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Sam Harris on the Israel-Palestine Conflict

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Comments

  • #512
    jank
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭jank


    Nodin wrote: »
    And this somehow means you can ignore discrimination within Israel, and the apartheid system within the west bank etc. How convenient.

    Its a fact. The Palestinians living in Gaza and the West Bank are not Israelis. Palestinians living in Israel who hold a Israeli passport are Israeli and have the right to vote in democratic elections and enjoy more human rights than Arabs in the rest of the Arab world.

    Nodin wrote: »
    Ahh, evasion.

    Its a fact. I disagree with the occultation and with the building of settlements but I don't think the solution to this is violence. You are the person vaguely justifying the killing of Israeli civilians because of the status qua. At least come out and admit it.


    Nodin wrote: »
    Israel is the effective authority in the occupied territories. Palestinians do not get to vote in Israeli elections. Israelis who live in the occupied territories are afforded the protections of Israeli law and preferential access to resources, aid etc. It is a two tier apartheid system.

    Emotive language aside, it is hence why I favour a two state solution.


  • #513
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    jank wrote: »
    Its a fact. The Palestinians living in Gaza and the West Bank are not Israelis. Palestinians living in Israel who hold a Israeli passport are Israeli and have the right to vote in democratic elections and enjoy more human rights than Arabs in the rest of the Arab world.
    .

    But they are governed by Israel. Therefore they are subject to a Government they have no say in. Secondly others in that territory are allowed a say in it, rendering the situation akin to apartheid South Africa.

    As regards how Palestinians in Israel are treated, its a cold house for them
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...l?hpid=topnews

    http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition...state-1.225919

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4198754.stm

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...T2007121902748

    jank wrote: »
    Emotive language aside, it is hence why I favour a two state solution.


    Theres nothing emotive about it. It's a two tier system based on ethnicity/religion. It is apartheid.


  • #514
    jank
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 13,018 ✭✭✭✭jank


    Nodin wrote: »
    But they are governed by Israel. Therefore they are subject to a Government they have no say in.

    Oh, its governed now not occupied. I missed that memo. Are you saying that the Palestinian Authority are subjects of Israel and are governed by Israel?


  • #515
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    jank wrote: »
    Oh, its governed now not occupied. I missed that memo. Are you saying that the Palestinian Authority are subjects of Israel and are governed by Israel?


    Effectively yes. They don't even collect a lot of their own taxes, but have to beg them back off Israel. They can't block settlement expansion, land seizure, road construction. They're powerless save what power Israel permits them, which can change on a whim.


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