Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Cost of setting up a website.

245

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,386 ✭✭✭EKRIUQ


    I think its good that web designer’s come one here to defend their occupation, and if I was one I would too, maybe they should be arguing they give support and feedback and will work with the customer as their main selling point instead of undermining their competition here or worldwide

    It’s easy to say
    good design has value, and design is a concept that most people who have posted here seem to have missed

    Design is subjective and open to criticism I might think Andy Warhole’s work is rubbish but then I’ll have an artist saying I don’t understand the value of the work.

    To me one of the most important things is usability and content and that it serves the purpose that the website is intended. As for bespoke design, boards.ie looks the same as thousands other bulletin boards with a bit of branding at the top but what makes it successful is its content and ease of use.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,538 ✭✭✭niceirishfella


    SO you have all your mates (who you have waiting in the wings)with "vested interests" are poised to be pedantic and pick and poke at examples...........errrrmmmmm no thanks......i know what i know, and ye are not fooling anyone......

    The Games UP!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 467 ✭✭nikimere


    Forget your local butcher! You can get a chicken half the price in India!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭Adam


    heggie wrote: »
    An example of a sub 500 euro website. either one of your own, or outsourced, or whatever
    Ok, www.discoroyale.net. $70. Argue with that.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,879 ✭✭✭heggie


    niceirishfella, your contributing nothing,
    to BingoBongo, your right about boards, boards uses a template that was DESIGNED with usability and content in mind. In many cases there is no point re-inventing the wheel. Boards was designed, not specifically for boards.ie, but it was designed.

    A common misconception is that design is subjective, largely it's not. Good design techniques are based on understanding of eye paths, typography, grid systems etc.

    Any Warhole is Art. Art is not Design. Art is subjective, design is not for the most part.

    It's interesting to see that you view usability as separate from design, web design should include visual elements, information architecture and usability among other factors.


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭Adam


    nikimere wrote: »
    Forget your local butcher! You can get a chicken half the price in India!
    Absolutely and ridiculously out of context. You've just made yourself look silly.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,879 ✭✭✭heggie


    Mirror wrote: »
    Ok, www.discoroyale.net. $70. Argue with that.

    You could, and probably will say that for $70 its a lot of work done. It is, but imo it's $70 wasted. Its nowhere near as good as it could or should be.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭Adam


    heggie wrote: »
    You could, and probably will say that for $70 its a lot of work done. It is, but imo it's $70 wasted. Its nowhere near as good as it could or should be.
    So what would you do better, and what would the price suddenly become?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,879 ✭✭✭heggie


    I have no brief, but there is no visually appealing structure to that site. who's getting silly now?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭Adam


    heggie wrote: »
    I have no brief, but there is no visually appealing structure to that site. who's getting silly now?
    Visual appeal != design, and is therefore arguably subjective.

    I fail to see how I'm being silly though. I think arguing the absolute bargain that site is, despite it's shortcomings, is silly. Double the money. Or triple it. Pay $400 - $500 dollars and what can you get? A lot more than you would get for the same in euro.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 4,386 ✭✭✭EKRIUQ


    heggie wrote: »
    An example of a sub 500 euro website. either one of your own, or outsourced, or whatever

    www.Holidaylookers.com and www.IrishWebDesign.net

    Both mine, all they cost me was my time and a domain name for €5.95 and both on a shared hosting package so hosting is about €10 per year. I'm not looking for a review as I'm not a web designer just showing whats possible on the cheap with templates.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,538 ✭✭✭niceirishfella


    Mirror wrote: »
    So what would you do better, and what would the price suddenly become?


    Heggies (and his cartel) price would be circa €950?

    ohhhh, and dont forget the VAT!:eek:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭Adam


    It's all horribly elitist.

    And one thing that bugs me somewhat is the fact that heggie, for all his nay saying and general strutting around these parts, has never to my knowledge put any of his work under the boards eye. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I remember thinking that a long time ago.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,538 ✭✭✭niceirishfella


    heggie wrote: »
    You could, and probably will say that for $70 its a lot of work done. It is, but imo it's $70 wasted. Its nowhere near as good as it could or should be.


    Heggie, FFS, with this comment re; the disco site, you are contributing nothing!

    You just dont get it. This guy has a good functional website for his mobile disco business. He does not need it to FLASH this, and Fancy that.......he will not get anymore business that way. For his money, he got what he needs and to me, it looks good.

    And thats it.............your arguement is in tatters here.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 18,163 ✭✭✭✭Liam Byrne


    Mirror wrote: »
    Visual appeal != design, and is therefore arguably subjective.

    I fail to see how I'm being silly though. I think arguing the absolute bargain that site is, despite it's shortcomings, is silly. Double the money. Or triple it. Pay $400 - $500 dollars and what can you get? A lot more than you would get for the same in euro.

    Depends on what you view as its "shortcomings".

    I did a quick search for "dublin djs" and there was no sign of that site; so is it still worth paying for/having ?

    Personally, I don't like the colours/layout, but then I occasionally don't like the choices made by some of our clients, so that is, indeed, subjective.

    But you do need some chance of being found in order to make a website worthwhile.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭Adam


    Liam Byrne wrote: »
    Depends on what you view as its "shortcomings".

    I did a quick search for "dublin djs" and there was no sign of that site; so is it still worth paying for/having ?

    Personally, I don't like the colours/layout, but then I occasionally don't like the choices made by some of our clients, so that is, indeed, subjective.

    But you do need some chance of being found in order to make a website worthwhile.
    Agreed, and that was my primary thought when I mentioned shortcomings. There is absolutely no SEO gone in to that site. It's also up no more that two weeks. But if you had seen the abomination that had been there before it, it was the kind of site that would actually drive you away. I'm talking the old school center aligned text down the middle of the page, blue/purple text on black background, haphazard bad quality images, truly awful! And it wasn't optimized at all, that's for sure.

    So for $70, at least now there is a site that, while it's design may not be too appealing, actually looks relatively professional, and doesn't give off the impression that the service is just a bunch of yahoo's on dodgy desks. You know? That, to me, is well worth the price.


  • Registered Users Posts: 467 ✭✭nikimere


    This argument is stupid.
    Great you can get a template for $50 or less.

    If i were starting a business i would not skimp on image. Just like i wouldn't skimp on a good accountant.
    Buying a template means having to customise it yourself, some people cant and just shouldn't (because of lack of required skills) do that.
    If you outsource development more than likely your going to have trouble getting support, you have to deal with time differences and you also run the risk of being done-over with no door to knock on. At the end of the day, as a consumer i would prefere to deal face to face than with someone on the other side of the world, especially when it is for something that is as important as my business.

    Paying a local web dev company to design & develop a website is a worth while investment, so long as you shop around. You have to pay people for their time and time in Ireland isn't cheap, unfortunately.

    Saying that the whole industry is coming to an end because you can out-source at a cheaper rate is a stupid comment, and it just wont happen.

    If you dont mind your site looking like a few hundred (sometimes thousands) others then work away with a template. I personally wouldn't be into that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,393 ✭✭✭stooge


    @Liam Byrne -

    If you search for 'dublin disco' it is the 4th link
    If you search for 'dublin karaoke' it is the 5th link

    Good looking site, and excellent value for money. Right down the OP's street I'd imagine.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,538 ✭✭✭niceirishfella


    stooge wrote: »
    @Liam Byrne -

    If you search for 'dublin disco' it is the 4th link
    If you search for 'dublin karaoke' it is the 5th link

    Good looking site, and excellent value for money. Right down the OP's street I'd imagine.

    +1 - i agree.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭Adam


    stooge wrote: »
    @Liam Byrne -

    If you search for 'dublin disco' it is the 4th link
    If you search for 'dublin karaoke' it is the 5th link

    Good looking site, and excellent value for money. Right down the OP's street I'd imagine.
    Well look at that! :D

    The benefits of decent markup, eh?
    nikimere wrote:
    This argument is stupid.
    Great you can get a template for $50 or less.

    If i were starting a business i would not skimp on image. Just like i wouldn't skimp on a good accountant.
    Buying a template means having to customise it yourself, some people cant and just shouldn't (because of lack of required skills) do that.
    If you outsource development more than likely your going to have trouble getting support, you have to deal with time differences and you also run the risk of being done-over with no door to knock on. At the end of the day, as a consumer i would prefere to deal face to face than with someone on the other side of the world, especially when it is for something that is as important as my business.

    Paying a local web dev company to design & develop a website is a worth while investment, so long as you shop around. You have to pay people for their time and time in Ireland isn't cheap, unfortunately.

    Saying that the whole industry is coming to an end because you can out-source at a cheaper rate is a stupid comment, and it just wont happen.

    If you dont mind your site looking like a few hundred (sometimes thousands) others then work away with a template. I personally wouldn't be into that.

    Nobody said that, I am all for keeping work in Ireland, I do the job myself, though as a spare time thing. And I don't believe it is/will die in this country, I just take issue with heggies very first response to the OP, "you can't". This is absolutely false, and unfair to the OP when he's just looking for some sound advice.

    You're dead right, there are chances to be taken when outsourcing, but if you ask for advice, it is an option, and can be a complete success, or an absolute failure, but to be honest, the failure comes in to play when the client just doesn't know what they want a lot of the time, and anyone can make a mess of it then, and the client is to blame. If you're clear and concise with what you want, the whole process will probably go very smoothly.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 467 ✭✭nikimere


    your livliehood is at stake here cos people are copping on.........the game is up...........
    nikimere wrote: »
    ...Saying that the whole industry is coming to an end because you can out-source at a cheaper rate is a stupid comment, and it just wont happen.
    Mirror wrote: »
    Nobody said that...
    No in those exact words, but that's what he meant.

    Obviously i am against everything a template stands for because i am a designer/developer. If you want to do it on the cheap it is the best way to go. You'll get a reasonably professional looking site.
    I would suggest shop around Irish Web Development companies, not all are into the overpricing game. You will get a better end-product (99.99% of the time) if you can site down with your web dev company and discuss the project properly, see it evolve and guide them along the process to a finished product you can be proud of.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,393 ✭✭✭stooge


    Mirror wrote: »
    Nobody said that, I am all for keeping work in Ireland, I do the job myself, though as a spare time thing. And I don't believe it is/will die in this country, I just take issue with heggies very first response to the OP, "you can't". This is absolutely false, and unfair to the OP when he's just looking for some sound advice.

    You really can't argue with this paragragh.

    Saying 'you can't get a decent website for less than 500E' is just not true. There are decent people and decent companies doing exactly that. Why spend 1000+ on a website that may get exactly the same exposure as one that can be done for 500-?

    If the OP wants value for money then that value may lie outside ireland. Thats a fact heggie and others will have to accept. Just because someone charges more doesnt mean they'll do a better job.

    It's an interesting time in the irish economy atm and I am definitely one for keeping the money here rather than elsewhere but it boils down to being realistic about price and competitive. It you cant compete then 'get out of the kitchen'.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,467 ✭✭✭smemon


    I've no doubt if you go with an Irish company you'll get a professional product & service - no doubt.

    However most people living in the real world simply cannot afford to pay the prices. Why would we, when we can get the same job done elsewhere for half the cost or less?

    It's like flying with aerlingus paying €200 to go to london when you can get there for €80 with ryanair. Why do it unless you can afford to?

    Ok, false ecomony can come in to play, but not if you've done your homework which is what the OP is doing by posting here in fairness.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,879 ✭✭✭heggie


    right, a few people are quoting me out of context. the OP looked for a QUALITY, that's a QUALITY website for 500, and I said you can't, I stand by that and have yet to be proven wrong. This threadis a farce anyhow, last thing I'll add is that I don't think Irish web designers are any more expensive than any other countries, not sure where that perception is coming from?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 17,208 ✭✭✭✭aidan_walsh


    Quality is hugely subjective and is not something that can be quantified with a hyperlink alone.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭Adam


    heggie wrote: »
    right, a few people are quoting me out of context. the OP looked for a QUALITY, that's a QUALITY website for 500, and I said you can't, I stand by that and have yet to be proven wrong. This threadis a farce anyhow, last thing I'll add is that I don't think Irish web designers are any more expensive than any other countries, not sure where that perception is coming from?
    That's just plain ignorance.

    It is a well known and widely accepted fact that web designers outside this country can be cheaper. They live in a different country, with a less inflated economy, have a lower cost of living, and a lower average rate of pay. Ergo, they charge less.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,879 ✭✭✭heggie


    stop nitpicking, take the EU for example you know the point I was trying to make.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭Adam


    heggie wrote: »
    stop nitpicking, take the EU for example you know the point I was trying to make.
    Wrong again: http://www.finfacts.ie/costofliving.htm

    You can't be so out of touch as to think that the entirity of the EU is going be be on even par?

    On top of which, how the hell is that nitpicking, we didn't say outsource to somewhere not in the EU. Outsourcing means out of Ireland. Honestly... :rolleyes:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,879 ✭✭✭heggie


    this has turned into a farce, to point in continuing conversation


  • Advertisement
  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,866 ✭✭✭Adam


    heggie wrote: »
    this has turned into a farce, to point in continuing conversation
    I can live with that. The only farce though has been your arguments imo.


This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement