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The M50 Barrier Free Tolling Thread

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Comments

  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 5,405 Mod ✭✭✭✭spockety


    unkel wrote: »
    If even a minority (who knows, perhaps 20% or 30%) would decide not to pay, the system would collapse.

    A barrier free tolling system might collapse alright, but you can be pretty damn sure that to combat the "civil disobedience" (read: "multi-billion euro loss over 25 years") the government would re-instate toll barriers.

    "We're sorry to have to do this, but it's a significant minority of criminal drivers who are forcing us to do this to the disadvantage of the ordinary decent commuter."


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,218 ✭✭✭markpb


    spadder wrote: »
    Would they have the manpower to ticket everyone?

    It wouldn't require much manpower - I'm sure the billing system automatically issues the late payment notice, the extra fine and then sends a notice to the debt collection agency who will issue a summons and bring them to court. The courts would be the only choke point.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    Im sure these dissobedient truck drivers will be asked to have filthy number plates.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 29,476 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    markpb wrote: »
    It wouldn't require much manpower - I'm sure the billing system automatically issues the late payment notice, the extra fine and then sends a notice to the debt collection agency who will issue a summons and bring them to court. The courts would be the only choke point.
    I doubt they will take anyone to court.


  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Bond-007 wrote: »
    It will never happen. Just the status quo will continue.
    How long will it be before one of the papers does an FOI based report on how many people are avoiding the tolls and some politicians will jump on the bandwagon complaining about the unfairness of the new system?
    spadder wrote: »
    On the news tonight, the truckers spokesman was saying that truckers not going to pay the tolls, what would happen if everyone decided not to pay?

    Would they have the manpower to ticket everyone?
    NTR seem awful anxious about the changeover, bless them.
    My guess is that this is going to be a fiasco to rival e-voting.
    I do feel sorry for them
    They are being forced to use the M50 as they come from the port. Then they pay the new tolls which don't include VAT and they lose the bulk discount that they negotiated with NTR.

    Also remember some people don't have to pay tolls!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 20,788 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    I wanna be a trucker, I'm just a lil guy in my van :pac:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,273 ✭✭✭Morlar


    Bond-007 wrote: »
    I doubt they will take anyone to court.

    I am not so sure - considering they do for non payers of londons congestion charge & the subsequent bumper fees I think they will. Debt collection agencies will not hesitate and the person being brought to court will pay the costs so it costs them (debt collection companies) nothing whatsoever.

    Once the fees start piling up people will start to owe silly money in no time and it will result in court cases as there are some who simply wont be able to or will just refuse to pay in the hopes that it will go away.

    I just noticed today this ;
    http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0826/m50.html

    'While it is legal for retailers to add a surcharge to the toll amount at the Payzone point of sale, the NRA has said this will not happen'

    Considering shops routinely bump their commission on selling things like call credit -ie buy €5.00 call credit in some shops costs you €5.50 does anyone honestly think that if some scumbag shops can add increases to unavoidable items that they wont ? I think if they can then some will. My view on this is that it is the perfect example of rampant greed in Ireland at the moment.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 33 bigtime


    unkel wrote: »
    If even a minority (who knows, perhaps 20% or 30%) would decide not to pay, the system would collapse.

    could not agree more, but remember they will have press releases stating near full compliance even if this did occur.

    If only the ordinary people could come togeather they would overturn a lot of these scams.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,788 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    How can the ordinary people come together?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 29,476 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    By refusing to pay en mass. As said if enough refuse to pay the system will collapse in short order.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 33 bigtime


    Bond-007 wrote: »
    Debt collection agencies have no legal powers to collect said debts. They won't get paid. The Norwegian government tried doing the same and it failed miserably.

    true, the issue is between you and the toll people. Any debt collection agency is a third party and nothing whatsoever to do with the issue at hand.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,788 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    But they'll surely come after some and make an example of them and scare any rebels away?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 33 bigtime


    cormie wrote: »
    How can the ordinary people come together?

    thats the thing. the hauliers have some sort of group already in the form of a union. Also they are in a situation where they have no choice but to rebel against this madness.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 29,476 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    cormie wrote: »
    But they'll surely come after some and make an example of them and scare any rebels away?
    Remember people rebelled against the poll tax in Britain? The system collapsed from all the non payers. In the end it was abolished.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,788 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    Nope:P

    Well, so how did everyone unite together to rebell, that's the thing, 4 million, how do you get us all to agree not to pay? I don't think a thread on boards.ie with a poll will cut it :pac:




  • http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055352654

    ^ already tried nobody really that interested


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,788 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    :(


  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,059 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Bond-007 wrote: »
    Remember people rebelled against the poll tax in Britain? The system collapsed from all the non payers. In the end it was abolished.

    ...and replaced by council tax...

    If the barrier free doesn't work, expect a massive increase in motor tax, basically.


  • Registered Users Posts: 20,788 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    Why wouldn't it work though?


  • Registered Users Posts: 63 ✭✭dbentham


    Just to jump on the ever growing bandwagon - I also think it's an utter disgrace that they are charging extra for these toll tags.
    Thankfully I don't use the M50 that often but nonetheless I always thought that automation meant less staff which in turn should lead to less overheads and therefore cheaper costs to pass onto us - the motorists.
    And as for the abolition of VAT with *NO* reduction to the motorist...........

    Don't get me started :mad:


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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,078 ✭✭✭fenris


    What is the story if you use hire cars?
    The hire companies want to charge €26 for each trip through the toll if you leave it to them, but there doesn't seem to be n option where the tag is not tied to a specific reg.
    I may have missed it but I ave not seen an option that allows you to have a tag and move it between cars.

    So if the toll is about paying for trips through the toll plaza, what the messing about with tightly linking the tag to specific cars?
    #include(conspiracy theory)


  • Registered Users Posts: 44,876 ✭✭✭✭Mitch Connor


    For hire cars, you could pay the €3 online by 8pm the following day, to avoid paying 26(!!) to the rental company.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,218 ✭✭✭markpb


    fenris wrote: »
    So if the toll is about paying for trips through the toll plaza, what the messing about with tightly linking the tag to specific cars?
    #include(conspiracy theory)

    If they didn't link the tag and plate together, you'd be charged twice. Once for the tag and once for the reg plate because there'd be no way for the system to know it's the same vehicle.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,366 ✭✭✭luckat


    There are all kinds of creative ways to rebel - swap around toll tags with friends, pay by cheque, even, umm, ask the consumer agency to act or call your TD?


  • Registered Users Posts: 434 ✭✭TheBoffin


    Did Anyone Get Their e-flow tag yet?

    Its MASSIVE!!

    Its the same size as a regular digital camera.

    Other Items Comparibly Sizable Include:

    Nokia N95
    Samsung Digimax A402
    Desktop Hole Punch
    DLink Router Power Adapter
    Western Digital Pocket Hard Drive

    I cancelled the account today. Got registered up with EZ Pass who supply a nice small discreet tag at less hassle.

    (END OF RANT)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,432 ✭✭✭mcwhirter


    TheBoffin wrote: »
    Did Anyone Get Their e-flow tag yet?

    Its MASSIVE!!

    Its the same size as a regular digital camera.

    Other Items Comparibly Sizable Include:

    Nokia N95
    Samsung Digimax A402
    Desktop Hole Punch
    DLink Router Power Adapter
    Western Digital Pocket Hard Drive

    I cancelled the account today. Got registered up with EZ Pass who supply a nice small discreet tag at less hassle.

    (END OF RANT)

    Did they give a reson as to why it was bigger then the eazypass one?


  • Registered Users Posts: 434 ✭✭TheBoffin


    No they didnt give any reason at all. I must say it was the easiest cancellation I have ever experienced.

    I would post a picture of it only I havent a clue how to.


  • Registered Users Posts: 93 ✭✭Yarnhall


    F*ck it!, going with EasyPass, don't use the bridge too often but at least EP have been up and running for a couple of years.

    Off topic but what's the traffic like in Lucan village now i.e. coming from Galway and head into Lucan and across to Blanch then back onto the M50 north bound. (Generally stay away from Dublin at peak times....)


  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,406 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    My (very law abiding) in-laws live in Belfast and are totally unaware on how to pay for this. If they were travelling say to the ferry in Cork, how do they pay? What happens if a foreigner driving alone goes through the toll area? Are they meant to stop and write down the phone number? Are they expected to slow down while they try and memorise the number?

    Also, I don't see anything about it on the eflow site but what kind of appeals process is there in place for those who lets say have a tag and are also charged from one of the other payment types or those who simply weren't on the M50 at the time?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 29,476 ✭✭✭✭Our man in Havana


    No one knows what if any appeals process is in place.


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