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Bristol bus driver 'used vehicle as a weapon' to ram cyclist off road.

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,830 ✭✭✭doozerie


    Pkiernan wrote: »
    2. The Law of the Jungle: The cyclist was clearing escalating the situation, and winding up the driver. Cyclist got what he deserved too - in this case fractured legs. Next time, he probably won't try to tangle with a 10 ton bus. FACT - Very stupid behaviour has very dire consequences.

    Even though I cycle to work daily, I had a good laugh at this video.

    FACT - your moral compass is fooked.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 193 ✭✭cbl593h


    Well that was a nice bunfight I didn't mean to start !!!

    Sourlemonz has it right and beat me to the draw. Until there's registration and insurance the cycling lobby/nazis will fight this "struggle" versus the tax paying motorist. That bus has reg plates,all yer man had to was make the call to either the feds or to the bus company. But no,"we are cyclists and we are tough" applied. Someone said somewhere "have you ever seen a cyclist with a headcam who isn't angry......".


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,071 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    cbl593h wrote: »
    Well that was a nice bunfight I didn't mean to start !!!

    Sourlemonz has it right and beat me to the draw. Until there's registration and insurance the cycling lobby/nazis will fight this "struggle" versus the tax paying motorist. That bus has reg plates,all yer man had to was make the call to either the feds or to the bus company. But no,"we are cyclists and we are tough" applied. Someone said somewhere "have you ever seen a cyclist with a headcam who isn't angry......".

    Seioursly, again, with so much over the top, it's hard to tell if this is for real or a parody.... Just in case...

    He had a headcam? Where does it say that? And there are plenty of cyclists who use helmet cams who are not "angry", and anyway people tend to rightly or wrongly get angry when somebody else hits them or attempts to knock them down.

    He was going to call the bus company or the police over a close pass? Lol! What do you think they would have done?

    Why did the apparently professional bus driver not turn off his engine and call the police?

    Most important: Why are you defending somebody who used a bus to knock another person down?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,041 ✭✭✭cocoshovel


    I agree cyclists can be egotistical pain in the fúcking arse when driving, and when I cycle I am totally submissive to traffic etc. Not because I am afraid of them, but because I dont feel the need to try own the road when I clearly take up far less space than everyone else and dont have to hold up traffic.

    Anyhow, some of the posts in the thread are outright ridiculous and alarming to say the least. You come across as a right bunch of irrational nutjobs.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,315 ✭✭✭Pkiernan


    doozerie wrote: »
    FACT - your moral compass is fooked.

    FACT - I am not stupid enough to tangle with a 10 ton bus.

    Obviously, the cyclists moral compass was not enough to stop him getting knocked into the gutter like a piece of rubbish.

    The cyclist was 46 years old, surprised he lived that long being so stupid.

    Mess with the bull - get the horns.


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  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,071 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    Pkiernan wrote: »
    doozerie wrote: »
    FACT - your moral compass is fooked.

    FACT - I am not stupid enough to tangle with a 10 ton bus.

    Obviously, the cyclists moral compass was not enough to stop him getting knocked into the gutter like a piece of rubbish.

    The cyclist was 46 years old, surprised he lived that long being so stupid.

    Mess with the bull - get the horns.

    Wow! You're blaiming the victim again!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    monument wrote: »
    Wow! You're blaiming the victim again!

    well he is at least aprtly to blame is he not? It's never cut and dried when two fools act like this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 517 ✭✭✭rich.d.berry


    corktina wrote: »
    well he is at least aprtly to blame is he not? It's never cut and dried when two fools act like this.

    And your evidence for this is based on?

    I saw nothing in the verdict statement that apportions any blame to the cyclist. The only one going to jail is the bus driver.

    I suppose your twisted logic would include a statement about a rape case and sentencing something like this:

    "Well, if she hadn't worn that short skirt then there would not have been the temptation for him to rape her. She is at least partly to blame!"


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    did you not see the video or what?

    The cyclist was clearly attempting to stop the bus passing , reportedly as an escaltion of whatever nonsense had been going on at the lights previously.

    It takes two to tango


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,644 ✭✭✭SerialComplaint


    corktina wrote: »

    The cyclist was clearly attempting to stop the bus passing

    How did you come to that conclusion? Where do you expect him to cycle - in the gutter?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 310 ✭✭Dowee


    I'm genuinely disgusted by the number of people on here defending the actions of the bus driver.

    It doesn't matter what the hell the cyclist did, swerving, delaying a bus by a couple of seconds etc. he did not deserve to be hit by a bus. It may not have been a wise decision to tangle with the bus but that is largely irrelevant.

    If I threw a snowball at a farmer with a shotgun and he turned around and shot me, by your logic I deserved it!! Think about it folks. Yes, annoying someone with a shotgun mightn't be wise, but the punishment of being shot is possibly slightly over the top, no?

    You people really need to consider some of the analogies mentioned above and look past the fact that this is a motorists V's cyclist issue in your minds.


  • Registered Users Posts: 310 ✭✭Dowee


    corktina wrote: »
    did you not see the video or what?

    The cyclist was clearly attempting to stop the bus passing , reportedly as an escaltion of whatever nonsense had been going on at the lights previously.

    It takes two to tango

    So what if he was trying to stop him passing? Maybe I missed the class where it was explained that stopping a bus passing results in being ok to be hit by said bus.

    Last I knew, tangoing didn't involve being side swiped by a bus, I guess I'm out of touch these days, I must be getting old.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,071 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    corktina wrote: »
    did you not see the video or what?

    The cyclist was clearly attempting to stop the bus passing , reportedly as an escaltion of whatever nonsense had been going on at the lights previously.

    It takes two to tango

    Given that you are so blind by the cyclist/ motorist thing, try answering this one:

    If a cyclist gets annoyed with a motorist and then pulls the motorist out of their car or bus or whatever and beats the living daylights out of them, would your view still be "it takes two to tango"?

    How is it acceptance to attack somebody using a bus just because they annoyed you?


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,295 ✭✭✭n97 mini


    monument wrote: »
    Given that you are so blind by the cyclist/ motorist thing, try answering this one:
    Jeez everyone on this thread has problems with their eyesight, except you.

    The cyclist decided to tango with a bus and came out the worse off for it. Seriously, I'd have sympathy for him if he wasn't acting the bolix, but he was.


  • Registered Users Posts: 310 ✭✭Dowee


    n97 mini wrote: »
    The cyclist decided to tango with a bus and came out the worse off for it. Seriously, I'd have sympathy for him if he wasn't acting the bolix, but he was.

    Out of interest do you have a line beyond which you consider someone to have gone too far in dealing out retribution to someone else who was "acting the bollix"?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    the point is the Bus Driver got his just deserts for having an insane temper tantrum BUT had the cylists not been acting the maggot, it would never have happened. I haven't read anyone defending the bus drivers insane behaviour.


  • Registered Users Posts: 310 ✭✭Dowee


    corktina wrote: »
    the point is the Bus Driver got his just deserts for having an insane temper tantrum BUT had the cylists not been acting the maggot, it would never have happened. I haven't read anyone defending the bus drivers insane behaviour.

    Not that I agree with you that this is the point at all, but to take you logic back a step, the cyclist wouldn't have been "acting the maggot" if the bus driver had given him enough room at the previous junction.

    Not too difficult to poke holes in your logic is it?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    I have watched this video several times and the first thing that stands out is that the bus driver appears to have been attempting to "race" the cyclist to a traffic signal (with an ASL) that was going to be red by the time either of them got to it. There was no way the bus driver could lawfully get in frontof any reasonably fit cyclist and then hope to stay in front in the space and time available.

    While in law you may not unreasonably obstruct another road user, there is to my knowledge no obligation on any road user to indulge another in a manifestly pointless overtaking exercise.

    Also it seems to me that the cyclist may have been attempting to merge into the right turn lane.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 22,346 Mod ✭✭✭✭bk


    I don't know, watching the video, it looks to me that he is trying to get away from the bus, perhaps to move into the right hand turning lane and go right.

    Even if he wasn't, nothing justifies doing this, NOTHING.

    Anyone who says otherwise has a seriously fecked up moral compass.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    Dowee wrote: »
    Not that I agree with you that this is the point at all, but to take you logic back a step, the cyclist wouldn't have been "acting the maggot" if the bus driver had given him enough room at the previous junction.

    Not too difficult to poke holes in your logic is it?

    nope, but it doesnt make me wrong though.

    Behaviour of the sort shown by both of them has no place on the roads.

    .


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  • Registered Users Posts: 517 ✭✭✭rich.d.berry


    Also it seems to me that the cyclist may have been attempting to merge into the right turn lane.

    I agree with everything else except that I doubt he was attempting to merge. It seems pretty obvious to me that the cyclist knew that the bus was there before he moved to his right. You can see him look to his right as the bus comes alongside then he moves to the right.

    My list of possible explanations are:
    • He was shouting something at the bus driver and was trying to maintain eye contact or a close enough position to be heard.
    • The act of looking right caused him to turn right. This is often something that cyclists do involuntarily. There is even advice to look where you want to go.
    • He was riding to defend the lane and gain as much space as he could so that the bus could not pass him in the lane and squeeze him into the gutter.

    Something that the "he was acting the bollix" brigade have failed to recognise is that the preceding verbal interchange between the cyclist and the bus driver may have included threats of violence. Perhaps something like, "If you don't get out the middle of the road then I'll force you to ride where you belong". There are a number of times I've heard similar sentiments expressed at me. For this reason I would assume the last option to be the most likely. Especially since, as you already pointed out, the light had changed and the bus had no way of completing the overtake in the space available.


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,071 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    n97 mini wrote: »
    monument wrote: »
    Given that you are so blind by the cyclist/ motorist thing, try answering this one:
    Jeez everyone on this thread has problems with their eyesight, except you.

    The cyclist decided to tango with a bus and came out the worse off for it. Seriously, I'd have sympathy for him if he wasn't acting the bolix, but he was.

    Try answering the questions? Or is there something wrong with your eyesight?...

    If a cyclist gets annoyed with a motorist and then pulls the motorist out of their car or bus or whatever and beats the living daylights out of them, would your view still be "it takes two to tango"?

    How is it acceptance to attack somebody using a bus just because they annoyed you?
    corktina wrote: »
    nope, but it doesnt make me wrong though.

    Behaviour of the sort shown by both of them has no place on the roads.

    Could you too please answer the question:

    If a cyclist gets annoyed with a motorist and then pulls the motorist out of their car or bus or whatever and beats the living daylights out of them, would your view still be "it takes two to tango"?

    How is it acceptance to attack somebody using a bus just because they annoyed you?


  • Registered Users Posts: 517 ✭✭✭rich.d.berry


    corktina wrote: »
    nope, but it doesnt make me wrong though.

    Behaviour of the sort shown by both of them has no place on the roads.

    .

    Of course it makes you wrong.

    The cyclist has every right to use as much of the lane as he needs.

    Before striking the cyclist the bus driver gets way too close and drives aggressively, both illegal acts. The cyclist rides to defend his road space. There is nothing that the cyclist does which is illegal.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    maybe it wasnt illegal but ti was extremely stupid

    .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    monument wrote: »
    Could you too please answer the question:

    If a cyclist gets annoyed with a motorist and then pulls the motorist out of their car or bus or whatever and beats the living daylights out of them, would your view still be "it takes two to tango"?

    How is it acceptance to attack somebody using a bus just because they annoyed you?

    i have at no time siad it was acceptable in any way or to any degree for the bus driver to attack the cyclist and he well deserved the punishment he got for a vicious attack
    Merely it is the case that the cyclist was involved in provoking the guy and would have been better advised to steer clear of him, discretion being the better part of valour


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,071 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    corktina wrote: »
    maybe it wasnt illegal but ti was extremely stupid

    Taking the lane was "extremely stupid"? -- Why do you think then that it's part of the UK's cycling training?

    Cycling the the middle of lane, or close to the middle, is advised where there is no way a safe overtake can happen, and, anyway in this case, there was an advance stop line for cyclists and the lights already turned red. Even if the driver did not use the bus as a weapon, there was zero need for the bus to overtake and there was zero sense in trying it.

    corktina wrote: »
    ...Merely it is the case that the cyclist was involved in provoking the guy and would have been better advised to steer clear of him, discretion being the better part of valour

    I'll rephrase the question, and give you other options using words you have used:

    If a cyclist gets annoyed with a motorist and then pulls the motorist out of their car or bus or whatever and beats the living daylights out of them, would your view still be "it takes two to tango", OR would the driver be "partly to blame", OR would the driver have been "involved in provoking" the cyclist?

    These are all terms you have used.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,733 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    i think id better stop feeding them


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,078 ✭✭✭✭LordSutch


    bk wrote: »
    I don't know, watching the video, it looks to me that he is trying to get away from the bus, perhaps to move into the right hand turning lane and go right.

    If he did intend to move into the right hand lane (to turn right), then surely he should have signaled his intention? he must have known the bus was right behind him, so I still stand by my comment in post#5. Maybe they had 'previous' before the video picked tmem up?

    Bus driver deserves to go to jail, but I think there might also be a questionmark overt the cyclists behaviour?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭galwaycyclist


    corktina wrote: »
    i have at no time siad it was acceptable in any way or to any degree for the bus driver to attack the cyclist and he well deserved the punishment he got for a vicious attack
    Merely it is the case that the cyclist was involved in provoking the guy and would have been better advised to steer clear of him, discretion being the better part of valour


    OK two personal experiences.

    1) I am cyling up to a t-junction on a side road intending to turn left, there is a large delivery truck ahead of me signalling the same manouevre. I stop behind the delivery truck in a prominent position to wait my turn. I don't go anywhere near the inside of the truck, I wait in a position that will prevent following drivers from attempting anything that would impede me or endanger me in making my turn when the time comes.

    A motorist pulls up behind me and starts laying on the horn. It transpires that he wishes me to get out of the way so that he can pull up behind the still stationary delivery truck. It is his view that he is entitled to pull forward the 2m and wait there himself. It is his view that I should get out of his way so he can do so.

    2) I am approaching a signalised roundabout intending to turn right. The lights are red and there are three lanes. I take the central lane - being the leftmost lane appropriate for my exit. I am the first to arrive at the stop line, I occupy the centre of the lane because that is the safest place to be and if I don't it may encourage following drivers to "cut past" me going for intervening exits. There is already a white van in the lane to my left - he rolls down his window and asks me if I think I'm some kind of car? "Something like that" I reply and try to avoid further interaction. A blue van pulls up behind me. The lights go green we all pull off - the blue van is giving me plenty of space - I know because I keep checking over either shoulder. The guy in the white van cuts accross into the gap and proceeds to follow me closely around the roundabout revving his engine and beeping his horn.

    Sometimes you can't avoid trouble it comes looking for you anyway.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,295 ✭✭✭n97 mini


    LordSutch wrote: »
    Maybe they had 'previous' before the video picked tmem up?
    They did have a previous:
    The BBC wrote:
    Moments later the bus stopped ... and Mr Mead propped his bike against the front of the vehicle.

    He continued to argue with Hill, who remained in his cab.

    It's also reported that Mead was pulling one of the wipers on the bus.

    If that's not acting the maggot, what is.


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