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Ireland's alcohol problems

2

Comments

  • #32
    Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    don't give the impression to teenages that alcohol is something cool that only adults can do, because teens love to think of themselves as adults without the technicality of legality and will themselves do whatever they think adults are entitled to.

    Allow them the odd glass of wine with dinner, and to come to terms with alcohol and it's effects in a family setting as opposed to a field or a crowded meat market.

    for the adults, stop legislating against law abiding decent people because of the actions of a rowdy minority. 24 hour pubs, or at the very least staggered closing times. This would stop thousands of drunks pouring out en masse at the exact same time onto the same small pieces of real estate. It wouldn't do much to affect the culture of drink, but it would reduce considerably the rowdiness common to us all at weekends wherever in the country.


    do people have to pay for having their stomachs pumped? They really should.. for any drug related illness tbh, if this is something you have done to yourself there is no reason to expect everybody else to pay for it. you break it, you bought it.


  • #33
    RoundyMooney
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,910 ✭✭✭✭RoundyMooney


    Well said, Mordy.


  • #34
    The Mighty Ken
    Closed Accounts Posts: 586 ✭✭✭The Mighty Ken


    Chinafoot wrote: »
    Your post is over-dramatic scaremongering rubbish that is being touted constantly by these anti-drinking lobby groups.

    +1

    To be honest, the problem with Ireland is people like the OP getting on their high horse. You want to create a country of drunk, drugged-up sociopaths then by all means "get tough" on alcohol consumption. Because as we all know, telling people what to do and restricting their decisions with draconian measures coupled with your own egotistical sense of moral outrage always commands respect. Have a nice day. :D


  • #35
    Hogmeister B
    Closed Accounts Posts: 120 ✭✭Hogmeister B


    Mordeth wrote: »


    do people have to pay for having their stomachs pumped? They really should.. for any drug related illness tbh, if this is something you have done to yourself there is no reason to expect everybody else to pay for it. you break it, you bought it.

    While I agree with your other points completely, this one's a bit dodgy. If you pay your taxes you get medical treatment, no questions asked- you've already paid for it, why should you do so again? Should people who have attempted suicide have to pay afresh for their treatment? What about people who drive or cross the road recklessly? Fat people?


  • #36
    Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    i dunno really, I just threw that one in because it sounded good to me.. maybe some form of drug takers insurance? :) You pay a higher premium the more you do.. I'm sure people who go base jumping or sky diving have to buy special insurance.. people who drive have to buy special insurance, so there's a kind of precedent there.


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  • #37
    faceman
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭faceman


    Some good points Mordeth. Never knew you had it in you! :p

    You only have to go into A&E, attend an AA meeting or visit a rehab clinic to see the extent, cost and damage alcohol has done in ireland. Its not all aul fellas and divorced women. In fact younger "normal looking" people are making up the numbers.

    And its costing the "decent folk" in the pocket.


  • #38
    ec18
    Registered Users Posts: 2,700 ✭✭✭ec18


    Mordeth wrote: »
    don't give the impression to teenages that alcohol is something cool that only adults can do, because teens love to think of themselves as adults without the technicality of legality and will themselves do whatever they think adults are entitled to.

    Allow them the odd glass of wine with dinner, and to come to terms with alcohol and it's effects in a family setting as opposed to a field or a crowded meat market.

    for the adults, stop legislating against law abiding decent people because of the actions of a rowdy minority. 24 hour pubs, or at the very least staggered closing times. This would stop thousands of drunks pouring out en masse at the exact same time onto the same small pieces of real estate. It wouldn't do much to affect the culture of drink, but it would reduce considerably the rowdiness common to us all at weekends wherever in the country.


    do people have to pay for having their stomachs pumped? They really should.. for any drug related illness tbh, if this is something you have done to yourself there is no reason to expect everybody else to pay for it. you break it, you bought it.

    +1


  • #39
    FlutterinBantam
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,576 ✭✭✭✭FlutterinBantam


    Despite plenty of posts nobody has put their finger on the problem- ATTITUDE!!

    Thats the problem "attitude to drink in ireland"

    Most other countries drink to enjoy themselves usually drinking bottles and drinking slower.

    paddy rolls into the pub,sets himself up, spreads the legs and tonks down the pints till he is either

    A.. asked to leave at closing time-whatever that is
    B.. has run out of money
    C.. collapses on the floor in a drunken heap
    D..Is so full of drink that it is physically impossible to take in any more.


    As long as the dude or dudess who can lower more drink than anyone else has a standing in social life, then its a poor outlook I'm afraid.

    We need to learn how to enjoy drink properly,otherwise i agree totally with the OP


  • #40
    faceman
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭faceman


    You only have to read the Good Friday threads to see the attitude in action!

    People only want to drink on the day because they cant!!! :rolleyes:


  • #41
    Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    of course, that's bloody human nature. it's one of the very good reasons prohibition is a stupid, stupid idea.. even when it's only enforced for one day out of the year.

    well, two.. three?


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  • #42
    is_that_so
    Registered Users Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Mordeth wrote: »
    don't give the impression to teenages that alcohol is something cool that only adults can do, because teens love to think of themselves as adults without the technicality of legality and will themselves do whatever they think adults are entitled to.

    Allow them the odd glass of wine with dinner, and to come to terms with alcohol and it's effects in a family setting as opposed to a field or a crowded meat market.

    for the adults, stop legislating against law abiding decent people because of the actions of a rowdy minority. 24 hour pubs, or at the very least staggered closing times. This would stop thousands of drunks pouring out en masse at the exact same time onto the same small pieces of real estate. It wouldn't do much to affect the culture of drink, but it would reduce considerably the rowdiness common to us all at weekends wherever in the country.


    do people have to pay for having their stomachs pumped? They really should.. for any drug related illness tbh, if this is something you have done to yourself there is no reason to expect everybody else to pay for it. you break it, you bought it.

    I was told that the Mater , at one point, refused to treat people unless they agreed to go to AA. Very strongly in favour of charging people.

    Not sure about the 24 hour pubs. In other countries maybe but there is still such bravado associated with being able to drink a lot here, it might exacerbate the problem.
    flanum wrote: »
    i have alco problems.

    running out of cans/mixers etc after closin times... big problem.

    running out of fags at silly oclock while talking/typing about alcohol.. problem.

    yes I had a close relative who used to say the same thing. He's dead now - alcohol abuse killed him.


  • #43
    Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    while I'd be in favour of rehabilitation programs for abusers, or self-help groups... AA is a dirty, dirty little organisation. It's basically the catholic church, but without a pope.


  • #44
    faceman
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭faceman


    Mordeth wrote: »
    AA is a dirty, dirty little organisation. It's basically the catholic church, but without a pope.

    :confused:


  • #45
    Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    it's a cult. they tell the drug abusers that they basically have no power over themselves or their decisions, that there is just something "wrong" with them. You can't progress without giving yourself up to a higher power and admitting that you can't fix yourself only they can. They don't come out and say 'god', hey it could be a rock or a tree.. but it's pretty damn obvious that they mean god and it's pretty clear too who's god they mean.

    There is nothing whatsoever scientific about it, no research or growth.. just god, self loathing and more god.


  • #46
    faceman
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭faceman


    Mordeth wrote: »
    it's a cult. they tell the drug abusers that they basically have no power over themselves or their decisions, that there is just something "wrong" with them. You can't progress without giving yourself up to a higher power and admitting that you can't fix yourself only they can. They don't come out and say 'god', hey it could be a rock or a tree.. but it's pretty damn obvious that they mean god and it's pretty clear too who's god they mean.

    There is nothing whatsoever scientific about it, no research or growth.. just god, self loathing and more god.

    Sorry mordeth, you are way off the mark on this one. Thats all completely untrue and nonsense. What are you basing that on?

    Also they dont treat drug users.


  • #47
    Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    not AA, but cocaine anonymous, gambling anonymous, masturbation anonymous, anonymous anonymous.


    --edit

    # We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable.
    # Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
    # Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.
    # Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
    # Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
    # Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
    # Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.
    # Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.
    # Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.
    # Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it.
    # Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His Will for us and the power to carry that out.
    # Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs



    well, looks like they do mentioned god outright. not just god either, but God.. capital G. Sounds like they know him personally.


  • #48
    Davidius
    Registered Users Posts: 4,893 ✭✭✭Davidius


    Yeah I think South Park's a good show too. :)


  • #49
    Dudess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 37,215 ✭✭✭✭Dudess


    slipss wrote: »
    Ehhh **** off. Maybe alcohol is the only thing keeping the country goin, ever consider that?.....No, of course you didn't, because that is just stupid.
    Keep it civil please.
    rediguana wrote: »
    I manage an off-licence and it'd break your heart to see the beautiful young girls coming in three and four nights a week buying one euro beers and vodka and marlborough lights.They're having their time in the sun now but it's all downhill in a couple of years.
    That's rather condescending. Why doesn't it break your heart to see young boys coming in and blowing their money on fags and cheap booze? And maybe it's not all downhill in a couple of years for those girls? What about men losing their looks from too much booze and fags? Oh... wait. It's only females that get judged on losing their looks and ageing.
    I don't want to fall into the usual trap of claiming that this generation is the worst ever and is going straight to hell, but there does seem to be a lot of chaos these days - violence, stupid prices, Godlessness (even though I'm as Godless as anyone)...

    Crazy boozing is tolerated too much in this country.
    Alcoholism has always been a serious problem in this country - even when we weren't "godless".
    faceman wrote: »
    You only have to read the Good Friday threads to see the attitude in action!

    People only want to drink on the day because they cant!!! :rolleyes:
    Bull. People want to drink because it's a Friday - the start of the weekend. Friday is a very popular night for going out. If the feast was on a Monday and people were moaning that they couldn't buy drink or go to the pub, then yes, I'd agree with you.

    OP, your statement is rather sweeping and needs a bit of backing up. At the same time though, there is a fairly scary culture of binge-drinking - but then, when have people ever shown restraint when it comes to drinking? And remember that people grow out of all this boozing madness. A couple with young kids will be lucky if they manage a couple of glasses of wine a week, a person in their 20s working full-time and paying a mortgage can only afford to go out one night a week etc.


  • #50
    Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    Davidius wrote: »
    Yeah I think South Park's a good show too. :)


    was bull**** actually that started me looking online about AA.


    what tv show did I get my opinion about 24 hour drinking from?


  • #51
    Neamhshuntasach
    Registered Users Posts: 2,164 ✭✭✭Neamhshuntasach


    Ireland has a drink culture. Plain and simple. We're not alcoholics. People binge drink because they were raised seeing people binge drinking. So we developed a different attitude towards alcohol than most other countries. Having lived in the states while at college and traveled most of the world you can really see the difference in our attitudes towards drink. People in most other countries go out to enjoy a beer after work or maybe to watch some sporting event on tv or just catch up with mates. Then they go home. Over here we go out to get hammered. I'm not saying every Irish person thinks that way but it appears to be an awful lot. The only way to change our fondness of the drink in this country is to adults and teens to reduce it so the next generation aren't brought up to emulate us. But that ain't gonna happen to we'll long be a nation of scoopers.


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  • #52
    Mimikyu
    Registered Users Posts: 18,903 ✭✭✭✭Mimikyu


    This post has been deleted.


  • #53
    faceman
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭faceman


    Dudess wrote: »
    Bull. People want to drink because it's a Friday - the start of the weekend. Friday is a very popular night for going out. If the feast was on a Monday and people were moaning that they couldn't buy drink or go to the pub, then yes, I'd agree with you.

    Re-read alot of the adolescent posts in there


  • #54
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    Neamhshuntasach wrote: »
    People binge drink because they were raised seeing people binge drinking.

    It was no where near as common amoung my parents generation. The hadn't the money, they had a vibrant social life that excluded alcohol in the dancehalls and it was socially unacceptable for women to behave like that.
    Alcoholism is a different matter, but mostly I think it down to a strong herd mentality in this country.
    Neamhshuntasach wrote: »
    Ireland has a drink culture. Plain and simple. We're not alcoholics.

    Lots of us are, but that isn't the point. You don't have to be an alcoholic for your drinking to causes big problems for yourself and others.


  • #55
    faceman
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭faceman


    Mordeth wrote: »
    not AA, but cocaine anonymous, gambling anonymous, masturbation anonymous, anonymous anonymous.


    --edit

    # We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable.
    # Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
    # Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.
    # Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
    # Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
    # Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
    # Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.
    # Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.
    # Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.
    # Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it.
    # Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His Will for us and the power to carry that out.
    # Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs



    well, looks like they do mentioned god outright. not just god either, but God.. capital G. Sounds like they know him personally.

    the AA in ireland do not promote any of that shoite


  • #56
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭[Deleted User]


    Does AA reckon your an alcholic?

    http://www.alcoholicsanonymous.ie/opencontent/default.asp?id=14&itemId=14&Section=About%20Us

    and apparrently they do the God thing in Ireland too.


  • #57
    faceman
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭faceman


    faceman wrote: »
    Re-read alot of the adolescent posts in there

    some examples:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55437734&postcount=4
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55440461&postcount=63
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55439395&postcount=47
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55440822&postcount=69
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55440219&postcount=57

    Its all about the oppression!


  • #58
    Sir Digby Chicken Caesar
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 23,556 ✭✭✭✭Sir Digby Chicken Caesar


    faceman wrote: »
    the AA in ireland do not promote any of that shoite



    rofl

    from moonbabys link

    http://www.alcoholicsanonymous.ie/opencontent/default.asp?itemid=10&section=12+Steps+%2D+12+Traditions


    --edit

    and what exsactly is your love for religious dogma leading to law all about? I suppose you're all in favour of sharia too are you?


  • #59
    Fremen
    Registered Users Posts: 2,481 ✭✭✭Fremen


    faceman wrote: »
    some examples:

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55437734&postcount=4
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55440461&postcount=63
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55439395&postcount=47
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55440822&postcount=69
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=55440219&postcount=57

    Its all about the oppression!

    One of your examples:
    I have no issues with drink and can easily abstain for a day, week or month If I so wish. however, I have a major issue with the government telling me I cant go for a drink tomorrow night because the catholic church says so - im not even a practising catholic!
    Religion should not be ruling the country to this extent in this day and age. Many people are not catholics or even religious and yet are forced to obey these rules. If we cant drink surely restaurants and shops should not be allowed to sell meat either or is it just a coincidence that the church and government latched onto the alchohol bit only

    Adolescent? :confused:

    Just because they don't subscribe to the same puritanical christian crap you presumably do doesn't make them adolescent.


  • #60
    faceman
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,584 CMod ✭✭✭✭faceman


    Mordeth wrote: »
    rofl

    from moonbabys link

    http://www.alcoholicsanonymous.ie/opencontent/default.asp?itemid=10&section=12+Steps+%2D+12+Traditions


    --edit

    and what exsactly is your love for religious dogma leading to law all about? I suppose you're all in favour of sharia too are you?

    Go to one of their meetings and see. Its not scientology or brainwashing. Mixed religions and cultures etc. The vast majority of people i know who have gone and go give alot of credit to it. Id like to tell you who, but its all anonymous! ;)

    Not sure what you mean by your last bit. I dont like Indian food.


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  • #61
    gerky
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,407 ✭✭✭gerky


    I have to agree with a lot of what the op says and I'm not getting up on my high horse I'm just saying what I'm seeing.
    I'm not sure a lot of people realize what constitutes having a drink problem be it an alcoholic or a binge drinker.
    I don't agree with prohibition or anything like that nor do I agree with 24 hour pubs as it obviously didn't work in the uk, Its seems that a lot of people have very little self control.

    And these links from the last few years seem to back up the OP's claims.

    link1
    link2
    link3
    link4
    link5
    link6
    link7


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