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"Leap" into the unknown: The feedback thread

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    #1442
    BobSmith128
    Registered Users Posts: 57 ✭✭BobSmith128


    Just an update here on the Auto Top Up Trial.
    Irish Rail now have changed the auto top up level down to the 10 euro.
    Happened Monday this week. So happy its down to the as communicated level instead of the 15 euro mark.

    After the initial confusing start, the auto top up is becoming a great facility for me. I no longer have to worry about not having enough credit on my card.

    The direct debits deductions usually appear 3-4 working days from the auto top being applied to your card.

    I wonder how far they are from rolling it out to everyone.....


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    #1443
    donspeekinglesh
    Registered Users Posts: 1,861 ✭✭✭donspeekinglesh


    Captain Chaos wrote: »
    Howth Junction can be just as bad at times,

    The lack of validator on the centre platforms is a serious pain. I work in the Industrial Estate, and normally get trains to/from the centre platforms. Always have to cross the bridge to tag on/off, and then come back again.


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    #1444
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    Captain Chaos wrote: »
    You could still tag on alright and some users manged to tag on again while trying to tag off and got charged the maximum fare twice.

    It's really annoying the way those gets are set for either on or off, and not able to do both.

    Regularly see the polls going offline or freezing up in Coolmine and it's only a matter of time before one side of the gates will act up. One of'em wasn't able to do tag ons this morning.


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    #1445
    Be well and win
    Registered Users Posts: 329 ✭✭Be well and win


    Captain Chaos wrote: »
    Had a great one this evening. 4 times this year that Raheny station has been completely un manned and not one of the 4 tag off points at the stations were working. The two at the barriers were offline and the two platform points are vandalisied. I am fed up having to ring up for refunds all the time. Also why is one of the busiest DART stations on the north side un maned during peak hours. Not that it would have made a difference as all the tag locations were offline. Joke of a system. You could still tag on alright and some users manged to tag on again while trying to tag off and got charged the maximum fare twice.

    Howth Junction can be just as bad at times, basically had enough of Irish Rail at this stage and the fact they can't/won't maintain thier property due to cuts backs while screwing the customer.

    In fairness, I think unmanned stations and equipment not working is more down to Irish Rail rather then Leapcard. Having said that, I've had issues at Dalkey and a couple of other stations, fierce annoying. Can't help wondering if I can't touch on and I get stopped by an inspector, what happens


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    #1446
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    You'll be given a standard fare notice. If you can't touch on, you need to buy a ticket at a tvm.


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    #1447
    el flaco
    Registered Users Posts: 323 ✭✭el flaco


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    You'll be given a standard fare notice. If you can't touch on, you need to buy a ticket at a tvm.

    Ha, that's classic! New slogan:
    "Use Leap Card so you never have to carry cash again. But also make sure you carry cash.....in case the machines don't work. And don't forget that if the machines don't work your journey will cost more and you will need to get to the station earlier just in case you end up having to buy a ticket."


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    #1448
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,243 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    el flaco wrote: »
    Ha, that's classic! New slogan:
    "Use Leap Card so you never have to carry cash again. But also make sure you carry cash.....in case the machines don't work. And don't forget that if the machines don't work your journey will cost more and you will need to get to the station earlier just in case you end up having to buy a ticket."
    In fairness, nobody is forcing you to use the train.


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    #1449
    noelfirl
    Registered Users Posts: 625 ✭✭✭noelfirl


    Bit of an extreme answer there Victor, when the solution is for IE to pull their finger out and make sure that machines/poles are working and configured correctly to the best of their ability. The feeling people are getting is that they're often just not that bothered.


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    #1450
    el flaco
    Registered Users Posts: 323 ✭✭el flaco


    Victor wrote: »
    In fairness, nobody is forcing you to use the train.

    So it's my problem?

    The cynic in me would suggest that it would not be in the administrations interest to fix any devices in the hope of catching people that are unable to tag on. I for one put money on my leap card so that I don't have to carry cash and often don't carry cash. I don't see why I should have to top up my card and also go to an ATM just in case I need to pay for a ticket. Why should have I have to do two tasks for one outcome?

    From a completely logical standpoint, if a service isn't provided it is not the consumers problem. And if there is a problem you shouldn't have to pay more!


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    #1451
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    If you go on, without paying, when you've a means to pay, yeah, its your problem. Doesn't excuse Irish rail, but doesn't mean you can hop on without paying. You won't be able to tag on/off at the destination, so even if tvm is down as well, there is an expectation you'll pay at the destination.


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    #1452
    Stevek101
    Registered Users Posts: 1,281 ✭✭✭Stevek101


    Auto topup worked perfectly, pretty happy with this feature! Victor I noticed they've changed the My Account page on the website. Plenty of references of product tickets. Any idea if there is/will be a trial for DB ones? I'd love to be a part of it.


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    #1453
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,243 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    There was a trial 2 years ago for annual tickets, which are the simplest of all the products.

    It was suggested that products might happen this summer, but it's a matter of gently, gently.

    I suspect the next stage might be expanding the 1 and 7 day tickets to the other operators.


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    #1454
    MOH
    Registered Users Posts: 6,464 ✭✭✭MOH


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    If you go on, without paying, when you've a means to pay, yeah, its your problem. Doesn't excuse Irish rail, but doesn't mean you can hop on without paying. You won't be able to tag on/off at the destination, so even if tvm is down as well, there is an expectation you'll pay at the destination.

    But if you're not carrying cash because you have a leap card, then you don't have a means to pay. Or rather, you do have a valid means to pay, but they're not accepting it due to their own inability to keep their system up and running. It renders the whole Leap card system pointless.


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    #1455
    Van.Bosch
    Registered Users Posts: 2,849 ✭✭✭Van.Bosch


    Victor wrote: »
    There was a trial 2 years ago for annual tickets, which are the simplest of all the products.

    It was suggested that products might happen this summer, but it's a matter of gently, gently.

    I agree that these would be the easiest to program as they are unlimited use almost, any idea on why the hold up?

    I would have thought that my annual bus&rail ticket would be a leap card by now with cash purse functionality for Luas etc.


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    #1456
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    MOH wrote: »
    But if you're not carrying cash because you have a leap card, then you don't have a means to pay. Or rather, you do have a valid means to pay, but they're not accepting it due to their own inability to keep their system up and running. It renders the whole Leap card system pointless.

    Several times I've been on a Dublin Bus service where, for example, I board with a Travel 90 but the smartcard reader is offline. The driver has always waved me on and I didn't have to scan it. I wasn't told to pay by cash instead. On one or two occasions I even saw a rag in the coin slot and anyone who had intended to pay by cash were let go ahead.


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    #1457
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Surely if your leapcard "ticket" is not available to purchase by you tagging on at any station with your leap card then you are allowed pay at your destination or travel for free?


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    #1458
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,243 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Karsini wrote: »
    Several times I've been on a Dublin Bus service where, for example, I board with a Travel 90 but the smartcard reader is offline. The driver has always waved me on and I didn't have to scan it. I wasn't told to pay by cash instead. On one or two occasions I even saw a rag in the coin slot and anyone who had intended to pay by cash were let go ahead.

    That is because there is only one entrance to a bus, but dozens of entrances to the DART system.


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    #1459
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    Surely if your leapcard "ticket" is not available to purchase by you tagging on at any station with your leap card then you are allowed pay at your destination or travel for free?

    The discussion is about "not having to pay at all", as a result of a smart card device not being functional in the station which you commence your journey. There are other means avail to pay, such as TVM. Also, as Victor mentioned, usually other smart card devices available to use with your leap card.


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    #1460
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,462 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Victor wrote: »
    That is because there is only one entrance to a bus, but dozens of entrances to the DART system.

    But really if all leap readers are down, then you should travel free.

    An alternative solution would be to allow you to tag-on/tag-off via the TVM, don't know why it doesn't have that ability.

    If the TVM is down too then you should definitely be allowed to travel free as there is no way to buy a ticket.


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    #1461
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    Not saying it wont, or never has occurred, but only time I've seen all readers go down, is when it's all the poles at a station, but the gates still work. I've only ever seen individual gates go down, never the lot of'em at a station.

    Irish rail, then look for payment at destination if unable to pay where you start. This isn't possible with Leap card, as all the devices have set locations.


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    #1462
    bk
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,462 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    Interestingly, in the last 5 times I've take the bus, 3 times the leap card reader hasn't been working.

    Now every time the driver has just waved me on, which is absolutely the correct thing to do. I don't carry any change any more as a result of leap.

    But it has to make me wonder about the reliability of leap, the DB ticket machines and how much money DB most be losing?

    I wonder if moving to tag-on/tag-off system or even a flat fare would increase the reliability and actually save them money.


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    #1463
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    Yeah well, that's up to dublin bus to do that. They generally accept loss of fares when their scanning/ticket machines aren't working. Irish Rail, don't.


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    #1464
    el flaco
    Registered Users Posts: 323 ✭✭el flaco


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    The discussion is about "not having to pay at all", as a result of a smart card device not being functional in the station which you commence your journey. There are other means avail to pay, such as TVM. Also, as Victor mentioned, usually other smart card devices available to use with your leap card.

    I don't know if people necessarily expect to travel for free if a validator doesn't work. I don't anyway. It's the potential for receiving a fine because you couldn't tag on that I take issue with. I am more than willing to use my card which I have put money on.

    I have been unable to tag on at a validator in the past so I just tagged at the gates at the destination, then emailed Leap customer care and told them about the dodgy validator and they refunded the excess. No fines were issued and they had their validator inspected for free. Win win.

    I had to do this when I couldn't tag off too, when all the validators and gates were out of action due to a power cut.


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    #1465
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    The discussion is about "not having to pay at all", as a result of a smart card device not being functional in the station which you commence your journey. There are other means avail to pay, such as TVM. Also, as Victor mentioned, usually other smart card devices available to use with your leap card.

    But when you are forced to use a tvm you are not allowed to purchase the ticket of your choice which is the leapcard "ticket" at the leap fare.

    http://www.irishrail.ie/media/FixedPenaltyDLLeafletV.51.pdf
    8. WHAT IF THE TICKET OFFICE IS CLOSED OR THE
    TICKET VENDING MACHINES ARE NOT WORKING
    OR THE STATION HAS NO TICKET OFFICE?
    Ticket vending machines are in operation through out our
    Network. These machines are monitored and regularly
    maintained to ensure that they are operational. However
    in the event that the booking office is closed or the ticket
    Vending Machines are not working, you will then be
    required to pay for your journey on the train or at your
    destination.     Failure or refusal to pay the required fare
    will result in and Penalty being issued .

    I would think that anyone with a leap card is covered by this instruction from Irish Rail allowing you to purchase your leap ticket at the correct leap fare at your destination in much the same way as if a booking office is closed and there is no way of buying your ticket before boarding.

    It is unusual that there is no details of what passengers should do in the event of a failure of the tag on/off machines at railway stations and the cynic in me says this is deliberate by IE as they can gain more in penalty fares than if they kept their equipment in good repair.


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    #1466
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    Foggy, You can't pay at the destination with a leap card, as Irish rail can't adjust start/destination points on the validators.

    El Flaco, in your instance they didn't get a free inspectation, they paid you 5euro for the priviledge :pac:


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    #1467
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users Posts: 33,872 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Victor wrote: »
    In fairness, nobody is forcing you to use the train.

    That should be their advertising slogan.

    Life ain't always empty.



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    #1468
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    Foggy, You can't pay at the destination with a leap card, as Irish rail can't adjust start/destination points on the validators.

    El Flaco, in your instance they didn't get a free inspectation, they paid you 5euro for the priviledge :pac:
    But if they are unable to sell you the ticket for your journey (which is allowing you tag on) they must allow you travel for free.

    If you want a ticket from Galway to Dublin but they cant sell you a ticket in Galway they must allow you buy your ticket in Dublin and it must be the same type and fare as what you would have bought in Galway


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    #1469
    el flaco
    Registered Users Posts: 323 ✭✭el flaco


    Dravokivich wrote: »
    El Flaco, in your instance they didn't get a free inspectation, they paid you 5euro for the priviledge :pac:

    Yep, which I gave them back at my destination and then paid them a further fiver so I could leave the train station without having to traverse an electronic gate :) So I lost the freebie and paid more for my trip than I usually would. Of course I had to email customer care to get my couple of euro refunded too, which cost untold mental damage as it was 2 minutes of my time I could have been spending googling for Zooey Deschanel pictures.....


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    #1470
    SteM
    Registered Users Posts: 6,529 ✭✭✭SteM


    Invites are open for starstreams according to their Twitter feed. Each current user has 2 invites available to them.


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    #1471
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    Starstreams? Sure you're posting in the right thread?


This discussion has been closed.
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