Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Please note that it is not permitted to have referral links posted in your signature. Keep these links contained in the appropriate forum. Thank you.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2055940817/signature-rules

"Scrappage boosts car sales" - how about no it doesn't?

  • 02-02-2012 12:19pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 5,540 ✭✭✭


    The SIMI would have you believe that the only reason so many cars were sold last year and the year before is because of scrappage.

    Well their own statistics for January 2012 contradict this ridiculous claim - sales are up 1.5% on the same period last year!

    A couple of things about the stats for this year that made me a little sad:

    - Alfa only sold 18 cars in January, that really saddens me now that they have that recently introduced Giulietta, a stunning looking car if ever there was one and by all accounts is the best Alfa to be introduced in a very long time. In the same period last year they sold 49 cars.

    - Subaru only sold 31 cars, down from 55 last year. They were selling an attractively priced set of diesel Legacys and Imprezas, and then out of nowhere decided to jack up the price massively.

    - VW and Audi up massively, Seat down

    On the brigher side:

    - Jaguar up by 230%, from 20 cars to 66, hopefully they'll go a good bit higher

    - Toyota still number 1 of course, but sales down 7% from last year

    - Ford up, Renault down, Nissan down slightly, Skoda up hugely

    - Two Porsches sold, one of them was a petrol Panamera in band G, so it must have been a V8 :D, although the other was a diesel Cayenne :(

    Some of the biggest changes include:

    - Seat down 46%
    - Fiat down 55% to only 120 cars
    - Chevrolet down from 123 cars last year to only nine this year:eek:
    - 51.9% of cars sold are in the €160 tax bracket, and another 40.5% of cars were in the €225 tax bracket, so 92.4% of 12 reg cars are in VRT bands A or B

    Diesel now accounts for 73% of the market, lots of money to be made by garages with DMF, DPF and EGR valve failures in the longer run methinks! Many people are choosing diesel because it's now the fashionable thing to do without thinking about the potentially very expensive consequences of doing so. A massive surge in demand for hybrid and flexi-fuel cars, but these are coming from a very low base. Hybrids still have only 1% of the market.

    Sales down in Dublin, Wexford, Louth, Leitrim, Waterford and Kilkenny, unchanged in Cavan, and up elsewhere.

    Full list here:
    http://www.beepbeep.ie/stats?sYear%5B%5D=2012&sYear%5B%5D=2011&sRegType=1&sMonth%5B%5D=&sMonth%5B%5D=1&x=29&y=19


Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,985 ✭✭✭✭dgt


    Scrappage destroyed the 2nd hand market imo. A lot of good taxed and tested cars unnecessarily ended up in yards :mad:


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,575 ✭✭✭166man


    As regards Alfa selling only 18 cars in January, I mean they are now only making the Mito and Giuietta, and the Mito is still quite a rare car on Irish roads. So they really only have one car to sell now that production of the 159 has stopped. It's very poor tbh, only having two cars on the market.

    @Alfa we need the up and coming Giulia faster lads!:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,025 ✭✭✭✭-Corkie-


    I cannot believe Fiat have done so badly.


  • Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    -Corkie- wrote: »
    I cannot believe Fiat have done so badly.

    Are they doing much advertising? I just had a think and I'm only aware that they sell the 500, presumably still the Punto too? Coudlnt name the rest of their range. I'd be able to name the majority of the range of most manufacturers off the top of my head. I dorecall hearing plaenty of ads for their vans alright.

    EDIT Just went to the site, completely forgot they were still selling the Panda, actually didnt know there was a current Bravo. Never heard of a Qubo.


  • Posts: 23,339 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    ................

    A couple of things about the stats for this year that made me a little sad:

    ......................

    - VW and Audi up massively, Seat down

    On the brigher side:.....................

    - Ford up, Renault down, Nissan down slightly, Skoda up hugely

    ....................


    Out of curiosity, why is VW and Audi sales up saddening for you while Ford and Skoda also being up being a positive?


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 2,000 ✭✭✭Cionád


    -Corkie- wrote: »
    I cannot believe Fiat have done so badly.

    They were very competitive under scrappage, starting at 6,995 for a panda, and 9,995 for the fiat 500.

    Up until this week the panda was 9,995 (it's now down to 8,500 with an ecoBonus) and the fiat 500 is 12,895.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,238 ✭✭✭Ardennes1944


    Opel is down....not that anyone cares :o


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,907 ✭✭✭✭Kristopherus


    Big ad from Renault in yesterdays rags. €3500 off any Fluence & Megane bought by next Saturday. Plus your trade-in if you have one. Not a bad deal imo. Will be interesting to see if it improves the Feb figures.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,773 ✭✭✭mailforkev


    There's a few surprises in that list.

    61 RR Evoques is pretty good going for a fairly niche 40k and beyond motor.

    Only 20 BMW 3 series, wonder who the 20 were thant couldn't wait til Feb. The 520d seems to have almost wiped out the 3 anyway.

    362 VW (Passat) CCs is way higher than I would have thought, is more than the Mondeo.

    Also 242 VW Golf cabrios. Surely that can't be right? I live and work in their prime stomping ground and the only one I've seen is in the window of Grange Motors.


  • Registered Users Posts: 22,080 ✭✭✭✭Big Nasty


    mailforkev wrote: »
    Only 20 BMW 3 series, wonder who the 20 were thant couldn't wait til Feb. The 520d seems to have almost wiped out the 3 anyway.

    I don't see the point in buying a 3er over a 5er unless you're going for a coupe.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 22,818 ✭✭✭✭Anan1


    mailforkev wrote: »
    There's a few surprises in that list.

    61 RR Evoques is pretty good going for a fairly niche 40k and beyond motor.
    I've only seen two and both were on loan to c-listers - I wonder how many were actually sold.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,921 ✭✭✭Gophur


    The SIMI would have you believe that the only reason so many cars were sold last year and the year before is because of scrappage.

    ..........

    I had to stop after this, because it is just not true.

    The number of cars sold on the scrappage scheme is well documented. How many of them would have been sold if the scheme didn't exist? We'll never know, but, if you look at 2009 sales figures, the market clearly needed an impetus of some sort.

    The scrappage scheme was, at worst, self-financing, so there's no need to be crying about subsidies or grants etc. It got people spending money. It got the stigma of having a new car out of the way.


  • Posts: 23,339 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    Gophur wrote: »
    ............. It got the stigma of having a new car out of the way.

    I think this stigma people speak of wasn't at all prevalent really. The changes in motor tax rates had more of an effect than scrappage I think. The motor tax rates allowed folk to buy into the logic that by changing they were being prudent with their cash.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭creedp


    RoverJames wrote: »
    I think this stigma people speak of wasn't at all prevalent really. The changes in motor tax rates had more of an effect than scrappage I think. The motor tax rates allowed folk to buy into the logic that by changing they were being prudent with their cash.

    I'd agree, the stigma thing is a bit overdone. If stigma was so important then why is the BMW 520d/A4/A6/Passat CC/etc/etc so popular. Having said that many people did 'buy into' the scrappage story in the deluded view that depreciation wasn't a factor. I can never understand why someone driving a 10 year old banger would continue to do so if they could actually afford a brand new car minus scrappage. Would they not have upgraded to something more decent? In the end of the day probably scrappage contibuted to an reasonable increase in teh sale lower priced cars and if you are green minded you would be delighted as all these people are now driving around in CO2 friendly cars and saving the world. Of course independent garages have less work and employment and the scrapped cars are just that scrapped and wasted .. but whatever floats your boat!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,773 ✭✭✭mailforkev


    Gophur wrote: »
    It got the stigma of having a new car out of the way.

    That stigma is well and truly gone around here, in a 2 min stroll to the shop I just saw four 12-Ds; Lexus RXh, LR Disco, 640d cabrio and the only reasonably priced one, a VW caddy.

    The standard of new car deffo seems higher than previous years, looks like a higher proportion of fancy motors versus "regular" stuff.


  • Posts: 23,339 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    creedp wrote: »
    ................ I can never understand why someone driving a 10 year old banger would continue to do so if they could actually afford a brand new car minus scrappage. Would they not have upgraded to something more decent?....................

    I've only driven old stuff tbh, I can never understand why folks are happy to spend €20,000 to €40,000 + on a car :)

    My folks availed of the first scrappage scheme back in the 90s, they scrapped an 85 Ritmo and bought a 1996 Hyundai Accent, they traded that 3 years later for a 1999 Accent which Dad still has, it's now a 13 year old "banger" and he has no intention of changing it despite having a few quid and modest enough outgoings.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,662 ✭✭✭Voodoomelon


    Anan1 wrote: »
    I've only seen two and both were on loan to c-listers - I wonder how many were actually sold.

    They put a lot of effort into building the hype around the car, wouldn't surprise me if 60 people ran out and got them in January. I've seen two in the last week in Louth of all places (sizewise).


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭creedp


    RoverJames wrote: »
    I've only driven old stuff tbh, I can never understand why folks are happy to spend €20,000 to €40,000 + on a car :)

    My folks availed of the first scrappage scheme back in the 90s, they scrapped an 85 Ritmo and bought a 1996 Hyundai Accent, they traded that 3 years later for a 1999 Accent which Dad still has, it's now a 13 year old "banger" and he has no intention of changing it despite having a few quid and modest enough outgoings.


    I've never bought a new car either .. normally 3-4 year old. Couldn't afford or justify anything newer Im afraid. The point I was making I suppose is related the constant claimed imaginery power of scrappage to get people to part with wads of cash that they didn't seem to have previously to buy a new car. Pretty persuasive character that scrappage lad - pity the same skills set wasn't used with the troika!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 51,060 ✭✭✭✭bazz26


    RoverJames wrote: »
    I've only driven old stuff tbh, I can never understand why folks are happy to spend €20,000 to €40,000 + on a car :)

    My folks availed of the first scrappage scheme back in the 90s, they scrapped an 85 Ritmo and bought a 1996 Hyundai Accent, they traded that 3 years later for a 1999 Accent which Dad still has, it's now a 13 year old "banger" and he has no intention of changing it despite having a few quid and modest enough outgoings.

    If people were not paying €20k to €40k on a car then eventually there would be no old stuff for you or anyone else to buy. These people are also contributing towards the economy via VAT/VRT intake and making expensive new cars affordable for others a few years down the road. They are also slowing down the Government from getting VRT/VAT shortfalls from everyone via increased income tax, so I salute them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 73,365 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    mailforkev wrote: »
    There's a few surprises in that list.


    362 VW (Passat) CCs is way higher than I would have thought, is more than the Mondeo.

    Also 242 VW Golf cabrios. Surely that can't be right?

    Passat cc is a misprint, there were only 20 passat estates sold just as a reference, and saloon not mentioned


  • Advertisement
  • Posts: 23,339 ✭✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    bazz26 wrote: »
    If people were not paying €20k to €40k on a car then eventually there would be no old stuff for you or anyone else to buy. ............

    I'm well aware of that, cheers anyway :pac:

    My comments were in response to ........"I can never understand why someone driving a 10 year old banger would continue to do so if they could actually afford a brand new car minus scrappage. Would they not have upgraded to something more decent? "


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,473 ✭✭✭creedp


    bazz26 wrote: »
    If people were not paying €20k to €40k on a car then eventually there would be no old stuff for you or anyone else to buy. These people are also contributing towards the economy via VAT/VRT intake and making expensive new cars affordable for others a few years down the road. They are also slowing down the Government from getting VRT/VAT shortfalls from everyone via increased income tax, so I salute them.


    So long as they just don't buy corolla's, micras, Jokes, etc


  • Registered Users Posts: 51,060 ✭✭✭✭bazz26


    RoverJames wrote: »
    I'm well aware of that, cheers anyway :pac:

    My comments were in response to ........"I can never understand why someone driving a 10 year old banger would continue to do so if they could actually afford a brand new car minus scrappage. Would they not have upgraded to something more decent? "

    Ah right ok, in that context.


  • Registered Users Posts: 11,434 ✭✭✭✭For Forks Sake


    -Corkie- wrote: »
    I cannot believe Fiat have done so badly.

    Just for a quick point, your small family car (C1) accounted for over 25% of cars registered. Fiat have nothing on offer in this segment, I was surprised to still see the Bravo listed on their website, so by not having any model, they're not competing..on the plus side at least no-one's registered a f*cking Tiida either.
    Rank Make Make / Range 2012 Units 2012 % Share
    1 Ford FOCUS 1,281 20.35%
    2 Nissan QASHQAI 729 11.58%
    3 Skoda OCTAVIA 651 10.34%
    4 Toyota COROLLA 644 10.23%
    5 Volkswagen GOLF 596 9.47%
    6 Toyota AURIS 571 9.07%
    7 Renault FLUENCE 446 7.08%
    8 Renault MEGANE 439 6.97%
    9 GM(Opel) ASTRA 391 6.21%
    10 Volkswagen JETTA 282 4.48%
    11 Mazda MAZDA3 150 2.38%
    12 Citroen C4 115 1.83%


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,724 ✭✭✭Dilbert75


    Of the first 6 12-reg cars I saw this year, 5 were VW's and the other was a Seat. Really noticeable. It also seems that the class of car being bought this car is different from last year - bigger & more expensive.

    Really sad to see the further fall in Alfa sales - I wonder is that the reason for, or is it caused by, the progressive shrinking of the dealer network? The sooner the new Giulia comes the better.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,096 ✭✭✭johnos1984


    I think Alfa and Fiat must be regretting down sizing the dealer network. Very few people have access to a dealer now and a lot of people won't travel further than their nearest dealer to buy


  • Registered Users Posts: 73,365 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    Dilbert75 wrote: »
    Of the first 6 12-reg cars I saw this year, 5 were VW's and the other was a Seat. Really noticeable. It also seems that the class of car being bought this car is different from last year - bigger & more expensive.


    VW bank may be a factor.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,452 ✭✭✭Icepick


    Skoda, Hyundai and Kia are big winners.


Advertisement