[asdasd]

The online etymology dictionary says not

http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=shanty

Claims that it is from the French Canadian: Chantier.

I would think, however, that the fact that the Irish for old house [Sean Tigh] exactly transliterates as Shanty , would tell in it's favour.

Why would a builders house, or a log cabin be the source of a word for an decrepit building - since either could be fairly nicely appointed.

OTH, I suppose, you could argue that shanty towns are new buildings, not old. But the term Sean Tigh was often used for decrepit buildings.

[Hagar]

Chantier in French means works or work site, it may stem from be the temporary housing associated with some type of work like laying roads, railways, forestry etc. Typically shanty towns are occupied by poor migrant workers so that strengthens the link I think

[gizmo555]

The Concise Oxford Dictionary says the word is of 19th C North American origin and gives the same etymology as the website you reference.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_cognate

[Hagar]

Quite possibly linked to the French-Canadian forestry industry.

[enda1]

Originally Posted by Hagar

Quite possibly linked to the French-Canadian forestry industry.

I'd be thinking either this or else the trapping industry (Hudson's Bay Company) where trading posts were set up on the trapping routes that were little more than modern day shanty towns. Though they spoke English... Maybe be French referred to their settlements like this is a perhaps derogatory way?

[franc 91]

I think it comes very simply from the French word - chanter or chanté (to sing or sung) - (and Wikipedia agrees with me). In French it's called - un chant de marin and there are some that have come directly from English into French - Le Père Winslow for example.

[mathepac]

Originally Posted by asdasd

...I would think, however, that the fact that the Irish for old house [Sean Tigh] exactly transliterates as Shanty , would tell in it's favour...

Except the Irish for old house is not Sean Tigh. In Irish the adjective comes after the noun i.e. big house = tigh (or teach) mhor

[slowburner]

Originally Posted by mathepac

Except the Irish for old house is not Sean Tigh. In Irish the adjective comes after the noun i.e. big house = tigh (or teach) mhor

An tí mór/an tí beag, yes.
But you wouldn't say "An tí sean", you'd say 'An sean tí" - wouldn't you??
(even if spelled incorrectly)

[mathepac]

Originally Posted by slowburner

...
But you wouldn't say "An tí sean", you'd say 'An sean tí" - wouldn't you??
...

Why, this is Irish, not "everything-obeys-its-own-rules- English, don'cha know"?

AFAIK the only time an adjective precedes a noun in Irish is when you are making a new compound word which becomes a new noun. e.g. maragadh = market, all = giant or big, da bhri sinn, allmaragadh (or even allmharagadh?) = supermarket.

[tac foley]

Originally Posted by Hagar

Quite possibly linked to the French-Canadian forestry industry.

I've just asked my Quebécoise sister-in-law, a professor of comparative linguistics, about this word, and she told me that it was derived from one of the more widely-used Quebéc French dialects to denote a temporary lumbercamp - chantiers - note that is was always used in the plural. She should know - her father ran a lumber haulage trucking business up-river from Montréal for about forty years.

Of course, there is always the possibility that she is talking a load of total carp - we never got on in the last thirty years, even though I'm the only other French-speaker in our family.

Edit - I got called back at three this morning by Marie-Christine to tell me that 'chantiers' were a kind of a crane used to move lumber about. SHE didn't care about waking me up - we have a mutual loathing of each other, just like any self-respecting Canadians of two different cultures.

tac

[franc 91]

I made a mistake, I thought you were talking about the songs sailors sing (or sung) and the man who led the singing - you're talking about buildings.
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=shanty

[Janey_Mac]

Originally Posted by mathepac

Why, this is Irish, not "everything-obeys-its-own-rules- English, don'cha know"?

AFAIK the only time an adjective precedes a noun in Irish is when you are making a new compound word which becomes a new noun. e.g. maragadh = market, all = giant or big, da bhri sinn, allmaragadh (or even allmharagadh?) = supermarket.

"Sean", like "droch", is an Irish adjective that always (or at least in every instance I've ever come across) attaches and makes a compound word, appearing before the noun it describes and not after.

To say "the old road" in Irish, *an bóthar sean is incorrect; it's an seanbhóthar.

[Enkidu]

Yes, sean always attaches to the front of a word. Old house would be seanteach, often spelled "sean-teach" or "sean teach". Tí is the genitive case of teach and tigh is the dative, so:

doras an tseantí = the door of the old house
ar an seantigh = on the old house

It's unlikely English would borrow a genitive or dative form, so the word is not from Irish.

[tac foley]

Ah - 'chantiers' - a manually-operated gantry crane used in the logging industry. A 'plural' word, like scissors, trousers, gallows.

SHE has spoged.

tac

[Duggys Housemate]

Originally Posted by Enkidu

Yes, sean always attaches to the front of a word. Old house would be seanteach, often spelled "sean-teach" or "sean teach". Tí is the genitive case of teach and tigh is the dative, so:

doras an tseantí = the door of the old house
ar an seantigh = on the old house

It's unlikely English would borrow a genitive or dative form, so the word is not from Irish.

Good point.