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"Man flu - Banishing the myths" so-called joke and attitudes to Men's Health

  • 31-03-2011 10:41pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭iptba


    I just got the following from a joke list I'm on.

    I don't mind the odd joke about men - this just seems OTT.

    Maybe it's not surprising some men neglect their health with attitudes like in society.

    1. Man Flu is more painful than childbirth. This is an irrefutable scientific fact*.
    (*Based on a survey of over 100,000 men.)

    2. Man Flu is not 'just a cold'. It is a condition so severe that the germs from a single Man Flu sneeze could wipe out entire tribes of people living in the rainforest. And probably loads of monkeys too.

    3. Women do not contract Man Flu. At worst they suffer from what is medically recognised as a 'Mild Girly Sniffle' which, if a man caught, he would still be able to run, throw a ball, tear the phone book in half and compete in all other kinds of manly activities.

    4. Men do not 'moan' when they have Man Flu. They emit involuntary groans of agony that are entirely in proportion to the unbearable pain they are in.

    5. Full recovery from Man Flu will take place much quicker if their simple requests for care, sympathy and regular cups of tea are met. Is that really so much to ask? Florence Nightingale would have done it

    6. More men die each year from MFN (Man Flu Neglect) than lots and lots of other things. (Like rabbit attacks or choking on toast).

    7. Men suffering from Man Flu want nothing more than to get out of bed and come to work but they are too selfless to risk spreading this awful condition amongst their friends and colleagues. In this sense, they are the greatest heroes this country has ever known.

    8. In 1982 scientists managed to simulate the agonising symptoms of full blown Man Flu in a female chimp. She became so ill that her head literally fell off.

    9. Man Flu germs are more powerful than He-Man, The Thundercats and The A-Team combined. They are too strong for weak, nasty tasting 'lady medicines' like Lemsip, so don't bother trying to force them on a victim of Man Flu.

    10. While it may seem like a Man Flu sufferer is just lying around enjoying 'Diagnosis Murder' it is a commonly recognised medical fact that the exact pitch and frequency of Dick Van Dyke's voice has remarkable soothing powers.

    Every minute in this country one man is struck down by Man Flu. Women, all we ask is that each of you offers them a cup of tea, some kind words and your undivided attention and care. Then maybe, just maybe, we'll beat this monstrous disease together.


«1

Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,925 ✭✭✭Otis Driftwood


    Jeez,lighten up will ya.

    Thats funny.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 419 ✭✭Adrian009


    iptba wrote: »
    I just got the following from a joke list I'm on.

    I don't mind the odd joke about men - this just seems OTT.

    Maybe it's not surprising some men neglect their health with attitudes like in society.



    But its only funny cause it so true!:D:D:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 23,316 ✭✭✭✭amacachi


    More than one woman has said to me about testicular cancer "Ah sure ya just get them removed early and they always survive." Of course saying the same about breast cancer wouldn't be seen as the same.
    Also had it said that the fact that someone got a ball removed early as a "precaution" wasn't a big deal, if it was a woman and a breast I wouldn't like to imagine how many womens' mags it'd be plastered all over.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,925 ✭✭✭Otis Driftwood


    amacachi wrote: »
    More than one woman has said to me about testicular cancer "Ah sure ya just get them removed early and they always survive." Of course saying the same about breast cancer wouldn't be seen as the same.
    Also had it said that the fact that someone got a ball removed early as a "precaution" wasn't a big deal, if it was a woman and a breast I wouldn't like to imagine how many womens' mags it'd be plastered all over.

    Bit of a difference in losing a testicle and "man flu".

    I cant see the link between your post and the OP.
    :confused:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 23,316 ✭✭✭✭amacachi


    Bit of a difference in losing a testicle and "man flu".

    I cant see the link between your post and the OP.
    :confused:

    Perhaps you could read the OP a bit more carefully then, I believe this was what the OP was trying to get across:
    Maybe it's not surprising some men neglect their health with attitudes like in society.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭iptba


    amacachi wrote: »
    Perhaps you could read the OP a bit more carefully then, I believe this was what the OP was trying to get across:
    Maybe it's not surprising some men neglect their health with attitudes like in society.

    And there was also the title
    "Man flu - Banishing the myths" so-called joke and attitudes to Men's Health
    I would see comments about attitudes to Men's Health and the like as generally being on-topic.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,925 ✭✭✭Otis Driftwood


    I read the OP.

    If people are that stupid to ignore their health because of a joke then Im sorry,they deserve whatever they get.

    Its a joke about "man flu" for Gods sake.

    If it was a joke about say prostate cancer just being used as an excuse to get examined by a proctologist because you are latently gay then maybe I could take it seriously or see a remotely relevant link but its not,its about "man flu",and its pretty damn funny too IMO.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    Seems to be a joke on the idea of a 'man flu' rather than a joke about male health issues. Slightly sexist but hardly 'let's burn down city hall' sexist. 'Man flu' is some stupid joke about how when any women get sick they just get on with it where as all men go all hypercondriac. Obviously and observably not true in the slightest. Extreme exaggeration for comic effect. Complaining about that joke would be on a par with 'feminazis' complaining about a billboard with a hot girl advertising crisps being an attack on women. It's digging for something to be offended by. I don't think the joke is funny but I'm certainly not outraged by it, it just isn't a funny joke in my opinion.

    Meh.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭iptba


    strobe wrote: »
    'Man flu' is some stupid joke about how when any women get sick they just get on with it where as all men go all hypercondriac. Obviously and observably not true in the slightest.
    You may think that. Does everyone in society think it's "obviously and observably not true in the slightest"?

    I've seen and/or heard enough discussions e.g. where people say women are much better at dealing with pain, than men to believe some people do believe it to be at least partly true.

    I think it is interesting to explore the issue of men and their health. And why men are more inclined to die younger and the like, go to their doctor later with conditions, etc.

    Some people may not be interested in the topic - there's no compulsion on anybody to take part in the discussion.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    iptba wrote: »
    You may think that. Does everyone in society think it's "obviously and observably not true in the slightest"?

    Obviously not. If everyone did the joke wouldn't have resonance. Jokes frequently play to the base opinion.
    I've seen and/or heard enough discussions e.g. where people say women are much better at dealing with pain than men to believe some people do believe it to be at least partly true.

    I've seen and/or heard discussion e.g where people say black people are much better at dancing than white people. I'm not sure of the relevance of this though.
    I think it is interesting to explore the issue of men and their health. And why men are more inclined to die younger and the like, go to their doctor later with conditions, etc.

    That's a good discussion to have. Seeing as the dying younger thing is across all cultures and races I think it is something to do with our innate biologies. I'm not sure of the specifics but it would seem to make sense. Maybe something to do with the fact that women stop producing sex hormones long before men do? I dunno, I'm not versed on the subject, just guessing here. I'm sure it's been studied though. I'll post back if I come across anything on my travels.

    The second part; Why do men go to their doctor later with their conditions? Is an interesting one alright. I have no clue. I didn't know that was the case. In my opinion it would have been better if you had of just posed that question initially without complaining about what was a pretty nothing joke, cause that, if it is true, is a very interesting discussion right there.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭iptba


    strobe wrote: »
    iptba wrote:
    I've seen and/or heard enough discussions e.g. where people say women are much better at dealing with pain than men to believe some people do believe it to be at least partly true.
    I've seen and/or heard discussion e.g where people say black people are much better at dancing than white people. I'm not sure of the relevance of this though.
    I think it would have been of relevance if you didn't accept the first point.

    Also pain comes in to the first part:
    Man Flu is more painful than childbirth.
    In discussions about pain it often seems to come up how men couldn't cope with the pain of childbirth and how this proves that men are worse are dealing with pain, etc.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,872 ✭✭✭strobe


    iptba wrote: »
    I
    Also pain comes in to the first part:
    In discussions about pain it often seems to come up how men couldn't cope with the pain of childbirth and how this proves that men are worse are dealing with pain, etc.

    The only girls I have seen try to put forward that 'argument' are, not to put to fine a point on things, idiots. There is a saying advocating the avoidance of engaging in arguments with idiots due to the fact it is difficult to win, based on the reality that they always always attempt to steer the argument towards ground they are happy to argue on but you are not. I agree with that saying. So I just laugh at and then ignore them. It's pointless to do otherwise.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    Man Flu is a serious issue and Snow Monkey and I have not gone away and our support thread is here in After Hours

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58433439


  • Registered Users Posts: 737 ✭✭✭Morgase


    strobe wrote: »
    Seeing as the dying younger thing is across all cultures and races I think it is something to do with our innate biologies. I'm not sure of the specifics but it would seem to make sense. Maybe something to do with the fact that women stop producing sex hormones long before men do?

    It's more the fact that women and men produce different amounts of different hormones throughout their lives.

    There is some evidence that testosterone has a role in suppressing the immune system. So, for males, it's a trade-off between good health and sexual signalling.

    Testosterone-mediated effects on fitness-related phenotypic traits and fitness.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,805 ✭✭✭Setun


    The Dick van Dyke bit made me laugh. I didn't find the rest funny, not because of its supposed offensiveness but because it was a bit too obvious to warrant a chuckle.

    I think the reasons men don't take their health seriously are varied and complex. Funnily enough I think one of the main reasons is that most see it as a waste of time - assuming that there's nothing wrong with them and that "they'll be grand" after a while.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,925 ✭✭✭Otis Driftwood


    Daddio wrote: »
    Funnily enough I think one of the main reasons is that most see it as a waste of time - assuming that there's nothing wrong with them and that "they'll be grand" after a while.

    Excellent point.Id be exactly the same,unless Im in absolute bits then I dont go to a doctor.Foolish perhaps but I cant justify to myself going and spending whatever amount of money it costs having medicals or tests when I feel completely fine.

    Its certainly nothing to to with society somehow seeing me as being less "manly" or any rubbish like that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭iptba


    I have a few things to do today so not sure how much time I'll have to give to this.

    Anyway, I just had a quick look at the Men's Health Forum in Ireland page:

    http://www.mhfi.org/key-facts-on-mens-health-in-ireland.html
    [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
    There is growing evidence that in constructing, displaying and maintaining their male identity, men engage in risk behaviours that can be seriously hazardous to their health. Since sickness may be seen as an expression of weakness, many men may decide not to seek help and, instead, present a stoical, brave and unflinching front to the outside world. This may account, in part, for why - despite their health profile - men in Ireland are reluctant users of health services and continue to present (too) late in the course of an illness.
    [/FONT]


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭iptba


    FWIW

    http://www.gponline.com/News/article/1043685/Demeaning-phrases-stop-men-checking-health/
    Demeaning phrases stop men checking health
    By Tom Moberly, 29 November 2010

    Demeaning phrases used to describe male illness are putting men off accessing health services, a survey suggests.

    Demeaning phrases have such as 'manflu' prevented men from seeing a GP

    In a survey of 3,000 people, 52% of men said the term ‘man flu’ had prevented them seeking advice for a legitimate illness.

    In addition, 53% of men said they worried about wasting GPs’ time. Only 55% of men visit their GP once a year or more, compared with 72% of women.

    Many men also said they would not visit their GP if they suffered persistent thirst (80%), frequent urination (77%) and erectile dysfunction (75%), even though such symptoms could be early warning signs of underlying health conditions.

    The survey included 1,500 men and was conducted on behalf of Pfizer.


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,746 ✭✭✭✭Galvasean


    Morgase wrote: »
    There is some evidence that testosterone has a role in suppressing the immune system. So, for males, it's a trade-off between good health and sexual signalling.

    "Hey baby, the reason why I'm sick is because I'm so damn sexy! :cool: "


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,029 ✭✭✭ Brixton Fat Faun


    My girlfriend and I were chatting about "man flu" recently and how she wouldn't give me any sympathy over being sick from a hangover (fair enough) or "man flu".

    My argument was that she should give me sympathy for "man flu" as it may be the initial symptoms of something like Ebola. :D

    On a more serious note, something that may seem like "man flu" could be just the symptoms of something more serious.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    "Demeaning phrases stop men checking health"
    iptba wrote: »

    I dont agree with this.

    A researcher asking a man do you "strongly agree " or "strongly disagree" with the following statement by a vested interest does not constitute anything more than market research by a marketing company as commisioned research by a drug company.

    If you want to see whether it is the case you would compare incidents of preventable illnesses in Ireland against international studies of best practice.

    There is a huge difference between a cultural belief that a man will not take care of his health and the idea that an informed man will not take care of his health or that health services are not available or affordable for a man to take care of his heath or that the health service spend on women is more than on men.

    So are there hard statistics to back this up.

    Are there GP studies on this phenomena ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭iptba


    I've never claimed to be an expert on men's health issues and I've other things on my plate at the moment so don't have much time to devote to looking up men's health research at this time.

    However, I do know a bit about medical research in general and even within "fancier" research e.g. the peer-reviewed literature, surveys and such qualitative data do have a place especially when one is looking at attitudes.

    I imagine if I was to quote this sort of data:
    If you want to see whether it is the case you would compare incidents of preventable illnesses in Ireland against international studies of best practice.
    it would be criticised also.

    So I'm not going to respond using any narrow confines put on what might be seen as relevant or convincing - I think whatever I post is going to be criticised.

    Anyway, I had a quick look at The Men's Health Forum in Ireland (MHFI) website.

    It links to this:
    http://www.mensproject.org/facts/minihealth.pdf

    Men in Northern Ireland: Report 3a
    December 2007
    Olivia O’Riordan and Paula Devine
    Men’s health

    The Men in Northern Ireland (MINI) series is produced by ARK, a joint project between Queen’s University Belfast and the University of Ulster. Its aim is to make material on the social and political life of Northern Ireland available to the widest audience.
    Attitudes
    Respondents were asked in the 2004 Northern Ireland Life and Times Survey, whether they believed men feel embarrassed about visiting doctors and other health services. 86% of men and 91% of women said ‘yes, definitely’ or ‘yes, probably’ which helps to explain why so many men are reluctant to visit their local G.P. In addition, almost a quarter (24%) of male respondents agreed with the statement that men’s health was not taken seriously by the health services. 17% of female respondents also agreed. There was general agreement by 93% of men and 95% of women that men ignore minor health problems until they become more serious.
    Dental health
    Figure 2 reflects the results of the 2004/5 Continuous Household Survey which showed that men were significantly less likely than women, to visit a dentist. Less than half the male respondents (47%) reported that they go for regular dental check-ups, while 63% of female
    respondents said that they do (see Figure 2).
    Data from the 2006 Northern Ireland Life and Times Survey show that 17% of men were quite or very dissatisfied with their local doctors/GP, while only 12% of female respondents were.
    GP visits
    Statistics show that over the last few years men have been more reluctant to visit their GP than women. (iptba: I'm not sure if this data really shows this that well) The results of the 2006/7 Continuous Household Survey shows that 12% of male respondents had visited a doctor in the last 14 days while 18% of women had. Figures from
    the 2006 Northern Ireland Health and Social Wellbeing Survey show that the proportion of men and women suffering from common conditions are very similar, for example, angina (females 6%, males 7%), diabetes not related to pregnancy (females 4%, males 4%) and heart attack
    (females 2%, males 4%). However, the proportion of men having high blood pressure diagnosed by a health professional is much lower than for women (19% and 27% respectively), regardless of age.


    Incidentally, here is background information on The Northern Ireland Life and Times Survey before it is criticised:
    The Northern Ireland Life and Times Survey was launched in October 1998 as a resource for everyone interested in the social attitudes of people living in Northern Ireland.

    Set up by Queen's University Belfast and University of Ulster and run every year, the survey aims to put on record the attitudes, values and beliefs of the people in Northern Ireland on a wide range of social policy issues.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    I am not going to criticize you for higlighting factual information.

    If a health issue is health with as a health issue with solid facts great but if its turned into a gender politics hypotheses then the gender arguement obscures the health issue.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,862 ✭✭✭iptba


    CDfm wrote: »
    If a health issue is health with as a health issue with solid facts great but if its turned into a gender politics hypotheses then the gender arguement obscures the health issue.
    Well, I'm not sure how easy it is to separate the two with phrases like "man flu".

    It and that joke has misandric connotations in my opinion. Indeed when Googling for information, I found an interesting thread: http://antimisandry.com/chit-chat-main/term-man-flu-used-nurse-excuse-not-examine-18-mth-old-toddler-25357-2.html . Unfortunately, the language (not swearing) may put a lot of people off.

    I only skimmed down a bit. Post #18 gets at what I annoys me on the issue:
    on the one hand we are told that men don't look after their health and should go to the doctor more quickly with their problems and then simultaneously, with "man flu" men are wimps who complain to readily about their health problems.

    I'm not sure if there is much "peer reviewed" research on "man flu" and any possible effects it might have at this stage. Nothing showed up on PubMed. It seems to be a relatively new word and published research can take quite a while between applying for funding (if necessary), getting ethical permission, doing the research and analysing the data, writing up the paper, going through peer review and then even when an article is accepted, it can sometimes take a while for it to be published.

    ----

    A discussion on men's health and why men may not go to their doctor earlier is a bit broader than simply "man flu" and so might involve a lot less gender politics. I might look for more stats on that in the next while.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    Maybe so, but Mother in Law jokes may not be pc either but the phrase lends itself to humour.

    Anyway, here is a factual article we posted in our spoof support thread.

    Man flu? Don't be a big girl's blouse – it's woman flu!




    View Gallery


    Published Date: 17 December 2008
    By Shan Ross
    IT'S always assumed that those suffering from "man flu" are exaggerating their symptoms to extract maximum sympathy from a few sniffles and force their partners to run after them with tissues, hot water bottles and painkillers.

    But research released today says the condition does not exist and that women are in fact worse than men at complaining of colds and flu.

    A poll found that most women admit exaggerating their symptoms to gain attention or to get a day off work. M


    en, on the other hand, are revealed as more stoic and less likely to create a fuss or demand attention when ill.

    Gladeana McMahon, a consultant psychotherapist, and Fellow of the British Association for Counselling and Psychotherapy, believes women could be using illness as "pay-back time" for attention denied them in everyday life.

    "Women tend to talk more about their feelings generally, but men it seems, appear to vocalise more when they're sick – that's where the myth around man flu originated.

    "So it's surprising that these results show women to be the biggest complainers when it comes to colds and flu.

    "Maybe it is more a case of needing more recognition for what they do and, if they can't get that on a day-to-day basis, then looking for a bit of sympathy when they're sick is a way of making up for this".

    When it comes to recovery time, women were also found to take significantly longer to return to full health.

    Fourteen per cent of men said they were usually back to normal in a day or two, while a quarter of female respondents said it could take them eight to ten days to get back on their feet, according to a UK-wide poll of 2,300 adults by Actimel, the probiotic yoghurt drink makers.

    However, with regards to prevention and cold or flu management, women take the lead in supporting their body's defences with more men heading straight to the doctor at the first sign of a sniffle (74 per cent as opposed to 70 per cent).

    Carina Norris, a Fife-based author and nutritionist for Channel 4's Turn Back Your Body Clock, said: "The winter months from November to February are the worst for catching colds because we are all crammed indoors together.

    "It is a good idea to take nutrients to supplement the immune system. I'd recommend taking things such as vitamin C, zinc, probiotic yoghurt in drinks or in tablet form. Garlic in warming stews is another line of defence."

    Professor John Oxford, cold and flu expert from The Royal London Hospital, said: "The best way to prevent either 'man' or 'woman' flu is probably to sleep in a separate bedroom to a suffering partner. This close proximity is a sure way to spread the virus."

    John Swinburne, former Scottish Senior Citizens' Unity Party MSP, said: "If you're used to being active it can be hard to accept any restrictions when you're unwell.

    "Quite frankly, I'm surprised at this survey saying women complain the most as they are usually strong in adversity.

    "When I started my working life there was no sick pay so people just had to soldier on, probably passing the germs to everyone. There wasn't the chance to lie about in bed."

    FACT BOX

    LATEST figures from the Office for National Statistics show that between July 2007 to June 2008 about 5.8 million scheduled working days were lost to sickness or injury.

    The total cost of absence was £19.9 billion.

    Women and those working in the public sector are most likely to be absent from work.

    The sickness absence rate for women was 2.9 per cent, compared with 2.2 per cent for men. Among men, those aged 16-24 were most likely to be absent, whereas for women those aged 25-34 had the highest rate (3.1 per cent).

    Minor ailments, such as colds, are the most significant cause of short-term absences.

    The average employee took 6.7 days off sick

    http://news.scotsman.com/health/Man-flu-Don39t-be-a.4799128.jp.

    As you can see from the article there is a statistical difference between the genders taking sick days in the UK and men take fewer days than women !


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,006 ✭✭✭donfers


    it's not funny in the slightest, obvious stereotypical and predictable humour holds no appeal for me

    man flu jokes are about as funny as mother in law or blonde jokes i.e. not very, at least in my opinion

    jokes that base themselves entirely on lazy labelling are just a bit shoite if you ask me, I am offended more by the fact that they insult my intelligence than anything else

    iptba is trying admirably in my view to raise concerns about how men have a more laidback or stoical attitude to health issues (ironically enough the "jokes" suggest men are whingers and complainers about health concerns when the reality is most guys will have to be at deaths door before they seek help)

    however with regard to these particular manflu jokes I wouldn't see any agenda at play there other than some rather unfunny comment


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    I suppose it depends who you are trying to engage in argument wise.

    I have a bit of a dose at the moment and was minded by my partner this evening paracetemol & hot drinks.

    So a bit of friendly frivolous banter hit the spot for me this evening. A bit of self deprecating humour and then some faux misandry from the ladies in a feed/punchline system.

    We do it for the banter - and no it is not serious.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,487 ✭✭✭banquo


    I have manflu right now :(


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    banquo wrote: »
    I have manflu right now :(

    I feel your pain .


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 22,048 ✭✭✭✭Snowie


    CDfm wrote: »
    Man Flu is a serious issue and Snow Monkey and I have not gone away and our support thread is here in After Hours

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=58433439



    I dont suffer man flu any more cause Im BI-Winning

    Im just that awesome :cool:


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