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Freddie Roach-good/bad?

  • 18-07-2012 7:10am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 657 ✭✭✭


    Hi all,

    In the aftermath of Khan losing his title and remembering Pac-man also losing recently (yet controversially) I have heard some people saying* that Khan should dump Roach as trainer and that he (Roach) got Khan's tactics wrong for the Garcia fight. In essence they were saying Roach cost him the fight and that he isn't a good trainer-I disagree with both.

    I have always regarded Roach as a top class trainer having had so many world champs and big names.

    What do people here think of him...should Khan get rid of him/keep him? Maybe Roach is considering the same. Should Roach have not let Khan of his stool for the 4th round?


    *comments on the articles about Khan on skysports.com

    my URBAN EXPLORATION YouTube channel: https://www.facebook.com/ASMRurbanexploration/



Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 10,549 ✭✭✭✭cowzerp


    He's a quality coach but his style is not what Khan needs to work on

    Rush Boxing club and Rush Martial Arts head coach.



  • Registered Users Posts: 224 ✭✭babymanval


    Hi all,

    In the aftermath of Khan losing his title and remembering Pac-man also losing recently (yet controversially) I have heard some people saying* that Khan should dump Roach as trainer and that he (Roach) got Khan's tactics wrong for the Garcia fight. In essence they were saying Roach cost him the fight and that he isn't a good trainer-I disagree with both.

    I have always regarded Roach as a top class trainer having had so many world champs and big names.

    What do people here think of him...should Khan get rid of him/keep him? Maybe Roach is considering the same. Should Roach have not let Khan of his stool for the 4th round?


    *comments on the articles about Khan on skysports.com

    Only someone who didn't have the first clue about boxing would even dare to ponder if Roach is anything less than a master. He's in the top 5 trainers of all time imo (behind the likes of Futch/Steward/Dundee). Concluding anything else is nonsensical sensationalism with respect to his recent losses.

    Bottom line; his main fighters have lost 3 fights in recent years; Pacquaio's being a farcical scoring debacle, and the other two being down to Khan's implosions. None of which Roach can do anything about. Re: Khan: at the end of the day, Roach can do so much, but he can't go in there for Khan and stick to the gameplan for him (which Khan decided against, twice), nor can he put a solid chin on him.

    Forget the talk of Khan ditching Roach, that sounds like Khan's usual projectionist sh!te, blaming everyone but himself. Roach should ditch Khan, I believed that after the Peterson fight, Saturday only copperfastens that for me.


  • Registered Users Posts: 524 ✭✭✭Maravilla33


    You have to remember that Roach is working thrrough a dehabilitating disease and has been for years. Its noticeably getting worse but that makes the work he does all the more remarkable. Pacquiao wouldn't have become the fighter he did without Freddie. He was a one handed, fairly limited, unknown fighter fighting in Asia until Roach took him under his wing. Don't get me wrong its been mutually beneficial to them both but a lot of the success is down to Roach completely revamping Pacquiao.

    I agree that he probably doesn't suit Khan like a Manny Steward would. Khan needs to learn to use his physical advantages and stay on the outside, use his speed to and jab and counter and stay out of range. His chin is a severe and well known weakness its time to stop trying to prove hes macho etc. Steward did wonders with Hearns, Lewis and Wlad who all had question marks over their chins. Khan's willingness to trade and inability to stick to a gameplan are the cause of his downfall and not Freddie Roach.


  • Registered Users Posts: 254 ✭✭Ghost.


    Id rate Roach as one of if not the best coach around. I dont think Pacman losing was anything to do with him, theres nothing any coach can do about poor judges scoring.
    Neither was Khans loss his fault.
    I dont think leaving Freddie Roach would make any difference to Khan. He will always have a glass jaw, and unfortunately no matter how good he is skill wise in pro boxing somtimes people are going to hit him on it. It will always be his achilles heel.


  • Registered Users Posts: 657 ✭✭✭Andrew Flexing


    Agreed. I thought the notion of Khan ditching Roach was an arrogant one, afterall Roach took Khan soonafter the Prescott massacre and guided to becoming a champion. I agree that Roach is one of the best, his record of champs is incredible. Long may he continue coaching.

    my URBAN EXPLORATION YouTube channel: https://www.facebook.com/ASMRurbanexploration/



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  • Registered Users Posts: 217 ✭✭geurrp the yard


    Big fight record in recent times has been poor with exception of chavez, pacman(contentious).


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,740 ✭✭✭✭MD1990


    Agreed. I thought the notion of Khan ditching Roach was an arrogant one, afterall Roach took Khan soonafter the Prescott massacre and guided to becoming a champion. I agree that Roach is one of the best, his record of champs is incredible. Long may he continue coaching.
    i don't think him thinkin of gettin a new coach is because he thinks Roach is not a great trainer
    its more so because he wants an exclusive trainer
    because Roach misses weeks of Khan's training camp training Pacquio & other fighters


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,549 ✭✭✭✭cowzerp


    Also with all the Roach love going on, part of why he rarely loses is he is well known for picking fights that suit, him and Arum together..

    Rush Boxing club and Rush Martial Arts head coach.



  • Site Banned Posts: 2,719 ✭✭✭DB10


    Roach should dump Khan. He's mouthing off about him, not listening to basic instructions. At this point does he really need the hassle of training him.


  • Registered Users Posts: 54,495 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    DB10 wrote: »
    Roach should dump Khan. He's mouthing off about him, not listening to basic instructions. At this point does he really need the hassle of training him.

    It's not hassle. It's money.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,432 ✭✭✭willmunny1990


    It wont make a bit of difference to Khan whether he stays with Roach or not he's still always going to fall short. No coach can fix the problems Khan has at this stage.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,144 ✭✭✭Scanlas The 2nd


    Roger Mayweather is just what Khan needs.He'd show him how to make the most of his speed and reach.


  • Registered Users Posts: 524 ✭✭✭Maravilla33


    Roger Mayweather is just what Khan needs.He'd show him how to make the most of his speed and reach.

    Not sure if we can know how good a coach Roger is. He's working with the most naturally gifted and talented fighter of his generation. I get the feeling PBF really does his own thing and it wouldn't matter who trained him. After that theres not that much evidence to suggest Roger is a great trainer..


  • Registered Users Posts: 7 gav_dub100


    Firstly the Pac-Bradley fight was daylight robbery so shouldn't be part of the discussion.

    Before the Khan fight Roach stated that the gameplan was to move in throw 2-3 punches and get out and to avoid getting into exchanges with the heavy handed Garcia. Khan's inability to stick to this plan when he got cocksure and started throwing powerpunch combos with his hands down should not be blamed on Freddie Roach.


  • Registered Users Posts: 239 ✭✭mrgardener


    cowzerp wrote: »
    Also with all the Roach love going on, part of why he rarely loses is he is well known for picking fights that suit, him and Arum together..

    Name a fighter at "world class" level that doesn't handpick opponents?


  • Registered Users Posts: 254 ✭✭Ghost.


    A good coach/manager should pick fights that suit their fighter to further his career. It wouldnt make much sense to choose to have fights that didnt suit their fighter or if there was a good chance of him losing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7 gav_dub100


    mrgardener wrote: »
    Name a fighter at "world class" level that doesn't handpick opponents?

    Andre Ward. Unfortunately he is a rare exception... And most of it so far was enforced by being part of the Super-Six. But taking a fight against Chad Dawson (granted coming down a weight division) after coming through the Super-Six shows supreme confidence in his ability!


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,218 ✭✭✭Henno30


    Not sure if we can know how good a coach Roger is. He's working with the most naturally gifted and talented fighter of his generation. I get the feeling PBF really does his own thing and it wouldn't matter who trained him. After that theres not that much evidence to suggest Roger is a great trainer..

    Roger himself has admitted this.

    gav_dub100 wrote: »
    Firstly the Pac-Bradley fight was daylight robbery so shouldn't be part of the discussion.

    The Pac-JMM fights probably should be though.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 25,953 ✭✭✭✭kryogen


    mrgardener wrote: »
    Name a fighter at "world class" level that doesn't handpick opponents?

    Vitali Klitschko
    Wladamir Klitschko

    They will fight anybody, they have fought all comers and this is something that can not be disputed. If someone wants a go they beat them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,986 ✭✭✭Spazdarn


    Carl Froch is another who'll fight just about anyone...

    Dropping Roach won't make Khan any less of an idiot.

    He fights without fear which is commendable but he's not fighting to his strengths and he's lost two key battles recently because of it.


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