come across plough the "man is the real monster" schtick.

Still though, I'll give it a fair whack all the same

krudler · 18-10-2011 10:54am

pixelburp wrote: »

I watched this last night & to be honest, it seemed more like a holding pattern from season 1, than a new series in its own right; typically the stakes are raised or a new arc is introduced, but instead it all felt very "as you were", and with that in mind I'd wonder how they intend stretching out the new season into a 13-episode (iirc) run. We got no new arcs (yet) plus with a supposedly reduced budget, I hope that doesn't mean we're in for a succession of filler episodes in the forest.

Watching the new episode also reminded me how little we actually know any of these characters: aside from the Grimes' & that boring love triangle, we know next-to-nothing about any of the other people in the convoy. Other people here may have felt tense and thrilled during the 'herd' scene - and to be fair it was quite nervy - but when you barely know any of the people stuck in this scenario, it was hard to feel too worried for their safety. Oh noes, generic black stereotype has cut his arm! Wait, what was his name again?

It also got me thinking how 1-note & redundant the whole zombie genre really is. Once you get over the initial shock of "the world as we know it is gone", and play that theme out to its conclusion, what possible motivation or catalyst for stories are there? I'm not sure 13 episodes of continuous running from an inescapable threat is gripping TV tbh. And from what I understand of the comics, most of the other humans the Grimes come across plough the "man is the real monster" schtick.

Still though, I'll give it a fair whack all the same

I'd agree with all that, the only character I'm rooting for is the crossbow wielding redneck because he's a badass, everyone else is just zombie fodder. that scene when a few hundred zombies just snuck up on them was ludicrous, you would have heard them long before seeing them, but oh no, he sees two, then all of a sudden we ge to hear the rest of them. If they'd seen them coming from ages away and had to hide until they got there it would have been much more tense. I did like the scene where the little girl got lost and he had to take on the two zombies with no weapons, that was a nice touch.

18-10-2011 11:53am

Before I talk about the episode - I think it's important to address a realism issue.

Any Zombie film I have ever watched requires a fair amount tolerance for stupidity. I used to get bothered watching people make awful decisions - but then I realised for the genre to work, you have to dumb people down. Zombies are a funny enemy and individually they lack much threat. Having an enemy that requires a mass of slow moving bodies is quite hard to orchestrate - so the nonsense of having a herd sneak up on our survivors is going to be par for the course with The Walking Dead. It is the price we pay - and it happens in the books.

The scene at the start of Episode 1

was an amalgamation of two instances from the comics. The part where they walk into a dead estate and get over run, and the part where they drive into a herd. For the scene to work - they took half of one and 6 dozen of the other. I was happy enough - would rather have seen one or two "spare" survivors get ripped apart for horrors sake but I guess they are keeping the body count low (that might be a contradiction in terms).

In terms of the episode. What worked for me was the start - I loved the herd, my complaints in the spoiled txt above aside, it was a good tense scene and what Zombie Horror is made for. The two pursuing zombies were faster than I expected and in terms of what happened - Ricks actions made sense, killing a zombie (or any large creature) isn't straight forward, especially with a child at your ankles.

What also worked for me was Andrea's attack on Dale. Great writing, better than the series has offered up previously.

The Zombie autopsy - awesome stuff.

The Church scene - again, great stuff and good imagery.

The Zombies. I hear people talk about Budget cuts - but these are the best ZOmbies I've ever ever seen by a long way. Actually quite faithful to the comic

What didn't work for me:

Two church monologues within 10 minutes were two too much, but I could have lived with one.

During the Herd scene, there were a couple of inconsistencies - between some Zombies being highly inquisitive and others ignoring the meal in front of them, it took me out of the scene a little once it had gotten up and running.

Not enough ZOmbie fodder. At this stage in the comics,

more specifically the housing estate scene

which is roughly where we are in the TV show - we had a far higher body count, and not trivial characters either. I think a couple more expendable cast members wouldn't go too far astray. The herd scene would have been much better if one or two people were getting eaten alive while everyone else cowered under the cars.

The last thing I will complain about is the feeling I had at the end of the episode. Half way through - I was thrilled with the way things were going and was really enjoying the show. At the end - I just felt things had trailed off a lot and they lost the momentum that had been built up. This was a constant issue with the first season, where you would watch 45 minutes of your favourite genre and have nothing to show for it.

To compare to say the wire - they could have very little happen in an hour long episode and still leave you satisfied and well entertained.

The series trailer at the end looked promising - role on next week!

kearneybobs · 18-10-2011 1:34pm

spoiler for the upcoming episodes but did anyone else see the montage they had at the end of the episode? You know, the one previewing the rest of the season? Couple of fairly big spoilers in there.

Rick's kid dies!

18-10-2011 1:46pm

I 100% Guarantee you that he doesn't.

kearneybobs · 18-10-2011 1:51pm

Deleted User wrote: »

I 100% Guarantee you that he doesn't.

I know. I saw the image of

him lying dead with his mother over him.

18-10-2011 2:00pm

He isn't dead.. he is just after losing a lot of blood. He is listed as being in all the remaining episodes and was in an interview talking about season 3 and his character maturing.

I 100% guarantee he doesn't die.

kearneybobs · 18-10-2011 2:01pm

Deleted User wrote: »

He isn't dead.. he is just after losing a lot of blood. He is listed as being in all the remaining episodes and was in an interview talking about season 3 and his character maturing.

I 100% guarantee he doesn't die.

Oh right then. Ignore what I just said then.:o

18-10-2011 2:13pm

I'll probably end up eating those words next Monday!

FortuneChip · 18-10-2011 3:11pm

While I don't like Lori, or maybe it's just the actress... I'm glad she actually had a go at everyone Re: Demanding so much from Rick and condemning his every error.
It happens in every frickin' TV show and it's a wreck the head!

I'm glad the show is back, enjoyed the episode! It's not the best show on TV, but it's good fun. Gutting the zombie was strange stuff, hilarious, but really necessary? I don't know.

human repellent · 18-10-2011 3:13pm

Thought all in all it was a good opener, I've always found people moaning about the realism of zombies who aren't very mobile sneaking up on people but don't see the contradiction in a post apocalyptic world filled with said zombies in the first place

I'll continue watching, it's something that can fill my void till season 5 of breaking bad comes back

kearneybobs · 18-10-2011 3:15pm

FortuneChip wrote: »

While I don't like Lori, or maybe it's just the actress...

She's basically playing the exact same character as she did in Prison Break. didn't like her then and dont really like her now.

jor el · 18-10-2011 3:16pm

Next episode previews of any show are always filled with 50% stuff to make it seem better than it actually is, and 50% stuff that's edited to look completely different from how the episodes will actually play out. I noticed a lot of stuff in that snippet that would have you thinking one thing but I don't believe any of it, for the reasons given. They're always pure misdirection, and nothing more. On the plus side it does look like there will be some new characters soon. Zombie fodder perhaps?

Overall I thought that episode was a bit meh. Yeah it's typical zombie genre stuff, but it doesn't have to be the same old re-hashed stuff that they've already done. Irritating blonde one is getting even more irritating with her moaning and whining, and trying to put the gun together when all she needed to do was be quiet. Anyway, what would she have done, shoot him? Nice one, that just brings the whole herd right back on her. Where will the 6 bullets get you then? Stupid bint. I'm with Dale on this one, keep the gun away from her. Not because she might kill herself, but because she'll get everyone else eaten.

Not a lot of progression in this episode. I doubt very much that Mr Rapey and Blondie will run off, no matter what they're plans are. Something will happen to keep them in the group. Wifey had a good go at the others for not supporting Rick. As she said, he was the only one to go running off after the young one. Not even her own mother went after her, so stow the attitude biatches, yeah!!! Wanted to see her let out a few slaps, but no. Daryl is about the only character that you'd be keen to see staying alive, and not just because he has a cross bow.

All in all, I didn't find it a marked improvement on where last year finished up.

krudler · 18-10-2011 3:56pm

jor el wrote: »

Next episode previews of any show are always filled with 50% stuff to make it seem better than it actually is, and 50% stuff that's edited to look completely different from how the episodes will actually play out. I noticed a lot of stuff in that snippet that would have you thinking one thing but I don't believe any of it, for the reasons given. They're always pure misdirection, and nothing more. On the plus side it does look like there will be some new characters soon. Zombie fodder perhaps?

Overall I thought that episode was a bit meh. Yeah it's typical zombie genre stuff, but it doesn't have to be the same old re-hashed stuff that they've already done. Irritating blonde one is getting even more irritating with her moaning and whining, and trying to put the gun together when all she needed to do was be quiet. Anyway, what would she have done, shoot him? Nice one, that just brings the whole herd right back on her. Where will the 6 bullets get you then? Stupid bint. I'm with Dale on this one, keep the gun away from her. Not because she might kill herself, but because she'll get everyone else eaten.

Not a lot of progression in this episode. I doubt very much that Mr Rapey and Blondie will run off, no matter what they're plans are. Something will happen to keep them in the group. Wifey had a good go at the others for not supporting Rick. As she said, he was the only one to go running off after the young one. Not even her own mother went after her, so stow the attitude biatches, yeah!!! Wanted to see her let out a few slaps, but no. Daryl is about the only character that you'd be keen to see staying alive, and not just because he has a cross bow.

All in all, I didn't find it a marked improvement on where last year finished up.

I didnt get that at all, all she had to do was wait a few secs until the zombie left and keep quiet, what was the point in trying to assemble a gun to shoot a zombie who was walking away anyway? its one of those shows where I want people to get eaten because of their own stupidity. the redneck is the best character because he doesnt say much and kicks ass when needed instead of doing something stupid and trying to get people killed.

FortuneChip · 18-10-2011 3:58pm

Daryl is easily the most reliable character. He kills the Zombies, realistically judges situations, and based on his autopsy seems to be a more than capable surgeon.
Plus he has a crossbow, and always shoots them straight in the eye. Surgeon!

Giruilla · 18-10-2011 4:17pm

I can see this series getting cancelled and ending up in limbo...

First season ended up appalling after promising first two episodes.

Basq · 18-10-2011 4:25pm

Giruilla wrote: »

I can see this series getting cancelled and ending up in limbo...

Love it or hate it.. it's ratings are pretty stellar!

Fishooks12 · 18-10-2011 4:26pm

Giruilla wrote: »

I can see this series getting cancelled and ending up in limbo...

First season ended up appalling after promising first two episodes.

Ya the opening episode was top notch, got less and less interested as the series wore on though and eventually stopped watching

Giruilla · 18-10-2011 4:29pm

Basq wrote: »

Love it or hate it.. it's ratings are pretty stellar!

No denying that.

What I don't like is that you know no series of this is going to have a resolution in the last episode...

Fishooks12 · 18-10-2011 4:45pm

Basq wrote: »

Love it or hate it.. it's ratings are pretty stellar!

Two and a Half men is one of the most successful tv shows in recent times, despite being painfully unfunny

ricero · 18-10-2011 4:49pm

meryl dixon better make an appearance this season

kearneybobs · 18-10-2011 4:55pm

ricero wrote: »

meryl dixon better make an appearance this season

I'm sure they'll give him a nice big handshake when they do finally run into him. :pac:

I'll get my coat!:o

Basq · 18-10-2011 5:26pm

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Two and a Half men is one of the most successful tv shows in recent times, despite being painfully unfunny

Yeah.. and look how long that's run.

As I've already said.. whether you love it or hate it, if it's ratings are good.. it's going nowhere.

don ramo · 18-10-2011 6:34pm

Bacchus wrote: »

I enjoyed the bits in the church. I disagree with don ramo, in times like this, people are desperate for hope and religion is a something a lot of people will be drawn to. It's like marmite, a zombie apocalyse will either throw you to religion or make you feel "how could there be a God in this world".

i said i understand people are religous, i just think if something like that happened id find it hard to believe that if a higher power existed theyd allow so many innocent people to die, i just cant see how anyone could be drawn to it,

what would a zombie apocalypse wipe out, being conservative id say 70% of the population which is 180 million left in the planet, that means 5,820,000,000 people were so sinfull that they had to die

,

KeanSeenan · 18-10-2011 10:02pm

ricero wrote: »

meryl dixon better make an appearance this season

This doesn't require spoilers, but I remember reading somewhere that somebody thought they may use Meryl to become The Governor. Hope I didn't read that here.

Bacchus · 18-10-2011 10:15pm

krudler wrote: »

I didnt get that at all, all she had to do was wait a few secs until the zombie left and keep quiet, what was the point in trying to assemble a gun to shoot a zombie who was walking away anyway? its one of those shows where I want people to get eaten because of their own stupidity.

You reckon she could see what the zombie was doing so? Through the door? All she knew was there was a zombie on the other side of the door and she needed a weapon. The show's not perfect (e.g. Dale should have spotted that herd sooner) but some people seem too eager to poke holes at it.

Bacchus · 18-10-2011 10:22pm

don ramo wrote: »

i said i understand people are religous, i just think if something like that happened id find it hard to believe that if a higher power existed theyd allow so many innocent people to die, i just cant see how anyone could be drawn to it,

what would a zombie apocalypse wipe out, being conservative id say 70% of the population which is 180 million left in the planet, that means 5,820,000,000 people were so sinfull that they had to die,

Not saying it'd be everyone's cup of tea but people have found comfort in religion all across the world for millennia. Desperate people will find comfort in hard times where they can. It's not a stretch that an already religious woman whos daughter is missing would pray. As for Rick, he is the leader, he has noone to look to. Then you'll have the other side of the coin as you describe.

... also, your math sucks

pixelburp · 18-10-2011 10:27pm

I dunno, while I would generally agree that praying after the apocalypse had happened was a bit odd, and some people might find it jarring & obnoxious, I can appreciate why some people might actually do that & seek solace in religion. I think there's an automatic kneejerk reaction that if an American TV show / film features religion in some overt fashion, we assume it's some kind of conservative agenda at play.

Zombies might be nerd-chic these days & terribly cool, but I doubt very much any of us could countenance how we'd behave were it to actually happen. It's not that hard to imagine that faced with the collapse of humanity & civilisation, and an inescapable daily terror - where death is not the worst thing to happen you - a lot of people might turn to God in sheer hopeless desperation. Couldn't hurt.

krudler · 18-10-2011 10:34pm

Bacchus wrote: »

You reckon she could see what the zombie was doing so? Through the door? All she knew was there was a zombie on the other side of the door and she needed a weapon. The show's not perfect (e.g. Dale should have spotted that herd sooner) but some people seem too eager to poke holes at it.

in fairness though they know zombies dont think, its not like it would have been laying an elaborate trap outside, it just didnt find food and shuffled off, if she left it go it would have just gone away

nix · 18-10-2011 10:37pm

Meh, it was an ok episode i guess, the autopsy was just stupid if ya ask me, wtf were they expecting to find in its stomach?? a childs arms?? a license plate?? Its not a shark, doubtful you would find anything that resembled anything familiar in a humans/zombies stomach..

Also the praying was kinda lame, i can allow one out loud prayer of hope, but two is just killing time and corny...

And i was kinda half hoping the blonde would blow her brains out as soon as she was handed the pistol..

Show needs some new blood in it, sadly i can see this cast last most of the series and only new people they bump into getting killed soon after.. Build some characters up and kill them randomly, thats what this show needs

The Walking Dead - Season 2 [AMC - US] *Spoilers*

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The Walking Dead - Season 2 [AMC - US] Spoilers