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Future of student media

  • 24-03-2012 9:58pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 339 ✭✭


    hi guys,

    hopefully the sabbatical officers will take a pay reduction to bring them in line with minimum wage.

    perhaps if ULFM and An focal are reintegrated as socs they could take money from CnS and get a non-sabbat Student media officer who would work full or part-time to ensure that student media is maintained at a high standard next year.

    either reinstate a cSO officer with a different job spec to last years and hold an election or make it an interview role like the ents officer.


Comments

  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 14,009 Mod ✭✭✭✭wnolan1992


    roro1neil0 wrote: »
    hi guys,

    hopefully the sabbatical officers will take a pay reduction to bring them in line with minimum wage.

    perhaps if ULFM and An focal are reintegrated as socs they could take money from CnS and get a non-sabbat Student media officer who would work full or part-time to ensure that student media is maintained at a high standard next year.

    either reinstate a cSO officer with a different job spec to last years and hold an election or make it an interview role like the ents officer.

    It's a good idea, and I'd wonder whether the motion to retain CO services tabled for the UGM contains some similarity to them.

    From reading this it appears as if ULFM will be more independent in that Chairperson will no longer be a sabbat.

    One reservation I would have about making An Focal a soc, would be that they may lose the ability to go to companies as the official paper of ULSU to sell advertising. An independent soc paper wouldn't be able to charge the same rates as a ULSU run paper. (Badly worded but hopefully you can get what I mean)


  • Registered Users Posts: 857 ✭✭✭Polar Ice


    wnolan1992 wrote: »
    From reading this it appears as if ULFM will be more independent in that Chairperson will no longer be a sabbat.

    From reading that link, what I'm seeing is that all of the board positions aren't coming up for renewal. Also, is that page internally linked on the ulfm.ie website? It doesn't appear to be.
    "If you wish to apply, email a CV with relevant experience etc and a cover letter to info@ulfm.ie." URL="http://www.anfocal.ie/news/2502/ulfm-seeks-to-form-20123-development-board"]1[/URL
    Next years board is still chosen by this years comms officer.
    wnolan1992 wrote: »
    One reservation I would have about making An Focal a soc, would be that they may lose the ability to go to companies as the official paper of ULSU to sell advertising. An independent soc paper wouldn't be able to charge the same rates as a ULSU run paper. (Badly worded but hopefully you can get what I mean)

    How did you determine that? The first thing a company will look at company is readership/distribution figures. "ULSU run paper" means nothing. If the reliability and quality is the same (or better) then it won't impact rates.

    One reservation I'd have about making it a soc is it will cost C&S money for what historically hasn't been a C&S activity. There's already a large jump in the total number of C&S over the last year that are contesting an unchanged total funding pool (i.e. less for each C&S)


  • Registered Users Posts: 271 ✭✭Ginge Young


    Polar Ice wrote: »

    One reservation I'd have about making it a soc is it will cost C&S money for what historically hasn't been a C&S activity. There's already a large jump in the total number of C&S over the last year that are contesting an unchanged total funding pool (i.e. less for each C&S)

    Couldn't agree more on that. That being said I have no idea what the running costs of An Focal etc would be. However we have used to the same level of capitation for the last number of years to fund C&S. There are now close to 70 I believe who will be eligible to apply for budgets, which is a lot more than there ever has been. (I think).

    It wouldn't be an issue other than that any extra money we now have is going directly to the SU so as to pay wages and not face redundancies. It would be something that would have to be looked at closely. On the one hand obviously don't want to lose the paper, but on the other, is there enough money in the pot to pay for it when historically as you said yourself it hasn't been a C&S Activity.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,334 ✭✭✭reunion


    Polar Ice wrote: »

    One reservation I'd have about making it a soc is it will cost C&S money for what historically hasn't been a C&S activity. There's already a large jump in the total number of C&S over the last year that are contesting an unchanged total funding pool (i.e. less for each C&S)

    Couldn't agree more on that. That being said I have no idea what the running costs of An Focal etc would be. However we have used to the same level of capitation for the last number of years to fund C&S. There are now close to 70 I believe who will be eligible to apply for budgets, which is a lot more than there ever has been. (I think).

    It wouldn't be an issue other than that any extra money we now have is going directly to the SU so as to pay wages and not face redundancies. It would be something that would have to be looked at closely. On the one hand obviously don't want to lose the paper, but on the other, is there enough money in the pot to pay for it when historically as you said yourself it hasn't been a C&S Activity.

    I thought the paper paid for itself plus extra? So no need to be a society. ULFM should be a society, makes no sense as a service but would make sense as a society.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,465 ✭✭✭highlydebased


    Polar Ice wrote: »
    From reading that link, what I'm seeing is that all of the board positions aren't coming up for renewal. Also, is that page internally linked on the ulfm.ie website? It doesn't appear to be.
    "If you wish to apply, email a CV with relevant experience etc and a cover letter to info@ulfm.ie." URL="http://www.anfocal.ie/news/2502/ulfm-seeks-to-form-20123-development-board"]1[/URL
    Next years board is still chosen by this years comms officer.



    )


    Kelly is not taking part in the selection process. The rest of the board, will.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,533 ✭✭✭Jester252


    I find it odd that you need a CV and a cover letter to apply to be on ULFM board. Should they not be happy with people wanting to be apart of the board and help run it. Should it not give you exp not require exp.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,180 ✭✭✭OhMSGlive


    Jester252 wrote: »
    I find it odd that you need a CV and a cover letter to apply to be on ULFM board. Should they not be happy with people wanting to be apart of the board and help run it. Should it not give you exp not require exp.

    You could argue this point. But then again, you could also argue that maybe ULFM want to achieve a level of professionalism. I dunno.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,465 ✭✭✭highlydebased


    Jester252 wrote: »
    I find it odd that you need a CV and a cover letter to apply to be on ULFM board. Should they not be happy with people wanting to be apart of the board and help run it. Should it not give you exp not require exp.

    Yes and no, there obviously needs to be some general interest in radio etc from those who apply, and a need to get an idea who the person is, hence the motivation for that requirement.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,533 ✭✭✭Jester252


    Was a CV and coverletter needed for the current members? I understand the need but you don't need these when you what to be involved in c&s or An Focal. Since ULFM is new should it not be trying to get pe ople involved with the station? How can that be if you need to be approved by the current boards? If you are worried about the level of professionalism for ULFM then why are you not worried about the Sabbats, the people who are running C&S or An Focal?


  • Registered Users Posts: 339 ✭✭roro1neil0


    some of the arguments against ulfm and an focal becoming societies rather than services is that the editors would have less veto control over some of the stories and shows. if they are supposed to be socs they're supposed to be inclusive and facilitative, i.e. you write a ****ty story they still include it because it's a society and they should cater for members. not sure really how this would work out in practice.

    more importantly i'm interested in the attitude proclaimed by ginge young which presumably is representative of the rest of the C&S people. basically they want to keep the C&S number down as low as possible to not dilute funds. seems a bit unfair on people who want to start good socs especially when the current socs squander so much money 'on trips'.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,465 ✭✭✭highlydebased


    Jester252 wrote: »
    Was a CV and coverletter needed for the current members? I understand the need but you don't need these when you what to be involved in c&s or An Focal. Since ULFM is new should it not be trying to get pe ople involved with the station? How can that be if you need to be approved by the current boards? If you are worried about the level of professionalism for ULFM then why are you not worried about the Sabbats, the people who are running C&S or An Focal?

    Yes, we all sent a coverletter.

    100+ different people have gotten involved presenting shows etc without a need to investigate their backgrounds. I don't think that will change. Surely it would be retrograde to just get a general group of people as a board instead of a board of students with skills/knowledge in various areas (which is the aim)

    As regard An Focal, a CV etc might not be required but if you want to become a subeditor you'll have to prove your worth, so it's not overly dissimilar.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,533 ✭✭✭Jester252


    Yes, we all sent a coverletter.

    100+ different people have gotten involved presenting shows etc without a need to investigate their backgrounds. I don't think that will change. Surely it would be retrograde to just get a general group of people as a board instead of a board of students with skills/knowledge in various areas (which is the aim)

    As regard An Focal, a CV etc might not be required but if you want to become a subeditor you'll have to prove your worth, so it's not overly dissimilar.

    But did you send in a CV?
    And this why students thinks the SU is clique. Ye were appointed by the cureent comm officer who most of ye were friends before or involved with the union. I looked through my emails and I could not see any emails looking for people to get involved. The board is now going to pick who will join them. Can you see how that might looked like a closed group to the average student.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,465 ✭✭✭highlydebased


    Jester252 wrote: »
    But did you send in a CV?
    And this why students thinks the SU is clique. Ye were appointed by the cureent comm officer who most of ye were friends before or involved with the union. I looked through my emails and I could not see any emails looking for people to get involved. The board is now going to pick who will join them. Can you see how that might looked like a closed group to the average student.

    I think I did, possibly.

    I don't disagree with you in general. I'm unsure of any alternative way of trying to learn about potential new board members other than send a cover note.

    It will be advertised as widely as we can, it is not the intent to limit it to any one group of students.


  • Registered Users Posts: 271 ✭✭Ginge Young


    roro1neil0 wrote: »
    more importantly i'm interested in the attitude proclaimed by ginge young which presumably is representative of the rest of the C&S people. basically they want to keep the C&S number down as low as possible to not dilute funds. seems a bit unfair on people who want to start good socs especially when the current socs squander so much money 'on trips'.

    Taking what I said completely out of context, new clubs and socs are always welcome.

    Historically neither of these were C&S. ULFM I think could have been started as a Soc from the beginning, but . If an focal is self sustaining from advertising then no problem. I couldn't even begin to think of a figure for printing costs. Could be quite low. But as I said it would need to be looked at closely. I never actually said it shouldn't happen, just speaking the truth in that things in general are a lot tighter now due to the agreement to help sustain the Union.

    My opinion is in no way representative of C&S, it's my own.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,334 ✭✭✭reunion


    100+ different people have gotten involved presenting shows etc without a need to investigate their backgrounds. I don't think that will change. Surely it would be retrograde to just get a general group of people as a board instead of a board of students with skills/knowledge in various areas (which is the aim)

    I thought there were more people wanting to present than timeslots available?

    You would have to give a criteria/reason for choosing people to present next year AND make that reason public AND advertise it out to all students for next year. Having a show this year doesn't automatically equal a show next year. What I am getting from your post, it was first come first served this year (no criteria to present). So the same criteria should apply for next year (other wise you are not allowing new people join and are catering for the same people to beef up their personal CVs).

    It's interesting to note that positions on the board have been filled, but applications don't close until the 23rd of April (source). That's 1 third of the board non-democraticly elected who have votes (I highly doubt ye would be contested but it's still no reason to throw away the democratic process).

    I thought the idea of ULFM was to give people experience with the radio? How can you require some people to have skills and others not to have skills? Does anybody on the ULFM board have a qualification in the area they deal with?


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,465 ✭✭✭highlydebased


    reunion wrote: »
    I thought there were more people wanting to present than timeslots available?

    You would have to give a criteria/reason for choosing people to present next year AND make that reason public AND advertise it out to all students for next year. Having a show this year doesn't automatically equal a show next year. What I am getting from your post, it was first come first served this year (no criteria to present). So the same criteria should apply for next year (other wise you are not allowing new people join and are catering for the same people to beef up their personal CVs).

    It's interesting to note that positions on the board have been filled, but applications don't close until the 23rd of April (source). That's 1 third of the board non-democraticly elected who have votes (I highly doubt ye would be contested but it's still no reason to throw away the democratic process).

    I thought the idea of ULFM was to give people experience with the radio? How can you require some people to have skills and others not to have skills? Does anybody on the ULFM board have a qualification in the area they deal with?

    There were more applications than slots. Basically a schedule was devised with suitable show types at suitable times e.g morning talk 11-1, specialist music 7pm onward with a theme for each day etc...and basically applications were submitted for each individual slot time (i.e this is what we would do if we had this slot...). It certainly wasn't first come first served. I'd say at least half of those there now are due to graduate so there won't be a shortage of new blood. It worked out much better than first semester where a schedule was just put together for the sake of having one there (which, admittedly, might have been first come first serve).

    It seems logical enough to have those running it holding some skill/experience. As regard the board having qualifications, yes, some do, other than that there is quite a culmination of experience.


  • Registered Users Posts: 256 ✭✭CJKeane


    reunion wrote: »
    Does anybody on the ULFM board have a qualification in the area they deal with?

    I do.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,334 ✭✭✭reunion


    CJKeane wrote: »
    I do.

    It would be nice to see some of the skills/experience on the ULFM site. At the moment, I just see names, some of which (maybe all, haven't checked) have shows.

    So the arguement of requiring experience seems to be we are on the board, we have experience therefore those of us who aren't graduation/going on coop are on the board next year. Again I don't think anyone would run against anyone on the board, however, that doesn't mean it shouldn't be open to nominations and the democratic process ignored. Technical manager isn't even a position currently! How can that position be filled before the nominations close (technical director is a position currently)?

    The shows should be up for the same renewal next year then? What happened/happens when there were 2 shows that wanted the classical music hour? How did ye determine which presenter got the show?

    Is there a review of shows? Like if a criteria of an average of 50 listeners were required or else the show would be up for review/scrapped? Would encourage promotion from the presenters which would be extremely more effective.


  • Registered Users Posts: 339 ✭✭roro1neil0


    CJKeane wrote: »
    I do.

    which is?


  • Registered Users Posts: 339 ✭✭roro1neil0


    reunion wrote: »
    Is there a review of shows? Like if a criteria of an average of 50 listeners were required or else the show would be up for review/scrapped? Would encourage promotion from the presenters which would be extremely more effective.

    criterion is the singular of criteria.

    i think an avg of 5 would be more realistic. hardly any shows get more than 10 show for any length of time


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  • Registered Users Posts: 256 ✭✭CJKeane


    roro1neil0 wrote: »
    which is?

    I hold a City & Guilds diploma awarded by FAS through my time in the Radio Kerry 40 week (full-time) training course I attended in 2008. Since then I have been freelancing throughout the country for such radio stations as i102-104, i105-107, iRadio, KCLR, and Radio Kerry itself. My main area of expertise is creative audio production for advertisements and also for the audio branding of stations.

    I also believe I have enough relevant on-air, news production, and station managerial experience to deem me qualified to help run a student radio station. I have been a member of the board since the beginning of August 2011 after I submitted my CV to the CO.

    -CJ


  • Registered Users Posts: 339 ✭✭roro1neil0


    CJKeane wrote: »
    I hold a City & Guilds diploma awarded by FAS through my time in the Radio Kerry 40 week (full-time) training course I attended in 2008. Since then I have been freelancing throughout the country for such radio stations as i102-104, i105-107, iRadio, KCLR, and Radio Kerry itself. My main area of expertise is creative audio production for advertisements and also for the audio branding of stations.

    I also believe I have enough relevant on-air, news production, and station managerial experience to deem me qualified to help run a student radio station. I have been a member of the board since the beginning of August 2011 after I submitted my CV to the CO.

    -CJ

    sound a little overqualified to me


  • Registered Users Posts: 256 ✭✭CJKeane


    roro1neil0 wrote: »
    sound a little overqualified to me

    You were the one who asked. I heard about the station and decided to offer up my experience. IMHO one can't be too qualified to run a student radio station. My experience with ULFM has been some of the most challenging of my time in the industry. It's not an easy feat to try and get a large group of enthusiasts to the level at which they would be confident enough to present their own shows for the first time! As we keep saying, it's a STUDENT radio station. If you have a problem with the quality of output then maybe you should quit trolling and tune into Spin SW instead, that's the beauty of radio - you can always change the station. We're doing the best we can all while providing actual experience to these students who WANT to be here.

    -CJ


  • Registered Users Posts: 339 ✭✭roro1neil0


    very bitter there CJ. It's not my fault radio is a peri-extinct animal and no one listens to ULFM.

    But i'm glad it's a nice vehicle for you to bolster your cv. Don't know why you're calling me a troll, just telling you as it is.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,088 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    You're definitely trolling now.
    Do it again and you'll take a break.


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