Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Could this spell the start of the end for FF

124678

Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 409 ✭✭john reilly


    raymon wrote: »
    I am not talking about me .... I am not going to vote SF . I am talking about Sinn Fein prospective voters.

    The mask is slipping

    The loudest campaigner and crusader against TDs expenses , Pearse Doherty claimed 51,808 euros expenses . Only three tds had higher expenses out of 167 . In 2009 he named and shamed the top claimants. Only 2 years later he is nearly the highest claimant.

    His running mate Jonathan o Brien was just a few euros behind him at 51,179 euros and Mac Lochlan at 51,174 and Mcclennan at 50,540.

    Even Colreavy claimed 50,225 euros.

    Hypocrites

    but you cant speak for prospective voters as you never were. as for pearse doherty he does live in donegal so presumably would have considerable traveling expenses


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    but you cant speak for prospective voters as you never were. as for pearse doherty he does live in donegal so presumably would have considerable traveling expenses

    "I have stated many times that it is my view that TD’s, Senators, Junior Ministers and Ministers are over paid and that their expenses are inflated. Both the Salary and the expenses should be cut substantially."
    Pearse Doherty 2009

    "Give me the maximum amount of 51,808 euro"
    Pearse Doherty 2011


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,373 ✭✭✭Dr Galen


    This isn't a thread that should have SF or Pearse Doherty as it's central theme.

    Back OT everyone

    Cheers

    DrG


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    Back on track , just to summarize

    FF slipping in the polls
    Michael Martin sharply dropping on the polls
    Eamonn o Cuiv just resigned his post , but not completely from FF yet
    Trouble brewing as old stock try to make a return , (possibly Coughlan, the Cope, O Donohue)

    Looks like the beginning of the end

    Happy days


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,555 ✭✭✭Kinski


    New Red C poll in the SBP tomorrow if anyone's interested. State of the parties: FG 30 (nc); SF 18 (+1); FF 17 (-1); Lab 16 (+2); Inds 19 (-2). Source: SBP feed on Twitter.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    Down and down and down they go .

    It is only fair that FF wither and die .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    raymon wrote: »
    Down and down and down they go .

    It is only fair that FF wither and die .

    Now if only we could get the others to realise that "not as bad as FF" isn't good enough we might be getting places.

    Mind you, I really think it requires a brand-new party to achieve this.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 19,341 ✭✭✭✭Chucky the tree


    raymon wrote: »
    Back on track , just to summarize

    FF slipping in the polls
    Michael Martin sharply dropping on the polls
    Eamonn o Cuiv just resigned his post , but not completely from FF yet
    Trouble brewing as old stock try to make a return , (possibly Coughlan, the Cope, O Donohue)

    Looks like the beginning of the end

    Happy days


    17% is really the beginning of the end? Do you think Labour and Sinn Fein are are at the end as well?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 409 ✭✭john reilly


    17% is really the beginning of the end? Do you think Labour and Sinn Fein are are at the end as well?

    he regularily gets confused between reality and wishfull thinking


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    17% is really the beginning of the end? Do you think Labour and Sinn Fein are are at the end as well?

    Yes , FF are on the way out. No loss to our country.

    SF are rising unfortunately .

    Labour are not doing well now due to junior partner syndrome.


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    raymon wrote: »
    17% is really the beginning of the end? Do you think Labour and Sinn Fein are are at the end as well?

    Yes , FF are on the way out. No loss to our country.

    SF are rising unfortunately .

    Labour are not doing well now due to junior partner syndrome.

    I wouldn't go excusing Labour their offences against the state that easily.....just as the Greens are liable for their decision to stay in government while FF ruined the country, so too Labour are responsible for their decisions to support a government that is betraying those who voted for it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    I wouldn't go excusing Labour their offences against the state that easily.....just as the Greens are liable for their decision to stay in government while FF ruined the country, so too Labour are responsible for their decisions to support a government that is betraying those who voted for it.

    Dont worry, im not defending labour at all.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    raymon wrote: »
    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    I wouldn't go excusing Labour their offences against the state that easily.....just as the Greens are liable for their decision to stay in government while FF ruined the country, so too Labour are responsible for their decisions to support a government that is betraying those who voted for it.

    Dont worry, im not defending labour at all.

    Well then why dismiss their fall in support as "junior partner syndrome" ? The reason I won't be voting for either them or FG again is because they have betrayed my vote.

    No "junior partner syndrome" involved whatsoever.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 156 ✭✭GombeanMan


    I hope FF dies.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,216 ✭✭✭gerryo777


    Wouldn't you think Ahearn and Cowan would have worn sackcloth and ashes to the ard fheis tonight?
    Instead it looked like they were being welcomed like some kind of heroes to me.

    M. Martin going on about 'constructive opposition' one minute then slating the government the next.
    That shower will never learn.
    The leopard doesn't change it's spots.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    Well then why dismiss their fall in support as "junior partner syndrome" ? The reason I won't be voting for either them or FG again is because they have betrayed my vote.

    No "junior partner syndrome" involved whatsoever.

    I believe their drop is due to " junior partner syndrome" , not because of their terrible policies / decisions

    Not a fan of labour me .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    raymon wrote: »
    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    Well then why dismiss their fall in support as "junior partner syndrome" ? The reason I won't be voting for either them or FG again is because they have betrayed my vote.

    No "junior partner syndrome" involved whatsoever.

    I believe their drop is due to " junior partner syndrome" , not because of their terrible policies / decisions

    Not a fan of labour me .

    That has echoes of the Green Party & FF delusions re "they just want a change", ignoring that their decisions and u-turns have sickened us.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    That has echoes of the Green Party & FF delusions re "they just want a change", ignoring that their decisions and u-turns have sickened us.

    The junior coalition partner will have bad poll results regardless

    I don't like labour , I am not excusing them or defending them.

    I am not ignoring anything.


  • Registered Users Posts: 403 ✭✭Humans eh!


    If all else fails,

    90252551.jpg

    Fianna Fail can resort to the old Jedi mind trick.
    It has a powerful effect on the weak minded. :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 409 ✭✭john reilly


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    Well then why dismiss their fall in support as "junior partner syndrome" ? The reason I won't be voting for either them or FG again is because they have betrayed my vote.

    No "junior partner syndrome" involved whatsoever.

    breaking news in fighting in f.g


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 6,551 Mod ✭✭✭✭SeaFields


    gerryo777 wrote: »
    Wouldn't you think Ahearn and Cowan would have worn sackcloth and ashes to the ard fheis tonight?

    Whether true or not, this made me laugh into my coffee this morning....Taken from the sindo
    Asked at one point by a reporter if he would go over and "say hello to Bertie", a clearly taken-aback Dara Calleary bluntly exclaimed "f**k", turned on his well-heeled shoe and headed in the opposite direction.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne



    breaking news in fighting in f.g

    Where was that reported? Have you a link ?

    EDIT : Oh - I think I get it; you're telling lies and trying to give the impressing that I'm "in" FG ?

    Never was (and the way they're going, never will be).

    You do understand the concept of not being a member of any party, don't you ?

    If not then there isn't much point in trying to talk sensibly to you.

    But lay off the lies and guesswork - you're embarrassing yourself.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    Back on track , just to summarize


    All polls now confirm FF slipping in the polls...... great news
    Ard Fheis was more of the same whinging and whining, well done FF


    All polls now confirm SF climbing in the polls ...... bad news


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 409 ✭✭john reilly


    raymon wrote: »
    Back on track , just to summarize


    All polls now confirm FF slipping in the polls...... great news
    Ard Fheis was more of the same whinging and whining, well done FF


    All polls now confirm SF climbing in the polls ...... bad news

    the message is clear


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 8,452 CMod ✭✭✭✭Sierra Oscar


    raymon wrote: »
    Ard Fheis was more of the same whinging and whining, well done FF

    Fantastic Ard Fheis, positive and constructive discussions amongst the 5,000+ members in regards what needs to change in the party in order to ensure past mistakes are not repeated.

    It was great to see the entirety of the organisational reform motions pass almost unanimously on Saturday, ensuring that the necessary change in the structures of the organisation can now occur in order to allow the empowerment of the ordinary member. It really is a game changer for the party and represents the greatest alteration in the structures of the movement since its foundation.

    I also personally enjoyed the discussions in regard social policy and I was glad to see the same sex marriage motion being carried - I think that particular motion highlights that the party is moving on with the times. Also it was fantastic to see gender quotas being opposed in favour of creating policy which will actually encourage greater female participation in politics rather than women just being used as fodder on a ballot. More of those frank discussions need to happen, without them the party would be going nowhere. The opposition to the gender quotas illustrates that the ordinary members are not always just going to row in behind the party leadership in a show of blind faith, the practice of which in the past ensured elected representatives got away with doing things which were just downright wrong.

    It was interesting to listen to the treasures report also, with members presented with the opportunity to question and challenge not only Niall Collins TD in regards the financial activities of the party, but also HQ finance staff. I am nearly certain that this was the first time this sort of a treasurers report occurred at an Ard Fheis and long may it continue!

    One thing members were not really discussing all that much were opinion poll results - I think it dawned on everyone that if the hard work undertaken at the Ard Fheis continues then a regain of support is inevitable. Interesting times ahead, that's for sure!


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,565 ✭✭✭RandomName2


    I personally turned off FF for a number of reasons:
    • Their reluctance to address the housing bubble - indeed making it a trademark of their policy, and not caring about knock-on effects concerning inflation, large borrowing exposure, etc. Their subsequent denial about the problem with this modus opperandi.
    • Again, relating to the above, their fast-buck policies that have long-term repercussions. Encouraging low level migrant workers to enter the country whilst not making either any real moves to protect blue-collar jobs from being outsourced or attempt to develop industry.
    • Being craven yes men for pro-integrationist European heads of state. I can accept it as a political position, but their methodology, spin, coercion and outright lies were/are shameful.
    • Quite simply, not being respectful enough to the public; the Irish citizens, the people whom they are supposed to represent.

    I can accept that all parties are capable of making mistakes. I need them to acknowledge this of themselves before I can consider voting for them again.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,299 ✭✭✭✭later12


    I need them to acknowledge this of themselves before I can consider voting for them again.
    This is a huge problem with Irish voters.

    Why do you wish to apply human traits and behaviours to a political party - an entirely different species?

    Surely one should vote for a party based on its economic and social policies, not out of some petty sense of acknowledgement for its sins. So what if Fianna Fail acknowledge their wrongdoing? I acknowledge my wrongdoing every time I smoke a cancer stick, but I still do it; I'm doing it right now.

    Seriously, people need to stop dwelling on simplistic, meaningless gestures. Gestures will not get Ireland out of the dirt. Voters must start focusing on policy reform if this country is ever to regenerate itself. Ignore the gestures.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,080 ✭✭✭hallelujajordan


    raymon wrote: »
    Back on track , just to summarize


    All polls now confirm FF slipping in the polls...... great news
    Ard Fheis was more of the same whinging and whining, well done FF


    All polls now confirm SF climbing in the polls ...... bad news

    Not really.. Any objective analysis would say that FF are more or less in the same place as they were this time last year (although I would never accuse you of being objective when it comes to FF) . .

    Sunday Independent poll today was imo far more interesting. . . 36% of those polled want to see FF recover and become a realistic alternative party in government, far more than the 23% who want to see Sinn Fein in government.

    Another interesting finding in this poll . . Only 3% of people polled think they are to blame for the current economic crisis. . Strange, considering that Fianna Fail achieved 41% of first preference votes as recently as 2007, and I'll wager that more than 3% of us have either had investment properties, 100% mortgages or holidays/cars etc that we cannot afford. . We might not all have gone mad (as other posters will be quick to remind me) but certainly more than 3% of us did

    later12 wrote: »
    Surely one should vote for a party based on its economic and social policies, not out of some petty sense of acknowledgement for its sins. So what if Fianna Fail acknowledge their wrongdoing? I acknowledge my wrongdoing every time I smoke a cancer stick, but I still do it; I'm doing it right now.

    Seriously, people need to stop dwelling on simplistic, meaningless gestures. Gestures will not get Ireland out of the dirt. Voters must start focusing on policy reform if this country is ever to regenerate itself. Ignore the gestures.

    +1 . . I am hoping that this weekend will be a turning point for FF . . no more apologies and gestures. Time to shed the sackcloth and ashes and get on with leading the opposition.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,565 ✭✭✭RandomName2


    later12 wrote: »
    This is a huge problem with Irish voters.

    Why do you wish to apply human traits and behaviours to a political party - an entirely different species?

    Surely one should vote for a party based on its economic and social policies, not out of some petty sense of acknowledgement for its sins. So what if Fianna Fail acknowledge their wrongdoing? I acknowledge my wrongdoing every time I smoke a cancer stick, but I still do it; I'm doing it right now.

    Seriously, people need to stop dwelling on simplistic, meaningless gestures. Gestures will not get Ireland out of the dirt. Voters must start focusing on policy reform if this country is ever to regenerate itself. Ignore the gestures.

    I see what you're saying, and I agree with it in theory, but...

    As far as I'm concerned all the policies in the world will not help FF if they insist that the property bubble was an inherently good idea.

    I need a gesture, token, message, from a base that represents the party as a whole (Micheal Martin would be a start) that would say: this was idiocy, and if we had our time back we would have done things differently. NOT "IT WAS THE LEHMAN BROTHERS!!!" Jaysus, when I heard Conor Lenihan peddling that crap during the election I had to pick my jaw off the floor.

    Kind of in the same way that I would need Sinn Fein to say "the members of our party who murdered people, or aided those who murdered, were in the wrong", not some clap-trap about how "everybody suffered" or "it was war" which essentially amounts to approbation.

    Again it was telling how for so many years there the lack of a token, or gesture from the Catholic Church to, in some shape or form, display a condemnation of its members and hierarchy who engaged in and sheltered institutionalised abuse.

    The symbol begets the policy.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭raymon


    Not really.. Any objective analysis would say that FF are more or less in the same place as they were this time last year (although I would never accuse you of being objective when it comes to FF) . .

    Sunday Independent poll today was imo far more interesting. . . 36% of those polled want to see FF recover and become a realistic alternative party in government, far more than the 23% who want to see Sinn Fein in government.

    Another interesting finding in this poll . . Only 3% of people polled think they are to blame for the current economic crisis. . Strange, considering that Fianna Fail achieved 41% of first preference votes as recently as 2007, and I'll wager that more than 3% of us have either had investment properties, 100% mortgages or holidays/cars etc that we cannot afford. . We might not all have gone mad (as other posters will be quick to remind me) but certainly more than 3% of us did




    +1 . . I am hoping that this weekend will be a turning point for FF . . no more apologies and gestures. Time to shed the sackcloth and ashes and get on with leading the opposition.
    The independent poll was not an objective poll.

    Please provide the questions that provided these percentages.

    The questions were leading and do not compare like with like

    In any case the results are poor for FF . The constant drone of whinge is obviously not working


This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement