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Legalize Cannabis Ireland

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 16,391 ✭✭✭✭mikom


    qrrgprgua wrote: »


    Health service has enough problems without adding more.

    One word.......... soapbar.
    Two words....... glass shavings.

    Both caused by prohibition.

    If you cared anything about the health service and the health of the nation then you would be well aware of these.

    Enjoy googling....


  • Site Banned Posts: 2,037 ✭✭✭paddyandy


    mikom wrote: »
    Heroin addicts are going to have a hard time getting cannabis into their syringes...........

    #scaremongering



    Now you said it.

    A lot of bad things begin with a bit of 'innocent' fun . Cannabis and Heroin are never far away from each other and you know that very well Mikom .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 16,391 ✭✭✭✭mikom


    paddyandy wrote: »
    Cannabis and Heroin are never far away from each other and you know that very well Mikom .

    Cannabis and Heroin are a million miles away from each other in almost every way.
    Care to enlighten the readers as to how you believe Cannabis and Heroin are never far away from each other.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,695 ✭✭✭StupidLikeAFox


    qrrgprgua wrote: »
    Constructive arguments against cannabis:-

    1. The illegality of cannabis deters over 60% of children from using them.
    2. Cannabis is illegal because it is dangerous, not dangerous it is illegal.
    3. As with Alcohol, Cannabis impairs a person from Driving.
    4. It is irresponsible and stupid to make Cannabis freely available to add to the misery and tragic consequences caused by the 2 we already have, alcohol and tobacco.
    5. No going to stop drug dealers... They just move on to the next drug.
    6. In every country where the laws have been relaxed, drug use has increased.
    7. It also makes people depressed or anxious.

    Some of you're ridiculous points here have been addressed but I thought I'd like to counter:

    Constructive arguments for the legalisation of cannabis:
    1. It would mean that cannabis, a widely used drug, would now only be available from a medical professional - not your local neighbourhood drug dealer. This would mean that you know exactly what you were smoking and quality could be monitored
    2. It eliminates a significant amount criminal activity, hitting criminals where it hurts - in their pockets
    3. People who choose to smoke cannabis responsibly do not have to fund criminal activities or support criminals
    4. If cannabis was legalised by way of some sort of licensing system it would allow the health services a direct point of contact with drug users. This would provide huge benefits in monitoring a drug users health (mental and physical), educating the user on the effects of the drug. It would allow them a unique opportunity to tackle addiction before it happens, something which current drug dealers don't really invest in
    5. This is the one thing that opponents dont really see for some reason - IT WOULD ALLOW THE HEALTH SERVICES TO REDUCE DRUG ABUSE! Years and years of prohibition have failed to do this but it can be achieved if we manage to take control of the "supply side". This is sort of similar to the last point, but it cannot be stressed enough that decriminalisation of cannabis should be seen as a strategic decision to tackle drug problems.

    Thats not even taking into account the financial benefits. Compare the situations

    Current: I meet a drug dealer on a dark corner. I dont really know what exactly Im buying. I could get beaten or mugged, I am funding criminal activities. As I smoke some cannabis nobody knows or cares how much Im smoking. I don't even know myself what effects it is having as the drug dealer never mentioned anything about it.

    Potential: I go to see a health professional. I get a physical and mental assessment and do a half day course of the dangers of drugs. I receive a license and am allowed to buy some cannabis at my local pharmacy. Here the pharmacist can advise me some more on the dangers of different drugs I am choosing to smoke. A year later I can go back to renew my license where again I am assessed. Throughout my life my drug use can be monitored as I am in constant contact with medical professionals. My old drug dealer is lonely on the corner because business has dropped off, but if he decides to go into other criminal activity this is harder because there are more Garda resources available to put in to tackling criminals. Decades later I *might* need to go into hospital (which in the previous situation would have happened anyway) but luckily the health service is not as stretched for the last few decades as my tax dollars have been put into the Exchequer and it has been better off by about €400m odd euro a year since!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,725 ✭✭✭charlemont


    paddyandy wrote: »
    A lot of bad things begin with a bit of 'innocent' fun . Cannabis and Heroin are never far away from each other and you know that very well Mikom .

    That's brought a tear to my eye. :p


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  • Site Banned Posts: 2,037 ✭✭✭paddyandy


    Charlemont : I must have hit the right spot ..........
    ...... Too much long winded obfuscated posting on this thread .The problems with drugs are really simple and very very bad .


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,907 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams


    there is no more a link between canabis and heroin then cigars and heroin....

    I've seen heroin once in my life because of canabis and i see heroin daily outside the window here in work.

    Good talk on this this morning on newstalk. Olaf tyranson and ex TD pat carey...

    basically the reasons for not legalising are understandable, but i would say the reasons for banning alcohol are a lot stronger.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 16,391 ✭✭✭✭mikom


    paddyandy wrote: »
    Charlemont : I must have hit the right spot ..........
    ...... Too much long winded obfuscated posting on this thread .The problems with drugs are really simple and very very bad .

    "But why daddy?"

    "Cos I sez so"

    Hold on a min....
    paddyandy wrote: »
    Ole' English Style Pub with beer from the wood and an open fire on a cold day .Nothing that good will ever happen here though a phony mock-up style is a possibility .The days of real pubs selling real beer are long gone .I returned to some london pubs that i'd worked in during the sixties a few years ago only to discover everything was replaced with a scruffiness that rarely existed back then . A wholesomeness has gone out pubs . The food is nonsense too covered with sauce and grease .Dipping chips in little bowls of sauce says everything about catering these days .We've lost it .

    Ah, it's a drink , not a drug....




    Good talk on this this morning on newstalk. Olaf tyranson and ex TD pat carey...

    The irony of the follow on segment was lost on the presenters.......... it dealt with coffee brewed from beans extracted from wild cat shite.
    Both presenters imbibed the addictive drug that poor peasants rooted around in animal faeces for.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kopi_Luwak

    Vietnamese in growhouses, how are ya.

    This country is upside down.


  • Registered Users Posts: 38 ieoinu


    To legalise cannabis would be crazy. Everyday I see first hand the destruction that this so called 'harmless drug' leaves in its wake. From suicide to psychosis, I have yet to see a positive side to this drug. There seems to be a lot of naive idiots living in a world with blinkers on that argue otherwise, waffling on with excuses to try and justify their own use/addiction. They should try to work in the area and deal with the fallout.

    1. Legalising cannabis with put criminals out of business--- B@::@x it will the criminal fraternity deal in anything that they can turn a buck on whether it is drugs or diesel. Legalising won't stop them, they just won't be paying tax and their product will be cheaper i.e. foreign cigarettes that have the place flooded.

    2. Health benifits--- I have yet to meet somebody who smokes cannabis for genuinely health reasons. I have however met umpteen clowns that feign illnesses such as claiming to have MS etc to justify smoking cannabis. If there are positive aspects to cannabis these should most definitely be explored, extracted and synthesised. If someone is in a lot of pain they are not given an opium pipe to smoke, they are given an measured morphine dose. Again I think it extremely cynical and disingenuous of the pro-cannabis side to try and use people's illnesses to justify their own smoking for pleasure/addictions.

    3. Revenue generating--- If the positive outweighed the negative do you not think this would be done a long time ago.

    4. Cannabis safer than alcohol/cigarettes--- This old chestnut! It is not a nd never will be. Yes most definitely alcohol is abused by many in this country and we are a nation that seems predisposed to addiction/overuse/excess (just look at the Celtic Tiger years). Why in gods name would or should there be more products that can be abused like that made available. I have yet to see a properly functioning cannabis user (most don't ever seem to mature past their mid-teens), The obvious problems associated with cannabis addiction can be similar to alcoholism but the psychosis and mental health issues are far more profound.

    There is a simple example of what happens when drugs are legalised; Head Shops. The country especially the younger generation got totally screwed up. It didn't work. Claiming more regulation etc would solve that is rubbish as we already have a problem with underage drinking. Claiming that their products weren't as 'pure' etc as proper cannabis is also rubbish, if it can be smoked it will be smoked seems to be the abiding motto (same argument could be made about knock off fags, drink etc)

    Basically the pro-cannabis side are putting forward arguments to try to justify their own use and/or addictions by cynically using anecdotal evidence that people who suffer from serious illnesses can see beneficial sides to cannabis. If somebody is terminally ill, in my opinion they should be allowed to smoke or take what they want. That doesn't apply though to some drop out who needs it to 'help him sleep'.


  • Registered Users Posts: 28,042 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    ieoinu wrote: »
    To legalise cannabis would be crazy. Everyday I see first hand the destruction that this so called 'harmless drug' leaves in its wake. From suicide to psychosis, I have yet to see a positive side to this drug.


    So cannabis causes suicide and psychosis in people you meet every day? Newsflash, keeping it illegal is not going to cure suicide, why do you think it's relevant?


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  • Administrators, Computer Games Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 32,074 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Mickeroo


    ieoinu wrote: »
    Basically the pro-cannabis side are putting forward arguments to try to justify their own use and/or addictions by cynically using anecdotal evidence that people who suffer from serious illnesses can see beneficial sides to cannabis. If somebody is terminally ill, in my opinion they should be allowed to smoke or take what they want. That doesn't apply though to some drop out who needs it to 'help him sleep'.

    The irony.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 16,391 ✭✭✭✭mikom


    ieoinu wrote: »
    To legalise cannabis would be crazy. Everyday I see first hand the destruction that this so called 'harmless drug' leaves in its wake. From suicide to psychosis, I have yet to see a positive side to this drug.

    If what you say is true then many have suffered far worse due to prohibition, lack of regulation, and stigma.
    Coming forward for treatment when it may be to late.

    Thanks nanny state.


    ieoinu wrote: »

    Basically the pro-cannabis side are putting forward arguments to try to justify their own use and/or addictions by cynically using anecdotal evidence

    Wait, what?
    ieoinu wrote: »
    Everyday I see first hand the destruction that this so called 'harmless drug' leaves in its wake. From suicide to psychosis, I have yet to see a positive side to this drug.

    Anecdotal you say.
    Anecdotal as in casual observations or indications rather than rigorous or scientific analysis


  • Registered Users Posts: 237 ✭✭Snake Pliisken


    Prohibition fixes nothing and create more problems than it 'fixes', it is a complete failure, drugs are more available now than they ever were. Education and treatment are the only way forward for society, keeping people uninformed about drug use(from sugar to heroin) leads to addiction and crime.

    It's funny to see old claims of the dangers of cannabis that are straight out of Reefer Madness being bandied around here that wouldn't fly on Politics.ie or even After Hours on here. Aswell as the blatant hypocrisies of people enjoying their favourite drug(alcohol) while telling people what drugs they can and can't put in their bodies. Come on Mayo you're lagging behind!

    As long as there isn't a victim, there isn't a crime. If its between consensual adults its none of your business, and you're nothing more than a moralizing busybody. If someone is addicted to drugs, they need your help, not to be locked up.
    1. The illegality of cannabis deters over 60% of children from using them.
    Regulation would allow for a minimum age of use, those 40% who already use it now aren't deterred anyway. At least with regulation they'd have to get around the same obstacles as underage drinking and they wouldn't be smoking adulterated product foisted upon them by the black market.
    2. Cannabis is illegal because it is dangerous, not dangerous it is illegal.
    Cannabis isn't illegal because it's dangerous, it's illegal because the paper industry in America was going to be superseded by the hemp industry. Randolph Hurst(media mogul) lobbied for hemp to be illegal to protect his paper processing plants under the guise of protecting white americans from the doped up **** and mexicans about to defile and rape all the white women, playing on American prejudices. People fell for it and ever since stupid people(and people with vested interests in keeping it illegal) have been parroting 'the dangers of cannabis'.
    Cannabis as it stands is a major finance stream for organised crime, regulation and taxation would not only take the money away from these gangs but also funnel it into education and health programs to inform people how to responsibly use drugs and offset any extra cost to the health system.
    3. As with Alcohol, Cannabis impairs a person from Driving.
    Again, like alcohol there would be laws against driving under the influence and the same social stigma attached.
    4. It is irresponsible and stupid to make Cannabis freely available to add to the misery and tragic consequences caused by the 2 we already have, alcohol and tobacco.
    Stupid people will always misuse drugs, the only way to offset this is through education and harm reduction. Sweeping the problem under the carpet by banning it only leads to the black market and misinformation.
    5. No going to stop drug dealers... They just move on to the next drug.
    They already offer the 'next drug'. Infantilizing adults does nothing but make them resent society and those in power, people should be educated and held responsible for their own actions.
    6. In every country where the laws have been relaxed, drug use has increased.
    I assume you're talking about Holland and Portugal?
    Netherlands
    In the Netherlands 9.5% of young adults (aged 15–34) consume soft drugs once a month, comparable to the level of Finland (8%), Latvia (9,7%) and Norway (9.6%) and less than in the UK (13.8%), Germany (11,9%), Czech Republic (19,3%), Denmark (13,3%), Spain (18.8%), France (16,7%), Slovakia (14,7%) and Italy (20,9%) but higher than in Bulgaria (4,4%), Sweden (4,8%), Poland (5,3%) or Greece (3,2%). The monthly prevalence of drugs other than cannabis among young people (15-24) was 4% in 2004, that was above the average (3%) of 15 compared countries in EU. However, seemingly few transcend to becoming problem drug users (0.30%), well below the average (0.52%) of the same compared countries.
    Source: http://www.emcdda.europa.eu/publications/annual-report/2011 (download the NL pdf).

    Portugal
    Compared to the European Union and the U.S., Portugal's drug use numbers are impressive. Following decriminalization, Portugal had the lowest rate of lifetime marijuana use in people over 15 in the E.U.: 10%. The most comparable figure in America is in people over 12: 39.8%. Proportionally, more Americans have used cocaine than Portuguese have used marijuana.
    The Cato paper reports that between 2001 and 2006 in Portugal, rates of lifetime use of any illegal drug among seventh through ninth graders fell from 14.1% to 10.6%; drug use in older teens also declined. Lifetime heroin use among 16-to-18-year-olds fell from 2.5% to 1.8% (although there was a slight increase in marijuana use in that age group). New HIV infections in drug users fell by 17% between 1999 and 2003, and deaths related to heroin and similar drugs were cut by more than half. In addition, the number of people on methadone and buprenorphine treatment for drug addiction rose to 14,877 from 6,040, after decriminalization, and money saved on enforcement allowed for increased funding of drug-free treatment as well.
    Read more: http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html#ixzz1uTDoas2K

    Either don't talk about something you don't know about or don't spread lies.
    7. It also makes people depressed or anxious.
    Some research suggests that marijuana smokers are diagnosed with depression more often than are nonsmokers — particularly regular or heavy marijuana users. However, it doesn't appear that marijuana directly causes depression. It's likely that the genetic, environmental or other factors that trigger depression also lead to using marijuana. For example, some people may use marijuana as a way to cope with depression symptoms.
    The same can be said for anxiety.
    And as much as the drug in certain cases 'make' people depressed and anxious, it is also used in the treatment of both.


    If you're against legalisation you are either ignorant or you have a vested interest in keeping the status quo.


  • Registered Users Posts: 18 DjDoody


    I dont get why does it bother people if I want to buy weed I mean what gives anyone the right to say i cant.No ones stopping people eating junk food.It doesnt affect anyone else but me.


  • Registered Users Posts: 88 ✭✭jojo86


    1. Legalizing it wouldn't mean everyone started smoking it all of a sudden. I don't smoke it, if it were legal I would continue to chose not to. Same as some people chose to smoke cigarettes, some not. Some choose to drink, some not.
    2. I think the main problem with it not being legal is that if a person who is a great member of society, works, pays taxes, pays for tax/insurance and everything in between, if that person decided that to unwind at the end of the day or on days off by choosing to smoke weed in their home instead of having a few socially acceptable beers than they could be sent to jail. I don't think that's right. We have genuine criminals in this country; real scumbags, murderers, rapists etc who deserve to be locked up for life yet can spend less time in jail than some young guy or girl who smoked a joint. Is that right?
    See the weed smokers are not violent or dangerous people in general they are easy going. And I don't think it's right that someone who is 99.9% good and law abiding deserves to go to jail due to 0.1% of law breaking, buying some weed. I mean if its ok to smoke cigarettes and ok to drink toxic stuff like whiskey or vodka which can do liver damage, cause people to be violent etc what's the harm in letting the people who want to smoke weed do so? Have it so they can only do it at home, I don't think they'd care.
    Alot of people who smoke don't go out drinking and stuff they'd rather relax at home.
    I mean if you chose not to smoke it then why would it effect you? Same as smoking a cigarette, if you chose not to does that mean you worry about the fact loads of others do or could you care less?
    Basically, I think it's a fear of the unknown. Educate.


  • Site Banned Posts: 2,037 ✭✭✭paddyandy


    There is no end to this kind of thread .It's all being said many times before there is no good argument for dope being freely available and a mere glance at the papers will tell you that on any day of the week. But vested interests are here on this thread i'm sure .
    Take a walk down Talbot street in Dublin and see the young fellahs with death written on their faces .....your area could resemble talbot street if some people have their way .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 16,391 ✭✭✭✭mikom


    paddyandy wrote: »
    Take a walk down Talbot street in Dublin and see the young fellahs with death written on their faces .....your area could resemble talbot street if some people have their way .

    #scaremongering.

    Pretty bleak world inside your head Paddy.
    God help ya....


  • Registered Users Posts: 18 DjDoody


    paddyandy wrote: »
    a mere glance at the papers will tell you that on any day of the week. .

    I laughed a lot the papers are so full of ****.


  • Registered Users Posts: 74 ✭✭globalwarrior


    Mikom,

    As you correctly pointed out I have gone and got a 4 years degree on the subject.
    I am considered a frontline professioanl working in the field.
    Hence, some might say I have earned the right to an opinion.

    My views are aligned with the vast majority of other professionals who like myself
    witness the devastation daily and are faced with the task of assisting
    victims in putting their lives back together.

    So, frankly, coming on here and reading about ones legal right to a "high” seems more
    than a little silly to me and ...

    if you cannot understand where I am coming from thats fine :))


  • Site Banned Posts: 2,037 ✭✭✭paddyandy


    Global Warrior: Some are not here to understand anything but are part of a leftie
    drive .They are Nihilists who are hopeless in their outlook on life .Maybe help is what they need .There are 'Business' people here too .


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  • Registered Users Posts: 74 ✭✭globalwarrior


    Ahhhhh....

    ok - thanks for the heads up :)


  • Site Banned Posts: 2,037 ✭✭✭paddyandy


    mikom wrote: »
    #scaremongering.

    Pretty bleak world inside your head Paddy.
    God help ya....

    Bleaker still on Talbot Street .....the walking dead are there all the time .Young Fellahs
    who look 50 or 60 but could be 30 . Young skeletal women as well with flesh eaten away by drugs ....it's disgusting Mikom....and you are no friend of anybody's advocating the very stuff they probably began with and now they are waiting to die . What do you say now
    to their relatives ?.BOARDS.IE posts will be archived for a very long time ...to future Generations what do you say to them . To those as they leave the Graveside what will you say ??????


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 16,391 ✭✭✭✭mikom


    paddyandy wrote: »
    Global Warrior: Some are not here to understand anything but are part of a leftie
    drive .They are Nihilists who are hopeless in their outlook on life .

    Hopeless in their outlook on life you say.

    Depressive posts ahoy....
    paddyandy wrote: »
    Nobody should envy anybody because we all get it in the end ....if not sooner then later .
    paddyandy wrote: »
    Well you leftie nationalists who hate england .Now you know why they used to have
    "No Irish need apply" on ads. for accomodation in london in the 60s . We behaved disgracefully .We still do .
    paddyandy wrote: »
    There is a widespread belief that laughter is a sign of happiness .Total Myth . There never was a happy comedian in history and in their lives a lot of misery .Tragic Figures all of them .......and they did a lot of laughing......no?.....well they caused a lot of laughter !
    People in groups do a lot of it and i wonder where is the old pleasure in serious discourse gone ?????? People don't want to look vulnerable so they look amused .
    paddyandy wrote: »
    Our Thoroughfares are draped like Hoors in a red light district .
    paddyandy wrote: »
    My Boiler went like so many things way before it's natural demise because it was planned that way .Everything we buy has PLANNED failure built into it .A light Bulb can last 50 years ...no problem and is a typical example of why we need so much money these days .

    Allow crime to rise and the price of property goes up with other industries appearing out of nowhere .It's a false idea mostly kept alive by widespread apathy .
    paddyandy wrote: »
    Don't Worry be Happy ......life is for fun .....and lotza other nonsenses from the teen years .

    #darkcloud

    If I were you I would seek professional help.
    Maybe globalwarrior will give you a freebie...
    paddyandy wrote: »
    Bleaker still on Talbot Street .....the walking dead are there all the time .Young Fellahs
    who look 50 or 60 but could be 30 . Young skeletal women as well with flesh eaten away by drugs ....it's disgusting Mikom....and you are no friend of anybody's advocating the very stuff they probably began with and now they are waiting to die . What do you say now
    to their relatives ?.BOARDS.IE posts will be archived for a very long time ...to future Generations what do you say to them . To those as they leave the Graveside what will you say ??????

    *adopts paddyandy voice*

    Young Fellahs and women . Top yerselves now . Life is sh1t and we are just waiting to die .


    Based on the songs and the stories, heroes of reknown
    Are the passing tales and glories that once was Dublin town.
    The hallowed halls and houses, the haunting children's rhymes
    Are part of what was Dublin In The Rare Old Times.
    Ring-a-ring-rosie, as the light declines
    I remember Dublin city in the rare old times.♫


  • Registered Users Posts: 18 DjDoody


    paddyandy wrote: »
    Global Warrior: Some are not here to understand anything but are part of a leftie
    drive .They are Nihilists who are hopeless in their outlook on life .Maybe help is what they need .There are 'Business' people here too .

    In what way are we "Nihilists who are hopeless in their outlook on life".Many great successful people were and are regular smokers of weed.Thomas Jefferson and George Washington smoked a lot weed in fact most of the founding fathers of the U.S. smoked weed even the declaration of Independance was made from Hemp.We are not mindless addicts looking for our next fix like you may think.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 13,874 ✭✭✭✭PogMoThoin


    DjDoody wrote: »
    In what way are we "Nihilists who are hopeless in their outlook on life".Many great successful people were and are regular smokers of weed.Thomas Jefferson and George Washington smoked a lot weed in fact most of the founding fathers of the U.S. smoked weed even the declaration of Independance was made from Hemp.We are not mindless addicts looking for our next fix like you may think.

    Richard Branson is one of the biggest campaigners for the end to the war on drugs.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/9031855/Its-time-to-end-the-failed-war-on-drugs.html

    You dirty pothead Richard, No hoper, Get a life!!


  • Site Banned Posts: 2,037 ✭✭✭paddyandy


    DjDoody wrote: »
    In what way are we "Nihilists who are hopeless in their outlook on life".Many great successful people were and are regular smokers of weed.Thomas Jefferson and George Washington smoked a lot weed in fact most of the founding fathers of the U.S. smoked weed even the declaration of Independance was made from Hemp.We are not mindless addicts looking for our next fix like you may think.

    Typical whataboutery .A few isolated cases of nuttiness exists in any profession .
    I never even implied that you are addicts ...more likely worse ....Advocates of Evil .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 16,391 ✭✭✭✭mikom


    paddyandy wrote: »
    I never implied even that you are addicts ...more likely worse ....Advocates of Evil .

    Sounds like the "axis of evil"
    That was a load of shite too........... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axis_of_evil
    You are in good company Paddy.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 16,391 ✭✭✭✭mikom


    PogMoThoin wrote: »
    Richard Branson is one of the biggest campaigners for the end to the war on drugs.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/9031855/Its-time-to-end-the-failed-war-on-drugs.html

    You dirty pothead Richard, No hoper, Get a life!!

    Keep an eye out for this stoner during the Olympics also.........

    MICHAEL+PHELPS.jpg

    phelpsmarijuana-500x666.jpg

    Scum, subhuman scum.........


  • Registered Users Posts: 18 DjDoody


    paddyandy wrote: »
    Typical whataboutery .A few isolated cases of nuttiness exists in any profession .
    I never even implied that you are addicts ...more likely worse ....Advocates of Evil .

    Explain to me in what way we are "Advocates of Evil"


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  • Registered Users Posts: 237 ✭✭Snake Pliisken


    paddyandy wrote: »
    There is no end to this kind of thread .It's all being said many times before there is no good argument for dope being freely available and a mere glance at the papers will tell you that on any day of the week. But vested interests are here on this thread i'm sure .
    Take a walk down Talbot street in Dublin and see the young fellahs with death written on their faces .....your area could resemble talbot street if some people have their way .

    In the same newspapers you'll see all these horrific stories about fat people too. Should we ban sugar?
    Newspapers sensationalize to sell more papers and push their owner's agendas, oftentimes acting as nothing more than a mouth piece for those in power. Maybe you should look for information yourself instead of accepting what's dropped at your feet.
    What would all those 'young fellas with death on their faces' be doing 50 years ago, before heroin(not cannabis, the drug that we're debating here) became the drug of poverty? They'd be making the same life decisions, except with whiskey or gin, alcohol's arguably a more harmful drug. These people have fallen through the cracks of a society to big and obsessed about itself to care, there have always been people like this, usually born poor, uneducated or abused in childhood and in a city of over a million individuals, how can you think there wouldn't be a contingent?
    These 'walking dead' are completely removed from the values that you hold so dear and their lives are so miserable to start with that they decide to dissolve themselves in opiates to combat the abusive world around them.
    People know what hard drugs do to the body and mind. People who care about themselves don't take heroin, but these people feel worthless.
    The only way to nullify this problem is by making these people feel some self worth through education.

    Anyway, these people are abusing hard drugs, not cannabis. If you're going to lump all drugs together as if they have the same effect we should be banning drink, bacon fries and bronchodilators because the only thing they have in common is that they effect the body's chemistry.
    Mikom,

    As you correctly pointed out I have gone and got a 4 years degree on the subject.
    I am considered a frontline professioanl working in the field.
    Hence, some might say I have earned the right to an opinion.

    My views are aligned with the vast majority of other professionals who like myself
    witness the devastation daily and are faced with the task of assisting
    victims in putting their lives back together.

    So, frankly, coming on here and reading about ones legal right to a "high” seems more
    than a little silly to me and ...

    if you cannot understand where I am coming from thats fine :))

    Of course someone in the business of helping people with addiction is surrounded by all kinds of addicts on a daily basis, just like someone who works at the dole would be surrounded by the unemployed. These people have definite problems and need to be helped- but that's no reason to stop me from smoking cannabis(I haven't actually partook in a quite while now).
    I am an adult citizen of Ireland and I don't need to be treated like i'm in Montessori, I can make my own decisions. Part of the reason why people have no respect for those who govern them is because they are lying; the internet created free access to uncensored information for anyone who wants to educate themselves and this creates conflict.

    In a perfect world, no one would feel the need to abuse any drugs, from food to opiates but that's not possible. People are always going to get high, so provide them with the cleanest possible product and educate them on how to moderate and reduce harm.

    If they need help, help them. If they commit a non-sumptuary crime, prosecute them on that. But ffs don't moralize and judge them for putting some plant smoke in their bodies.


    This might be of interest to you and your field and any reasonable person interested in the topic, it's a review of the justice system and a compassionate view of addiction by the Episcopalian priest and philosopher Alan Watts from the 1970's(nothing much has changed since then, it still has as much relevancy as it did back then). Well worth the time to any intelligent human being.


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