[the-jojo-axiom]

Just watched the second part, and the geneticists finally pinned their flags to the mast. There was too much faffing about by them in the first part, a lot of generalising about population movement in prehistory that didn't really answer the brief they were given.

Surprised RTE didn't get a Prehistorian on to explain the shifts of culture evident in archaeology during the Iron Age and the start of the early medieval that probably spurred the divergence.... namely the rise of territoriality and land ownership in the Iron Age as well as the increasing importance of pastoral agriculture at the dawn of the early medieval c400-500. Could have actually offered a few answers, rather than leaving it hanging, but that's RTE for you.

[looksee]

I got the impression that theywere saying that the results would have to be investigated in much more detail before they could come up with any further information. It would be a bit pointless giving 'answers' if they don't have any yet. The whole point was that they were investigating blood lines, rather than other historical research.

Research costs money. RTE got their programme out of it, now presumably it will have to wait until someone sponsors more investigation.

[the-jojo-axiom]

Originally Posted by looksee

I got the impression that theywere saying that the results would have to be investigated in much more detail before they could come up with any further information. It would be a bit pointless giving 'answers' if they don't have any yet. The whole point was that they were investigating blood lines, rather than other historical research.

Research costs money. RTE got their programme out of it, now presumably it will have to wait until someone sponsors more investigation.

Who said anything about historical research? All they needed to do was have a Prehistorian on to give an informed opinion on the possible reasons for such a significant cultural change. It wouldn't have taken any amount of research or funding, as there's plenty already done on the period in question. Hell, anyone with a degree in Irish archaeology or anthropology could give plenty sound bites on it for free.
The pollen diagrams for the Iron Age show a disruption in agriculture probably due to environmental factors; the forcing of the nomadic populations to move on from areas being divided between groups in terms of territories, etc. etc. Loads of theories could have been put out there and driven interest in the question within the archaeology and anthropology profession.

Lack of joined-up thinking by producers is the problem, clearly. Ah well, was a good enough couple of programs despite its shallow dipping-of-toes into the more interesting aspects of genetics and cultural change.

[slowburner]

Originally Posted by the-jojo-axiom

Who said anything about historical research? All they needed to do was have a Prehistorian on to give an informed opinion on the possible reasons for such a significant cultural change. It wouldn't have taken any amount of research or funding, as there's plenty already done on the period in question. Hell, anyone with a degree in Irish archaeology or anthropology could give plenty sound bites on it for free.
The pollen diagrams for the Iron Age show a disruption in agriculture probably due to environmental factors; the forcing of the nomadic populations to move on from areas being divided between groups in terms of territories, etc. etc. Loads of theories could have been put out there and driven interest in the question within the archaeology and anthropology profession.

Lack of joined-up thinking by producers is the problem, clearly. Ah well, was a good enough couple of programs despite its shallow dipping-of-toes into the more interesting aspects of genetics and cultural change.

Why go back as far as the Iron Age? Wasn't it concluded that the 'divergence' occurred much later?
Interesting though.

[Cat Melodeon]

I also enjoyed the program. It made a refreshing change from the sensationalist sorts of portrayals of Travellers we usually see. It's not often that producers bother to go in to real Travellers' homes or show them relaxed in normal social settings. The folks that Francis Barrett met in the course of the show are much more like the Travellers I know, normal decent Travellers, than anything I've seen on tv before. It's very rare I say this but well done RTE. It nearly made up for the crime that is Tubridy et al's paychecks.

[slowburner]

Not so sure that RTE should get the credit for the production, maybe for commissioning and airing. It was an independent production - 'Scratch Productions' - to the best of my memory.

[Cat Melodeon]

Originally Posted by slowburner

Not so sure that RTE should get the credit for the production, maybe for commissioning and airing. It was an independent production - 'Scratch Productions' - to the best of my memory.

True! Credit where it's due, Scratch Films have made some pretty decent documentaries before, too. Well done them.
http://www.scratchfilms.com/about-2/

[the-jojo-axiom]

Originally Posted by slowburner

Why go back as far as the Iron Age? Wasn't it concluded that the 'divergence' occurred much later?
Interesting though.

No, they said 1000-2000 y.a., or basically "we've a very rough idea", so the Iron Age would have to be in there too.

[skylock]

I agree its a pity they had no one of that calibre on it would have been more intresting

[Mn81]

Originally Posted by SafeSurfer

Does anyone know what the theme music to the Blood of the Travelers is?

I'm curious to know this myself, did you find out?

[fontanalis]

Originally Posted by slowburner

I found the documentary fascinating but inconclusive. Travellers became a genetically distinct group within the Irish population between 1 and 2 thousand years ago - that's a conclusion of massive significance.
It's just a pity that historians weren't included. A historical description of what was going on within that (wide) time frame would have made the programme complete.
Maybe there will be a second documentary which will look at the events which caused the genetic divergence of the travellers.

I didn't see the show but I read that one of the dna samples was M222 which is associated with the Ui Niall/Connachta dynasty and is carried by approx 25% of Irish males.
From what I read about the show and of others interpretations they aren't all that different from irish people and any differences are due to marrying within their own "community".